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Avatar 3 way 15/6/tweet

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#45
that looks like a pretty decent fearful-esque cab. can't imagine it weighing more than a fearful, and i think they clock in at somewhere around 40 lbs, right? nice to see the manufacturers getting into the act with their own takes on this design. genz benz now has a 12/6 cab, too. markbass added the alain caron 12/6 cab earlier this year, i think. the more the merrier. even an old school guy like me can appreciate good dispersion. but let's lose the metal grilles and start showing them some grillcloth love.
 
#46
It's the same box size as the 2x12/410, so it's a pretty safe bet you'll be getting 3/4" plywood, count on it being more like 55-60 lbs. I hope they sell well enough so he can sell them in Linex instead of tolex. :rollno:
 
#47
JimmyM said:
that looks like a pretty decent fearful-esque cab. can't imagine it weighing more than a fearful, and i think they clock in at somewhere around 40 lbs, right? nice to see the manufacturers getting into the act with their own takes on this design. genz benz now has a 12/6 cab, too. markbass added the alain caron 12/6 cab earlier this year, i think. the more the merrier. even an old school guy like me can appreciate good dispersion. but let's lose the metal grilles and start showing them some grillcloth love.
Click to expand...

Jimmy, remember that cabs with mid drivers have been around forever... nothing new in general here. Acme, EA, LDS, etc. have been doing two way cabs with mid drivers or three way with mids and tweeters for 15+ years, and even EV had a two way cab with mid driver back in the 80's. As it was back then and will continue, these designs will speak to some players and not to others.

The new Genz cab has dual 8" mid drivers, so a touch different also.

I agree though, this one does look (and they basically say it in the marketing specs) like it was strongly influenced by the very nice Talkbass/fEarful DIY build threads, and makes use of that very impressive Eminence LF 15" driver. Since SO much of the tone of these specific cabs are defined by the quality of the mid driver and the crossover design and execution, this one could sound great, or sound like dog! No way of really knowing without hearing it.
 
#48
Really, the only thing I see that resembles a fEarful is the driver sizes (and the use of a 3015LF).
[Greenboy, correct me if I'm wrong]
1; fEarful's cab dimensions allow more height for the mid driver, which aids in hearing it better.(only 3.5" but still it should help)
2; The Eminence closed back midrange is a compromise from the 18 Sound 6ND410.
3; 3/4" vs 1/2" ply makes for a heavier cab.
4; crossover? I guess the jury's still out.

I am glad to see the form factor being produced in the commercial cab world though, and I predicted over a year ago that Avatar might be one to adopt this type of design.
 
#49
lbwdog said:
crossover? I guess the jury's still out.
.
Click to expand...
12dB/Octave cross over
Click to expand...
It's what separates it from a true high end design like Duke's. That, and the unfortunate placement of the mid and HF drivers, which would work best if vertical, and failing in that should at least be tight together rather than spread wide apart. That compromise seems the result of using the same box as other models in the line to keep the price down. Still, not bad for the price.
 
#52
Although I doubt I'll ever give this cab a try, it does seem like a step in the right direction, although as ken has stated, these types of cabs have been around since the '80's. And, if companies honor Greenboy's request, ( as they should ), that his plans are not for commercial use, you will never see a carbon copy fEarful built by Avatar, GenzBenz, etc. Still, like the stuff Carvin makes, alot of bang for the buck, if you can't diy, or wait for a custom builder to do it for you.
 
#53
Loel said:
Kinda like the 24.5" W size should pair up nice
with tube heads,gotta keep an eye on this,!!!
Click to expand...

AFAIK Avatar gets their boxes from Asia, installs the components here. By using one box size for as many different driver combinations as possible inventory is reduced and volume pricing discounts are maximized. That gives far lower prices than if each cab was specifically tailored for the best possible result, the trade-off being that you don't get the best possible result. For the average player it's a reasonable compromise.
 
#55
Not sure about using that lower end mid driver, etc., but the LDS build with the 18Sound super duper mid driver and an eminence tweeter with three way crossover is around $100-$150 more depending one options (fancy tolex, etc., etc.), and of course, has a few month or more waiting period.
 
#57
Greenboy:
merged

My take on this:
nice try. points for trying. minus points for not trying all that hard.
The Fearful Form is a big part of why I like that cab. I want the height. I want the corrected dispersion.
Stuffing these three speakers in their extant 410/212 box really doesn't impress me.

although, the 4 ohm option is nice, i guess.
 
#58
Chef said:
Greenboy:
merged

My take on this:
nice try. points for trying. minus points for not trying all that hard.
The Fearful Form is a big part of why I like that cab. I want the height. I want the corrected dispersion.
Stuffing these three speakers in their extant 410/212 box really doesn't impress me.

although, the 4 ohm option is nice, i guess.
Click to expand...

The height doesn't really matter to me, since by definition, with the less beamy mids, you will be able to hear the upper mids better when standing close to the cab, even if that mid driver is a touch lower (maybe 6"... trivial IMO).

Also, since the tweeter and mid driver are crossed over, while I guess not optimally placed, that shouldn't impact much... different frequencies being delivered by each.

However, as I and others mentioned above, it is all about the quality of the mid driver and the design of the crossover. I've always cringed at the sound of the Avatar tweeters, so my guess is the crossover will not be a strong point of this cab.

Interesting on the 4ohm version... they must have spec'd their own 3015LF driver version, which means different voicing also... could be better than the stock driver, could be worse depending on the tone goal.
 
#59
Chef said:
Greenboy:
merged
Click to expand...

As always, thanks for your wakefulness ; }


although, the 4 ohm option is nice, i guess.
Click to expand...

Here's hoping it was a good translation to a 4-ohm version. A lot of 8-ohm drivers have 4-ohm versions that are markedly inferior in one way or another (or several!). The percieved advantage of them being 4-ohms often is toally lost in reality.

That said, Eminence seems to have it pretty together these days, often with good easy ways to make their 8-ohm driver become a 4-ohm driver before an OEM contract even comes their way. It's an extra revenue stream not to make these drivers available as stock to the public, but it would be stupid not to be efficient at having some good potential 4-ohm versions already sussed out for the OEM market.
 
#60
KJung said:
Also, since the tweeter and mid driver are crossed over, while I guess not optimally placed, that shouldn't impact much... different frequencies being delivered by each.
Click to expand...

It matters. And unlike some things, it needn't cost much at all, but a clued-in designer on staff, or some research to become one yourself, and some focused experimentation and critical listening time. That's a one-time cost, because the principles understood and learned travel to any future designs. Of course, if you are NOT clued in you can imitate, and hopefully get it SOMEWHAT right that way. A lot of imitators don't even have a clue what the essentials are and miss a lot of them.

The more of this stuff that is done wrong, the less it' makes it worth doing. Might as well just stick with cloning the same old one-ways - with or without crappy tweeterhorns grafted on.
 
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