• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Band expenses

#121
lowfreq33 said:
This is not an opportunity, it's a scam to fund the "manager's" daughter's career.
Click to expand...

DING DING DING!!!

Seven pages of blahbeddy blah condensed into one sentence.

I just wonder if this is a situation where the OP has tons of disposable income and these costs are not a big deal like they would be to a mere mortal like myself...

?? Just a hunch.
 
#122
I will post a link soon once the new band lineup is officially announced. I did inquire about the previous bass player and also spoke to the drummer who has been with the band for 2 years. the previous bass player was asked to leave because he did not uphold the image of the band (underage smoking / drinking). think disney friendly pop/rock.
 
#123
I guess I was not concerned with the band ownership wording as we are joining an existing band and the band was founded by the singers mother / manager. I figured the ownership wording protected her so band members would not leave and try to start a new band using the same name.
 
#124
Post the link either way, it's all about them gaining exposure and views, right? We need to see the limitless potential of this gal!

So, you sign on to this cruise to fantasy island, and start paying monthly dues, right? Or is there a substantial, non refundable, signing fee? That agreement looks like the usual crap starry eyed musicians have been signing for centuries. Is there a midnight meeting at a crossroad?

Education costs money, and this will be an education.

I'm ready to skip the add and watch the video!
 
#125
vqlt said:
I guess I was not concerned with the band ownership wording as we are joining an existing band and the band was founded by the singers mother / manager. I figured the ownership wording protected her so band members would not leave and try to start a new band using the same name.
Click to expand...

Clarifying ownership of the name is fine, I didn't find that part objectionable. What worries me is the combination of management owning the band "entity" (is that the actual language in the agreement?) and then the statement that songs composed by the group collectively belong to "the band [entity?]," not the individual songwriters.

What I think it SHOULD say is that each individual who contributes to songwriting receives a songwriting credit and a share in royalties on all uses of that song. Song rights should be held by the individual songwriters, whether they stay with the band or leave. If the song is owned by the "band entity" and the "band entity" is owned by the manager, then you're signing away potential income, in the scenario that your son helps write a hit song and then leaves or gets fired and winds up with no claims on the royalties.

And again, the description of the agreement you gave didn't give any indication of how the band members DO get paid, if gig money goes to some "band fund" for "operational expenses."

And anyway, as others have pointed out, all this is for a band that apparently hasn't made a penny yet.
 
#126
Hi,

Who is the photographer? Who owns the studio where the video and audio recordings are being made? Who is handling the media/promotion? Are any of them married to or family members of the "stage mom"? I'm not liking your situation from a business standpoint. It may be a great, but expensive, educational experience for your son. There are just too many red flags going up for me to be interested.


Thank you for your indulgence,

BassCliff
 
#127
here is the full language in the agreement for songs written:

Songs Written: Band Member acknowledges that songs written by old members will be credited to the rightful writers. All songs written as a Band Member of ________shall remain the property of _____but shall be appropriately credited based on the Band Member’s participation in the songwriting process (melody, lyrics, music). If a member brings a complete song, the member retains ownership of his/her song.
 
#128
vqlt said:
just wondering if these cost are typical for bands that are trying to make a major push
Click to expand...
Do you mean making a successful push? I think the answer is no. At best, I think what's being proposed here, is putting the cart before the horse. There's no formula for success in the rock band business. It's extremely rare to take a band to the next level through promotion alone, and the proposed costs will be wasted if the band isn't already capable of performing at the next level.

It's like getting a promotion at work. You don't get a promotion by showing how good you are at your present job. You get a promotion by proving that you're already working at the next level.

There's also the question of whether this kind of arrangement is typically for turning a teenager into a successful bassist, and again, the answer is no. Bassists are fungible. If the singer reaches the next level before the rest of the band does (a possibility given the asymmetry of the proposed deal), she will replace her band. Most bands break up or change their personnel at least once on the way to success.

There's also a negative side. ;)

The best advice to a teenager who wants to be a successful bassist is that it's an individual pursuit, not a group effort. The most likely & common scenario for success is to be the bassist who the singer chooses when she ditches her current band, or be ready to be that bassist for some other singer. Most career musicians work with multiple groups. Those bassists are chosen because they can walk in and be productive in a matter of minutes. A bassist who has spent their critical years rehearsing a few easy tunes over an over with an emerging band might end up last in line.
 
#129
The only thing I see your kid getting out of this is a solid lesson in how to get screwed in the music industry. Not in a million years would I let one of my kids participate in something like this, for all of the reasons everyone else has brought up.

Seriously, there is an opportunity here for you and your son, but it's not what you think. It's an opportunity to teach him that people will try to take advantage of him and here are the questions to ask and things to look out for to protect himself from them.
 
#130
vqlt said:
I will post a link soon once the new band lineup is officially announced. I did inquire about the previous bass player and also spoke to the drummer who has been with the band for 2 years. the previous bass player was asked to leave because he did not uphold the image of the band (underage smoking / drinking). think disney friendly pop/rock.
Click to expand...

Once again ding, ding, ding!

Someone please name someone other than the singer from a Disney friendly pop/rock band. ...I'll wait...

If you are paying money into the band as an entity then you are entitled to a financial interest in the entity, ie. you own a portion of whatever is bought with that money. If you are not getting that then you are in fact (as others have stated) subsidizing the singer and I am sure paying the singer's mom.

What exactly is your son getting out of this?
 
#133
sorry I pulled the video link as I was not comfortable posting until at least one of the videos includes my son. the current videos only feature the former lineup. along with my son who is the new bass player they have also added a new lead guitar player for similar reasons that they needed a new bass player. I'm still on the fence regarding the whole situation. I'm fully aware that singers get picked up all the time without bringing the band along but I also know that my son gains exposure. people will see him on stage, people will see him in the videos. he may at some point get picked up by another band. heck the reason he was asked to audition for this band is they saw him playing in another band. my son was in a previous band in which the lead singer left because a better opportunity presented itself. The singers seem to get the most spotlight
 
#136
I'd be okay with my kid doing something like this pending:

We didn't have to pony up $7100 to get in
We didn't have to sign a ridiculous contract for an unknown band

Fronting that kind of money doesn't guarantee anything in this situation unfortunately. It also bothers me that the mother formed the band, I.E. it was "made" and not formed in a traditional sense of some friends getting together and playing.

Does mom write the majority of the songs too?
 
#137
It started out as friends forming in the Midwest. Like so many others the family moved to the LA area to pursue her career. They kept the name as they had already built a following in their home territory however they did need to build a new band. I realize the band was built around her and we are all replaceable
 
#139
vqlt said:
I realize the band was built around her and we are all replaceable
Click to expand...


As such, the band are best called what they are going to be treated as - hired guns. But I've never heard of hired guns who essentially have to pay-to-play. You should not be fronting any money; your son should be getting paid a flat fee for each gig and each recording session he is asked to be involved with.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back