And are we applying standards of what we got for $1200 twenty years ago to what we're paying $1200 today. (Just picking a price point for an example. $1200 in 2000 is about $1800 today)
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Are cheap bass expectations too high?
- Thread starter MultiScaleMale
- Start date
Good question. In general, I think you get more instrument now than you did even 10 years ago at any price point. I also don’t think $1,200 today is any less expensive of a price point today than it was 10 years ago. I get it; we want to factor in inflation, but $1,200 is still a nice chunk of change and I would expect a quality instrument.
Inexpensive basses are now, on average, higher quality than they've ever been before, especially in the sub-$1000 range.
As technology advances, quality goes up and price / cost goes down. My first 4 function calculator cost ~$60 (?) 45 years ago.
Riis
Riis
I think this about the most you can say. I see hyperbolic terms like spectacular and fantastic get thrown around all the time in regards to cheap basses. Yes, they are much much better than in the 70s when I started playing, but not spectacular in terms of what is available today.
That applies to electronics primarily. The biggest change in instruments is the use of CNC machines where pin routers were previously used.
much higher percentage of the low end is better, I'd think
buldog5151bass
Kibble, milkbones, and P Basses. And redheads.
I think quality (at least initial quality) has improved significantly on inexpensive basses. More expensive ones, about the same.
Are cheap bass expectations too high?
i voted "yes" --- but i'm sure it applies to others, not necessarily myself.
"build quality" is a fantasy after a certain point, and the more money you pay for an EB the more you are likely to think that you are in possession of something priceless = so after a certain point of basic quality(s) you're paying for the "pricelessness" you can conjure in your own mind.
per the OP: like many others have already said, "it's a great time to be a bass player!" and if you don't have much money = so what?
i voted "yes" --- but i'm sure it applies to others, not necessarily myself.
"build quality" is a fantasy after a certain point, and the more money you pay for an EB the more you are likely to think that you are in possession of something priceless = so after a certain point of basic quality(s) you're paying for the "pricelessness" you can conjure in your own mind.
per the OP: like many others have already said, "it's a great time to be a bass player!" and if you don't have much money = so what?
Interesting question. It would be fascinating to be able to plot data points on this if the research was even available. I realize the $1,200 figure was chosen somewhat arbitrarily, but from a consumer standpoint, value is a rather strange beast. I can still recall the first time I saw an Ibanez bass with an MSRP of four figures, and thought: "Wait a second...What?"
I don't think they are too high. Especially when you use the word 1200 and cheap in the same sentence.
For 1200, you better believe I expect a near perfect instrument.
I can forgive some flaws in 200 to 300 dollar basses.
I can forgive some minor things in 400 to 500 dollar basses.
Frankly, after that, I expect a fine build, and at 1200, I expect a near perfect build.
Manufacturers who can't keep up with those lines these days won't have many happy owners.
For 1200, you better believe I expect a near perfect instrument.
I can forgive some flaws in 200 to 300 dollar basses.
I can forgive some minor things in 400 to 500 dollar basses.
Frankly, after that, I expect a fine build, and at 1200, I expect a near perfect build.
Manufacturers who can't keep up with those lines these days won't have many happy owners.
I don't think of $1200 as "cheap" for a bass.
As with many items, I believe that when it comes to mass-produced goods like instruments, quality has gone way up and price has dropped over the past 20-30 years. Automation, computer-aided design, CNC milling, better supply chains, cheaper transport, offshoring production, even cheap credit has all contributed to that.
IMO these days, you start to hit diminishing returns with instruments at the $700-800 price point. I don't think you would have said that about a $475 bass in 2000.
Some basses and guitars are better for the money than others. But despite the wood resource concerns a new bass at your price point is really good. You can get a very nice Sire for the exact same dollars a Ray cost in the ‘80’s. Controlling for Fenders which are pretty similar today as 60 years ago, I think the overall value for the cost has improved in our market.
I think your definition of cheap is too high by an order of magnitude.
And so it goes.....
My brother bought the very first BetaMax when they came out in the early 70s.... It was the size of a samsonite suitcase and cost $1100.00.
10 years later you could buy a VHS for $25.
10 years ago my 40 inch non-smart flat screen was $600.00. Now a similar model is $125.
Today's "cheap" basses are MILES better than the junk I remember.
They are what they are...but
I would have KILLED for a Squier back when a Teisco was it's equivalent.
My brother bought the very first BetaMax when they came out in the early 70s.... It was the size of a samsonite suitcase and cost $1100.00.
10 years later you could buy a VHS for $25.
10 years ago my 40 inch non-smart flat screen was $600.00. Now a similar model is $125.
Today's "cheap" basses are MILES better than the junk I remember.
They are what they are...but
I would have KILLED for a Squier back when a Teisco was it's equivalent.
Using CNC for critical operations such as routing the all important neck pocket has done its part to drastically level the playing field while containing (and often lowering) manufacturing costs. And PLEK is starting to do the same with fretwork. It’s only the relative rarity of the device and the fact it’s only obtainable from one source that’s keeping the price for the service where it is right now. But that will likely change in a few more years.
I agree expectations are rising. But I think it’s partly because players are a lot more sophisticated about and in tune with technology than they previously were. They expect more for less money because they know it’s not only possible - it’s doable.
I agree expectations are rising. But I think it’s partly because players are a lot more sophisticated about and in tune with technology than they previously were. They expect more for less money because they know it’s not only possible - it’s doable.
I ordered an Ibanez short scale 5 string today for $250. 30 years ago I would not touch a $250 bass, with good reason. Now I am expecting it to be quite good. Even paying Sweetwater to do set up and install better strings. Times have changed.
I think to some degree our idea of what something *should* cost gets stuck in the past somewhere. It adjusts, but never completely catches up to today. If the last time you priced a bass was in 2020 at $1200 and looked to price one again, you might expect it to go up 1 or 2 hundred dollars. But that's not close to inflation over those years.
In my opinion, it depends a great deal on the brand.
I still see a fair amount of grumbling about the QC on the “less expensive” (not cheap) Fender lines (specifically, but not exclusively the MIM lines) but see glowing reports on some the Squires (especially the CV line). Is this because the Squires really are better than the MIM Fenders? Could be, the newer production Squires are probably produced on newer CNC machines with newer software than the MIM basses due to the establishment of new production lines (maybe), or simply the Indonesian workers are doing a better job for less pay than their Mexican counterparts. I don’t know.
I think a lot of it is that when folks pay the extra for a Fender sticker on the headstock, their expectations change, rightly so. I seldom hear folks talking about playing “every Squier on the wall” to find a “good” one, but hear it all the time Re: less expensive Fenders. Is that due to expectations or actual QC issues? Again, I don’t know.
Based on what I see, Sire is leading the way in making quality “less expensive” instruments that appear to be making their owner pretty happy and feeling like they got a good deal, so there is evidence out there that “some” of the “less expensive” instruments are indeed better than twenty years ago, which should be the case due to improved manufacturing processes.
Not sure that is the case with some of the more established brands.
I still see a fair amount of grumbling about the QC on the “less expensive” (not cheap) Fender lines (specifically, but not exclusively the MIM lines) but see glowing reports on some the Squires (especially the CV line). Is this because the Squires really are better than the MIM Fenders? Could be, the newer production Squires are probably produced on newer CNC machines with newer software than the MIM basses due to the establishment of new production lines (maybe), or simply the Indonesian workers are doing a better job for less pay than their Mexican counterparts. I don’t know.
I think a lot of it is that when folks pay the extra for a Fender sticker on the headstock, their expectations change, rightly so. I seldom hear folks talking about playing “every Squier on the wall” to find a “good” one, but hear it all the time Re: less expensive Fenders. Is that due to expectations or actual QC issues? Again, I don’t know.
Based on what I see, Sire is leading the way in making quality “less expensive” instruments that appear to be making their owner pretty happy and feeling like they got a good deal, so there is evidence out there that “some” of the “less expensive” instruments are indeed better than twenty years ago, which should be the case due to improved manufacturing processes.
Not sure that is the case with some of the more established brands.
