I’m not saying $1200 is cheap. Cheap basses was one sentence. $1200 the next. Anyways, back to the gig.
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Are cheap bass expectations too high?
- Thread starter MultiScaleMale
- Start date
I mean, $1200 is a mortgage payment for most people. Not exactly cheap.
when I hear people say the current squier is phenomenal, I usually assume they mean phenomenal for a sub $500 bass. I think the gap between $500 and $1200 as far as quality goes, has shrank significantly since I started playing in the mid-90s
when I hear people say the current squier is phenomenal, I usually assume they mean phenomenal for a sub $500 bass. I think the gap between $500 and $1200 as far as quality goes, has shrank significantly since I started playing in the mid-90s
Certainly my expectations for a cheap bass are way, way higher now. When I started playing thirty years ago, a cheap instrument was something like an El Degas made of pot metal and plywood that was basically unplayable junk. Now you can get a Glarry or Harley Benton for half the money and it’s perfectly serviceable.
No, not really. Main difference is the finish. My cheap bass stays in tune like my more expensive one. Both have a maple neck. My cheap bass may not have a name stamped on the tuner, but stays in tune. Sound? They sound different. Trust me, expensive basses don't have super secret volume pots,
& caps, connecting wire from NASA, pickup magnets from some deep diamond mine in South America. Most of the parts come from a couple of suppliers other than the pickups.
My older brother had a ~1975 Fender Jazz he purchased new for ~$400. That's ~$2000 today. The neck didn't fit the pocket. Electronic problems too.
I have an Ibanez TMB100 Talman I brought new for ~$200. It's flawless. Sounds and feels great. That $200 today is worth ~$ 40 in 1975. What unplayable bass could you buy for that back then?
It's a good time to be a bass player.
I have an Ibanez TMB100 Talman I brought new for ~$200. It's flawless. Sounds and feels great. That $200 today is worth ~$ 40 in 1975. What unplayable bass could you buy for that back then?
It's a good time to be a bass player.
I think the best value is in the $500-800 range, currently. There are lots of exceptions, of course.
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Others have said it, but I can't even begin to imagine a $1200 bass as being a cheap bass. Especially seeing this on TB, where my first assumption is that we're talking USD. $1200 USD is on the neighborhood of $1500-1600 CAD, which in my mind is not cheap, or even moderate price; that's straight up expensive.
A $1600 CAD bass should be near perfect in terms of fit and finish.
A $1600 CAD bass should be near perfect in terms of fit and finish.
We are living in the golden age of gear, for sure. You can get a very playable instrument for $300 brand new, and if you like it, it's actually made well enough that it's worthy of investing in upgrades. And, you know, I just spent close to $1,200 on a bass and $400 on an amp, about a year ago, and i feel like I just hit the jackpot. I've been playing my whole life, I can't believe the quality and diversity of stuff that's available and affordable right now.
We live in an age where you could get a pretty good bass for under $200 these days. That's crazy when you account for inflation rates and cost of living.
The reason why it's possible is in my opinion due to three words.
Indonesia, China and now Vietnam.
Back in the 70s, labor was cheaper in Japan so Japanese made instruments could be made inexpensively and made rather well for the price, in some cases the copies they were making were of such good quality, they could compete with US made instruments. When labor costs jumped in Japan, production shifted to S. Korea. Some instruments of course are still made there today, but labor costs are on the rise there these days so in the example of Cort, they've moved production to Indonesia and China. Cost of living is very low in Indonesia, I lived in that part of the world for many years, and have been to Indonesia and Vietnam, you'd be surprised at how low a comfortable living wage is in those places.
The quality of craftsmanship in Indonesia can potentially rival those of American made guitars if given the green light and the chance to as Indonesians are expert woodcrafters - it's just that they're given a certain quality standard to follow, to well, not make them so well so as not to compete with US made versions of the brand, and also to keep production costs as low as possible. So in sticking within these parameters, they can still make them very well and churn them out to meet the demands - which is why we have come to have a certain level of expectation even for the most inexpensive basses these days.
The reason why it's possible is in my opinion due to three words.
Indonesia, China and now Vietnam.
Back in the 70s, labor was cheaper in Japan so Japanese made instruments could be made inexpensively and made rather well for the price, in some cases the copies they were making were of such good quality, they could compete with US made instruments. When labor costs jumped in Japan, production shifted to S. Korea. Some instruments of course are still made there today, but labor costs are on the rise there these days so in the example of Cort, they've moved production to Indonesia and China. Cost of living is very low in Indonesia, I lived in that part of the world for many years, and have been to Indonesia and Vietnam, you'd be surprised at how low a comfortable living wage is in those places.
The quality of craftsmanship in Indonesia can potentially rival those of American made guitars if given the green light and the chance to as Indonesians are expert woodcrafters - it's just that they're given a certain quality standard to follow, to well, not make them so well so as not to compete with US made versions of the brand, and also to keep production costs as low as possible. So in sticking within these parameters, they can still make them very well and churn them out to meet the demands - which is why we have come to have a certain level of expectation even for the most inexpensive basses these days.
The improvement of quality of the lower-priced gear has certainly brought more bassists into the fold. You can actually get satisfying sound and playability for about $600, and in the hands of a real pro, it can be hard to guess the price of a $600 bass with upgraded electronics and proper set-up, without looking at the headstock. Expectations too high? Nah! For most bassists, it's not the "cheap" bass holding them back. And because the barrier to entry is now lower, there are a lot more bassists, many of whom are giving their "cheap" basses a bad reputation, not from the lack of quality of the cheap bass, but from the lack of quality of the player. That player that shows up for the pit show and can't friggin' read the book? That guy that sits in for the combo gig who can't do "Misty" without tuning down? That guy that needs two weeks to learn a set and extra rehearsals, and that's only if they're not working full time at the ice cream shop? The guy who can't transpose a country or folk or gospel song at the request of the singer and do it with a smile? The guy who can't do the previous even with the Nashville numbers scribbled on a napkin, passed to him by a bandmate who took pity? The guy who can't read a lead sheet they have never seen before? The guy who doesn't know the first thing about EQ and gets a sh*tty sound? The guy who doesn't have the technique to play four quarter notes in a row with consistent articulation and sustain? The guy who doesn't know they're not playing with the drummer? The guy whose technique flails around so much that there's just as much noise as there is tone? The guy who tunes to A440 and cant' hear that it's out of tune with the violinist who tuned to A442? Yeah, all these people showed up with their "cheap" basses because the barrier to entry is lower, regardless of the workmanship of modern cheap basses. It doesn't cost much to be a bass player, nowadays. So now there are more of them, but they all show up on their inexpensive basses, and the additional wannabes make today's $600 basses sound worse than they really are. If someone is un-satisfied with their "cheap" bass, they should first look to themselves first, to see if they're the ones that sound "cheap" before thinking it's the bass. The OP should instead be asking if our expectations of the player are not high enough . . . but that's not good for the music merchandise business.
I have Fenders, and Squiers. The V.M. and C.V. lines are equal to the standard Fender.
Remember, the American Fenders are an ‘updated’ version of their classic basses.
(Bound fretboards, active pups, highmass bridges, graphite reinforced necks).
Not that anything’s wrong with that. There’s a reason they do it.
But, for a guy like me, who wants a traditional Fender bass, the standard is The Standard.
V.M.’s, and C.V.’s are just Standards, but w/o the color, and fretboard choice.
That’s how they keep costs down. The bridge on a Standard, is the same bridge on the
Squiers. Same tuners, electronics etc. Some of the C.V.’s had custom pups.
P.S. - No matter what I buy, Fender, or Squier, I always put in CTS pots and an Orange Drop
cap.
Remember, the American Fenders are an ‘updated’ version of their classic basses.
(Bound fretboards, active pups, highmass bridges, graphite reinforced necks).
Not that anything’s wrong with that. There’s a reason they do it.
But, for a guy like me, who wants a traditional Fender bass, the standard is The Standard.
V.M.’s, and C.V.’s are just Standards, but w/o the color, and fretboard choice.
That’s how they keep costs down. The bridge on a Standard, is the same bridge on the
Squiers. Same tuners, electronics etc. Some of the C.V.’s had custom pups.
P.S. - No matter what I buy, Fender, or Squier, I always put in CTS pots and an Orange Drop
cap.
I noticed this a few years ago with drums. When I was growing up in the 70s and 80s inexpensive drums were generally poor quality. Now, you can get a very decent, tuneable, playable drum set for well under a thousand dollars (excluding cymbals, but including hardware), which is pretty good.
As far as basses, recently I got a $550 Spector Legend Standard bass and was really impressed with what I got for the money. I literally took the bass apart and went over everything with a magnifying glass and found no flaws. None. The routs were cut sharp and perfect, the frets were dressed, it is perfectly balanced - in short, aside from the noticeably cheaper electronics, the bass is flawless. And as far as sound, it sounds great. I'd easily say that it's quality and sound is far and above a $550 bass. I did a YouTube review of the bass (Spector Legend Bass Detailed Review) and, aside from the wiring mess found it to be comparable to a $1000 -$1200 bass. I have no plans now to change out the pickups or wiring, but adding decent p'ups and an Audere preamp might be in the future. Either way, the bass is a keeper and hits well above its price range.
As far as basses, recently I got a $550 Spector Legend Standard bass and was really impressed with what I got for the money. I literally took the bass apart and went over everything with a magnifying glass and found no flaws. None. The routs were cut sharp and perfect, the frets were dressed, it is perfectly balanced - in short, aside from the noticeably cheaper electronics, the bass is flawless. And as far as sound, it sounds great. I'd easily say that it's quality and sound is far and above a $550 bass. I did a YouTube review of the bass (Spector Legend Bass Detailed Review) and, aside from the wiring mess found it to be comparable to a $1000 -$1200 bass. I have no plans now to change out the pickups or wiring, but adding decent p'ups and an Audere preamp might be in the future. Either way, the bass is a keeper and hits well above its price range.
That was my experience with a fretless Squier Jazz I bought earlier this year. It was great in the store, but once I took it home, issues with the fingerboard became apparent, and could not play what I was used to playing on it. My $99 Glarry fretless P-bass has a much better fingerboard.
One thing that may have been mentioned already is $1,200, or in the case of Dingwall, basses that are nearly $3,000, are made in low wage countries these days. I say a Lakland Skyline DJ5 or 55-02 compares quite favorably to an $1,800 Fender or Music Man from 2009.
At least three different conversations taking place in this thread. Nice work OP. 
I think you get more value for your dollar these days. I will use Ibanez for example and I happen to like 6-string basses. They currently have 3 low-priced entry level models that are actually quite good.
SR306EB is $450 new
GSR206 is $300 new
GSR206SM (Spalted Maple) is $350 new
SR306EB is $450 new
GSR206 is $300 new
GSR206SM (Spalted Maple) is $350 new
These days, assuming NIB, I expect a <200 no-name to be almost perfect, and ready to play right out of the box. Because that's what I've been receiving. My last two newbies (€67 & €169 NIB, respectively) were pretty much "giggable" right out of the box.
Dunno what I would expect from a 1200 instrument, other than pristine perfection. That kind of money is not available in my world. If it is in yours, good for you.
Dunno what I would expect from a 1200 instrument, other than pristine perfection. That kind of money is not available in my world. If it is in yours, good for you.
Maybe expectations are too high right now, I've been thinking about that lately.
I think Amazon/instant fulfillment of brand new products has spoiled us quite a bit. That being said; in my personal experience purchasing "cheap" bass guitars over the years has gotten significantly better.
Maybe CNC technology has become more common, or maybe it's just general craftsmanship is improving.
Either way, I feel like my dollar is going further than ever lately. This is a great time to be a new bass player.
I think Amazon/instant fulfillment of brand new products has spoiled us quite a bit. That being said; in my personal experience purchasing "cheap" bass guitars over the years has gotten significantly better.
Maybe CNC technology has become more common, or maybe it's just general craftsmanship is improving.
Either way, I feel like my dollar is going further than ever lately. This is a great time to be a new bass player.
