Band members really talented but lazy as hell

[bigsack]

i will try to make it short.
i play in a band which consists of a guitarist, drummer and a singer.
we are all in our early 30's.
these guys are really talented and i must say the music i make with them is the best i made in my whole life.
the problem is when it's time to get into business to record an album or to close the structure of the song there is always something in the way.
i am sound engineer and all i tell them is to come in to the studio and record the songs.
that's when the problem starts
the singer comes unprepared to the recording not even writing the lyrics.sometimes after we record a whole song he says he wrote a new melody and want to change the existing one...
the guitarist is always late to the recording or informs a day before that he can't come.
we played together for on and off almost five years and we only recorded 7 songs!!
it's giving my emotional hell just to get these guys together in the studio to record
the thing is i really like the music we do and i don't want to throw it away.
what should i do?

 

[skwee]

Help them to figure out (gently, or with tough love) that they are self-sabataging.

 

[bass_snake]

That' s tough. I' d find new people if I was in your situation.

Fred

 

[MKoby]

They are cool.
They are talented.
No work ethic. No drive. No consideration. No professional behavior. No future.

If you had $450K on the line, would you trust it with them??

Why should you trust your musical future with them?
Still not sure?
Cartoons??


Game for it?




What would Sponge Bob Square Pants' Grandmother say?
What would your grandmother say??

 

[James Judson]

Talent is easily thrown away. Heck it's free isn't it. Ever notice the most talented people have the most trouble with drugs/alcohol. Its hard to build a mountain with folks like that. My $.02 is just keep doing it. It will come together sooner or later (if you don't go insane first).

 

[bigsack]

Help them to figure out (gently, or with tough love) that they are self-sabataging.

i tried to make them sit down and talk like an adults but they stopped me before i even finished my sentence to talk about some other unrelated stuff.

If you had $450K on the line, would you trust it with them??

Why should you trust your musical future with them?
Still not sure?
Cartoons??

when you put it this way it makes feel that you are right...
these guys could never be serious enough if it will come to big money...:scowl:
i guess i should just leave this band and let it go...

 

[otis_thick]

I can tell you from experience I have been playing almost 40 years(my fingers are getting tired..yuk yuk!) Getting that right combination of talent on the same page is tough...that's why most musicians don't make it to the big leagues of "stardom" on their own...that's why the music industry started CREATING groups and really limiting and controlling what the mass market is exposed too or more importantly NOT exposed too ... If you keep at it, you will find ther are thousands of amazingly talented singers and musicians out there, that for some reason or another are NOT THERE YET or should be there by now or must have been there then! I have played with people who only want to do covers or they have too many side projects or the wife\husband is affraid they will be left alone etc....As of this past January....At work, I have a studio with all the fixens Tascam D4800, Pro Tools HD w\8 yes 8 processor MAC, Quad core PC...Acid, Samplitude, Sonar, Mics out the ying yang, Klipsch full THXUltra 7.1 monitoring, HD\SD video production and post w\ Avid\Final Cut and Vegas etc, ful DVD\CD authoring and duplication and unlimited access and ZERO Overhead. (Arts Society grant) AND I can't good players to utilize any of it to save my life....the only ones who will set aside time to come in are kids (teens) that are still very larval in the talent dept. but they all have the same AMBITION and goal in mind like we all did when we were younger...this includes the guys on my website...we recorded the studio recordings 5 days after we met with at that time a Tascam 2400 for a quick demo to get bar\club gigs. That was over 3 years ago and I have yet to get us all back in with the same goal! Its very frustrating because we can come up with IMHO some great suff when we are jamming with very little effort but when I say we need to put this stuff down OUT comes the excuses! So in the mean time I play with other people while still looking for the "right stuff!" I have learned to just enjoy playing as much as I can and keep plowing forward...it has cost me money and a few serious relationships but I still have more than my share of funn even at this age! I have to be happy first before I can make someone else happy..and I am still in love with music!! Enjoy the musicians you meet and the music you make...but remember...you may not make the big time....EVER...or you may get lucky and the worm will turn for you....So keep looking!

 

[Stumbo]

Maybe let them know how you feel. Possibly give them a deadline to get it together. Then walk. It's on them, not you. You tried and they failed.

Good luck.

 

[bigsack]

otis thick you just made me a more frustraded musician than i was
because you are so right!
god it's so hard to be a musician over the age of 30...

nice equipment btw.


stumbo:
i did what you said 3 times already.
everybody agreed and listened. hooray!
a day after... it is as if the conversation never took place

 

[otis_thick]

I will add an Otis story about the "what are you thinking? syndrome.

I played with a great Sax player who was doing a David Sanborn Marcus miller thing. Sax player Najee offerd to produce him an album and got got him an advance for recording some demos....and got hima gig for an industry party with all sorts of major artist in attendance...instead of bring the full band HE took a sequencer instead to play for room full of labled recording artists.....it was a disaster...and he spent the advance on drugs and some of his personal bills never made it to the studio. The same guy was offered a full expence paid 6-weekend gig in the Bahamas including round trip air and hotel and rental car and $1000.00\per man...we could fly out Thursday night or Friday mornings....play Friday and Sat nights and fly back on Sunday night...or we could stay all week if we wanted...it was setup by An airline company that was based here in town.. The VP of travel promotions had set it up...this would have lead to thier other vacation spots as well....HE did not want to travel that much...he wanted to stay in town and play local dives.... W-T-F. I have not yet heard a better Sax player anywhere and he has not tried to do a damn thing more with his amazing talent yet!

 

[bigsack]

otis that sounds so familiar.
our singer is also a very talented and unique singer.
before this band i made some demos with him.
a friend we knew worked in a local record label.
he brought the demo to the A&R guy.
the A&R guy listened to the demos and wanted to talk business.
at that period the singer was in his "spiritual" journey.
so when a meeting was scheduled he came to it dressed with shalls and rags.
he also played with a flute (he doesn't know how to play the flute...)
and told the A&R guy he was the messiah.
my god.
of course the A&R told our friend that he can't work with unstable person.
people are dreaming of these opportunities all their life and he just threw it away like nothing.



it's weird that the most talented pepole have a self destruct mechanism...

maybe 2 days in Okinawa back in 1945 will make them act differently

 

[loopee]

Why don't you take one of those new "mini" recorders with you at rehearsal and record the whole thing.......or leave them?

 

[otis_thick]

otis thick you just made me a more frustraded musician than i was
because you are so right!
god it's so hard to be a musician over the age of 30...

nice equipment btw.


stumbo:
i did what you said 3 times already.
everybody agreed and listened. hooray!
a day after... it is as if the conversation never took place

Here are some pix of some of the eqipment...I know the rule no pix no link it does not exist. These will give you an insight on the extent MY on-going frustration!

For my Ego

This is how it looks 90% of the time....SIGH

 

[shutupdonnie]

I say cut dead weight. We recently fired the drummer in one of the bands I was in for his inability to remember songs (that we wrote together!) and his general flaky, pothead behaviors. Then I ended up quitting the other band I was in with the same drummer for the same reason. I'm almost 30 and I'm not getting any younger. I don't have the time (literally, I work 60+ hours a week as a chef) to waste with with people who aren't dedicated, no matter how talented they are. I guess it made it easier that the guy was/is a mediocre drummer with bad timing, but the point is the same: if people can't be businesslike and professional, then you are better off cutting your losses and finding people who are. I'd rather play and record in my apartment by myself than play with people who aren't serious about music. Even if you are making music "just for fun", I fail to see the fun in playing live shows and looking like an idiot because of some unprofessional jerkoff in your band that isn't giving it their all.

 

[bigsack]

otis my god!!!
you are living in my own fantasy of equipment!!!
these avalons , sweet avalons rrrrrrr so tasty
recording bass thru them is heaven


shutupdonnie you also convinced me i should ditch this band
60 hours a week man that's rough.
i work 45 hours weekly and don't have time for nothing.

you are right playing for fun isn't fun if your other band mates can't finish one song properly.

 

[Bongolation]

They are cool.
They are talented.
No work ethic. No drive. No consideration. No professional behavior. No future.

Bingo.

Enda story.

"Incredibly talented" is one of the least important components of "making it." In most cases it's a negative if it isn't supported by everything else. "Incredibly talented" people tend to think that's all that's required.

And by "making it," I mean everything upward of "keeping a band together for six months."

 

[otis_thick]

Bingo.

Enda story.

"Incredibly talented" is one of the least important components of "making it." In most cases it's a negative if it isn't supported by everything else. "Incredibly talented" people tend to think that's all that's required.

And by "making it," I mean everything upward of "keeping a band together for six months."

I agree somewhat...IMO I think the talent gets you notice first...but you have to follow through with the BUSINESs of show business...again that's why its easier for industry CREATED stars because the musicians will do what they need to do to get in...if means changing your personal style\look ie Lady Gaga vs Stephanie Germanotta You can see Stephanie has talent but Lady Gaga had to be created for the industry. IMHO Lady Gaga should be able to help Stephanie get her own gig.......for those that don't get what I am saying.....Stephanie IS Lady Gaga! And for those who say Lady Gaga is all media hype!...you are correct!

 

[brucebass300]

i will try to make it short.
i play in a band which consists of a guitarist, drummer and a singer. we are all in our early 30's.
these guys are really talented and i must say the music i make with them is the best i made in my whole life.
the problem is when it's time to get into business to record an album or to close the structure of the song there is always something in the way.
i am sound engineer and all i tell them is to come in to the studio and record the songs.
that's when the problem starts
the singer comes unprepared to the recording not even writing the lyrics.sometimes after we record a whole song he says he wrote a new melody and want to change the existing one...
the guitarist is always late to the recording or informs a day before that he can't come.
we played together for on and off almost five years and we only recorded 7 songs!!
it's giving my emotional hell just to get these guys together in the studio to record
the thing is i really like the music we do and i don't want to throw it away.
what should i do?

Bigsack your situation sounds kind of similar to my last original band. In that group we had a VERY talented singer and a guitarist with lots of original ideas (plus myself on bass and a really solid and reliable drummer). It was definitely the most enjoyable and musically satisfying band i have ever played with.

However the guitarist and singer were also the ones who slowed us down most - it's not that they were at all lazy, but that they always had too many other things going on in their life that seemed to be a higher priority.

We had tons of great song ideas that never saw the light of day, cos it was too hard to get everyone to commit to finishing something. Plus they wanted to keep tinkering endlessly with our older songs, when it would be better to move on and create something new.

In spite of this, we pushed on and had got to the point of playing some good venues here in Melbourne and had some demo recordings done - with plans to record a proper album this year ... and then the guitarist and vocalist both decided to quit.

i know each person has to do what suits them, but it was very disappointing, especially since they had something that many musicians would kill for, and decided to throw it aside...

 

[brucebass300]

Otis: amazing studio set up you have there ... and its not getting much use?!?

Perhaps i should move to Indianapolis!

 

[jive1]

You're getting musically blue-balled.

It's like having a mansion, but you're always losing the keys to get in.

Or a supermodel wife who dresses in burlap from head to toe, and won't put out.

Or a sports car that can go 0-60 in 2 seconds and manuver any curve, but there's no sterring wheel.

The thing is that all these things I mentioned, no matter how cool they are, if they don't benefit you, they are a liability.