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AudioKinesis Cabs Part VI...

Hey guys, I see soo much love here for the 12's Hathors and TC's. I just realized: Duke has built a couple monsters: the TC 118 and Hathor 1855. They are pretty lightweight for their power handling and size.

Does anyone here have experience with either? Anyone using one of them for their main ROCK gig? I can't even comprehend what kind of output they would have! Woot woot ground shaking I hope.... :thumbsup: :bassist:
 
I use the TC118 extensively. I play in two bands; a operatic heavy metal band, and a semi-progressive hard rock band.
The output (pure volume wise) is of course amazing. Honestly, and I hope Duke doesn't take offense to this, but that is not at all what's magical about the TC118. I think by now a fair amount of people can take a good 18" driver, stuff it in a properly sized box and make it loud.

The true, eye and ear opening absolute magic is in the tone of this. For my needs, it could not be any more perfect, even compared directly to several flavors of fEarful designs and other cabs with similar tone goals. Since I use a modeler (amp, cabs, FX), I must have a system that is not only transparent in nature, but that takes input well. It's hard for me to explain, really. But very subtle changes in my presets/models are instantly reflected in what I hear. With other cabs, I'd have to do more drastic changes for them to become apparent.
This was even the case when I'd use a traditional per+power setup. Slight EQ or drive changes came through very well.
I'd hate to call them "flat", as that implies a technical term and also a kind of sterile feel. I would not characterize it as sterile. It does have a tone baked in, which is tweakable with the switches and the plugable ports. I personally leave the ports plugged to keep things a bit tighter. If you're just running an amp, or pre+power setup into it, expect it to feel like someone took a blanket off of your old cab - just opened things up and allowed more to come through. Oh, and all the while be freakishly loud.
It feels pretty efficient, but I'm driving it with 800W which will make most things loud. It easily matches output with the guitarists in both of my bands... and can "earthquake" underneath it all and shake the hell out of where ever we are, or slice and dice through the mix. It's truly impressive.

Then, the rest of it all sets in. Mrs. Selta plays violin (has played violin since she was a child, went to Juliard as a kid and so on). A few years ago, we got her an electric violin so she doesn't have to use her really good (and holy-poopie expensive) violin for our bands. At a GTG I put together in 2014, Duke was present and brought along various cabs. The TC118 handled bass and upright bass as well as as everyone here can already talk your head off about. But, never in my mind would I have imagined a bass-oriented cab, especially one with an 18" primary driver, doing violin justice. But believe me when I tell you, it does! Now, that may not sound applicable to us as bass players, but to me, it proved that this cab would faithfully reproduce the full spectrum. It's made me a better player, in that it doesn't give me much room to hide bad technique.

To this day, we both still use the TC118 for electirc + upright bass, cello, keys (Korg M3), violin. And it sounds wonderful at all of those things.

I honestly can't sing praises high enough of the TC line, and the TC118 in particular.

Sorry for babbling. Once I heard the TC118, I was sold on it. I haven't had to think even the slightest about another cab at all since then. I may end up getting a 2nd TC118, or another TC model just to have as a secondary to leave at a rehearsal space or something. But, I in no way see or feel a need or want to change cabs at all at this time.
 
I use the TC118 extensively. I play in two bands; a operatic heavy metal band, and a semi-progressive hard rock band.
The output (pure volume wise) is of course amazing. Honestly, and I hope Duke doesn't take offense to this, but that is not at all what's magical about the TC118. I think by now a fair amount of people can take a good 18" driver, stuff it in a properly sized box and make it loud.

The true, eye and ear opening absolute magic is in the tone of this. For my needs, it could not be any more perfect, even compared directly to several flavors of fEarful designs and other cabs with similar tone goals. Since I use a modeler (amp, cabs, FX), I must have a system that is not only transparent in nature, but that takes input well. It's hard for me to explain, really. But very subtle changes in my presets/models are instantly reflected in what I hear. With other cabs, I'd have to do more drastic changes for them to become apparent.
This was even the case when I'd use a traditional per+power setup. Slight EQ or drive changes came through very well.
I'd hate to call them "flat", as that implies a technical term and also a kind of sterile feel. I would not characterize it as sterile. It does have a tone baked in, which is tweakable with the switches and the plugable ports. I personally leave the ports plugged to keep things a bit tighter. If you're just running an amp, or pre+power setup into it, expect it to feel like someone took a blanket off of your old cab - just opened things up and allowed more to come through. Oh, and all the while be freakishly loud.
It feels pretty efficient, but I'm driving it with 800W which will make most things loud. It easily matches output with the guitarists in both of my bands... and can "earthquake" underneath it all and shake the hell out of where ever we are, or slice and dice through the mix. It's truly impressive.

Then, the rest of it all sets in. Mrs. Selta plays violin (has played violin since she was a child, went to Juliard as a kid and so on). A few years ago, we got her an electric violin so she doesn't have to use her really good (and holy-poopie expensive) violin for our bands. At a GTG I put together in 2014, Duke was present and brought along various cabs. The TC118 handled bass and upright bass as well as as everyone here can already talk your head off about. But, never in my mind would I have imagined a bass-oriented cab, especially one with an 18" primary driver, doing violin justice. But believe me when I tell you, it does! Now, that may not sound applicable to us as bass players, but to me, it proved that this cab would faithfully reproduce the full spectrum. It's made me a better player, in that it doesn't give me much room to hide bad technique.

To this day, we both still use the TC118 for electirc + upright bass, cello, keys (Korg M3), violin. And it sounds wonderful at all of those things.

I honestly can't sing praises high enough of the TC line, and the TC118 in particular.

Sorry for babbling. Once I heard the TC118, I was sold on it. I haven't had to think even the slightest about another cab at all since then. I may end up getting a 2nd TC118, or another TC model just to have as a secondary to leave at a rehearsal space or something. But, I in no way see or feel a need or want to change cabs at all at this time.

So then you like it? :eyebrow:

MM
 
I use the TC118 extensively. I play in two bands; a operatic heavy metal band, and a semi-progressive hard rock band.
The output (pure volume wise) is of course amazing. Honestly, and I hope Duke doesn't take offense to this, but that is not at all what's magical about the TC118. I think by now a fair amount of people can take a good 18" driver, stuff it in a properly sized box and make it loud.

The true, eye and ear opening absolute magic is in the tone of this. For my needs, it could not be any more perfect, even compared directly to several flavors of fEarful designs and other cabs with similar tone goals. Since I use a modeler (amp, cabs, FX), I must have a system that is not only transparent in nature, but that takes input well. It's hard for me to explain, really. But very subtle changes in my presets/models are instantly reflected in what I hear. With other cabs, I'd have to do more drastic changes for them to become apparent.
This was even the case when I'd use a traditional per+power setup. Slight EQ or drive changes came through very well.
I'd hate to call them "flat", as that implies a technical term and also a kind of sterile feel. I would not characterize it as sterile. It does have a tone baked in, which is tweakable with the switches and the plugable ports. I personally leave the ports plugged to keep things a bit tighter. If you're just running an amp, or pre+power setup into it, expect it to feel like someone took a blanket off of your old cab - just opened things up and allowed more to come through. Oh, and all the while be freakishly loud.
It feels pretty efficient, but I'm driving it with 800W which will make most things loud. It easily matches output with the guitarists in both of my bands... and can "earthquake" underneath it all and shake the hell out of where ever we are, or slice and dice through the mix. It's truly impressive.

Then, the rest of it all sets in. Mrs. Selta plays violin (has played violin since she was a child, went to Juliard as a kid and so on). A few years ago, we got her an electric violin so she doesn't have to use her really good (and holy-poopie expensive) violin for our bands. At a GTG I put together in 2014, Duke was present and brought along various cabs. The TC118 handled bass and upright bass as well as as everyone here can already talk your head off about. But, never in my mind would I have imagined a bass-oriented cab, especially one with an 18" primary driver, doing violin justice. But believe me when I tell you, it does! Now, that may not sound applicable to us as bass players, but to me, it proved that this cab would faithfully reproduce the full spectrum. It's made me a better player, in that it doesn't give me much room to hide bad technique.

To this day, we both still use the TC118 for electirc + upright bass, cello, keys (Korg M3), violin. And it sounds wonderful at all of those things.

I honestly can't sing praises high enough of the TC line, and the TC118 in particular.

Sorry for babbling. Once I heard the TC118, I was sold on it. I haven't had to think even the slightest about another cab at all since then. I may end up getting a 2nd TC118, or another TC model just to have as a secondary to leave at a rehearsal space or something. But, I in no way see or feel a need or want to change cabs at all at this time.

Thank you for your excellent review. Were I to be in a full-on rock band again I would take the same route as you. By your review it sounds like you've found tone nirvana.

Many musicians over the years thought I was crazy when I would express a desire to use an 18" cab for my bass-- you see, I've always felt the 18" driver would be able to develop that thunderous bottom end I've always wanted to pack with me. But these cabs are amazing in that the TC118 is 43 pounds and the Hathor 1855 is 50 pounds! Unheard of! Although not very light compared to the others, by size and handles manageable for most gigs.

I'm so happy to see this evolution in speaker technology. It's what I wished I had 30 years ago when I was wheeling around 80 to 100 pound cabs. These cabinets and the philosophies of their designs are the harbingers of the future in my estimation.
 
Thank you for your excellent review. Were I to be in a full-on rock band again I would take the same route as you. By your review it sounds like you've found tone nirvana.

Many musicians over the years thought I was crazy when I would express a desire to use an 18" cab for my bass-- you see, I've always felt the 18" driver would be able to develop that thunderous bottom end I've always wanted to pack with me. But these cabs are amazing in that the TC118 is 43 pounds and the Hathor 1855 is 50 pounds! Unheard of! Although not very light compared to the others, by size and handles manageable for most gigs.

I'm so happy to see this evolution in speaker technology. It's what I wished I had 30 years ago when I was wheeling around 80 to 100 pound cabs. These cabinets and the philosophies of their designs are the harbingers of the future in my estimation.
I think the problem with 18's over the years was their very slow response. I remember trying many different ones over the years and they never "felt good".

Im not surprised that Duke has defied the odds here judging from the glowing reviews. Also judging from my TC and Hathor cabs, he knows a little about what he is doing. Lol! Duke has that magic touch and so do his cabs!
 
Yeah. To my ears and with my setup, the fEarful had more low-lows. This, while sounds nice in theory, causes a lot more problems for me than anything. I had to run a pretty hard blocking shelf on my EQ to bring the lows under control, and even then it still seemed to just be problematic. The mids seemed basically the same between the two, and the highs were fairly similar as well.

It basically boiled down to I had to fight a little with the fEarful, where as I did not have to at all with my TC118. If Duke's cabs didn't exist, I'd be playing a fEarful.

I could see some cases where having those lows is appealing, though. I don't intend to claim that the TC118 is an absolute better. To me, the philosophy between fEarful and TC cabs is very similar, just with slightly different execution. The way Duke executes works better for me.
 
From what I understand from Duke is the TC 118 has a little subdued Lowend compared to the Hathor 1855.The 18 in the Hater 1855 as I once by mistake(Spell Check) called it is not you old day 18.It reacts more like a 12 or new day 15.Like I said in a previous post it is my favorite to date.And this is comparing to my TC112 v1,Comp TC 115v1 and a Comp TC 212.The Hathor 1855 is tunable like all of Dukes cabs with the 4 ports it has.The Hathor 1855 seems to work well even with as little as a 500 amp even though the Faital 18 Duke uses in it is a 1200 watt continuos rated 18 driver.
 
I haven't tried a TC118 (someday!) but I can echo what Selta said, that the TC series reflects the subtlest eq changes or pre-amp settings. it is my favorite feature of my TC112. Can pretty much make it sound like anything and it handles all the low end and volume that I throw at it. ALSO, my hathor 1203 build is almost done, will have it in a few weeks! Very psyched about it.
 
So the Hathors are supposedly more 'grindy'... how does this translate in terms of mids? One of the reasons I was temped by the Berg CN112 was their slight mid-forward character, something that's attractive as a primarily fretless player. Reading through here it seems that a Hathor paired with TC is a great combination, can anyone with that set up or experience with go into a little more detail? The reason I ask that I'm considering a Hathor down the line.
 
The true, eye and ear opening absolute magic is in the tone of [the TC118]. For my needs, it could not be any more perfect, even compared directly to several flavors of fEarful designs and other cabs with similar tone goals...

Mrs. Selta plays violin... To this day, we both still use the TC118 for electirc + upright bass, cello, keys (Korg M3), violin. And it sounds wonderful at all of those things.

Wow, thank you VERY MUCH, Selta!

The 1855 and TC118 can possibly be the 410 killer. .without the beaming of a 410... People will still dig their 410s , but at least there is an option

Dukeorock is also doing a very intelligently design modern 18, a sealed box with two 3" dome mids for the top end. If we had enough of an advertising budget, between us I think we'd have a good chance of replacing the 410 as the go-to cab for many bass players. We may do it anyway; it'll just take a bit longer.

From what I understand from Duke is the TC 118 has a little subdued Lowend compared to the Hathor 1855.The 18 in the Hater 1855 as I once by mistake(Spell Check) called it is not you old day 18.It reacts more like a 12 or new day 15.Like I said in a previous post it is my favorite to date.And this is comparing to my TC112 v1,Comp TC 115v1 and a Comp TC 212.The Hathor 1855 is tunable like all of Dukes cabs with the 4 ports it has.The Hathor 1855 seems to work well even with as little as a 500 amp even though the Faital 18 Duke uses in it is a 1200 watt continuos rated 18 driver.

The 18" woofer in the Thunderchild 118 has an insanely smooth top end, and that lends itself very well to the kind of sound Selta described in post #3048. The woofer in the 1855 doesn't have an especially great frequency response (at least it doesn't have any nasty peaks that need to be removed), but what it does have is an insanely powerful motor, nearly three times as strong as the motor in a Kappalite.

So the Hathors are supposedly more 'grindy'... how does this translate in terms of mids? One of the reasons I was temped by the Berg CN112 was their slight mid-forward character, something that's attractive as a primarily fretless player. Reading through here it seems that a Hathor paired with TC is a great combination, can anyone with that set up or experience with go into a little more detail? The reason I ask that I'm considering a Hathor down the line.

Thunderchild 112 V3 and 115 V3 are more grindy than their predecessors, but they will never equal the Hathor cabs in this regard because in the Thunderchild cabs all of the grindy is coming from the woofer cone, which is beaming in that region (1.4 to 2 kHz ballpark). (Theoretically I could get some emphasis in that region from the bottom end of the compression driver, but ime it comes across as harshness. A compression driver is just the wrong tool for that job.)

On the other hand, in the Hathor series the grindy comes from both the woofer and midrange cones (primarily the midrange cones in the 1855). As a result, not only do we have more grindy energy, but it's much better dispersed by the smaller diameter cone mids.

Note that any grindy in these cabs is switch-off-able.
 
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