Bass guitar with upright like tone?

[oren]

The Godin sounds as close to a double bass as I've ever heard from a bass guitar. I've never seen anyone string a double bass with tapewounds, so I can't imagine why anyone would think the sound of a double bass can be had with tapewounds.

Fair point. There are coated upright strings, though they're not all that commonly used in jazz. When I saw CHARLIE Haden play he had steel strings on the E and A strings and gut strings on the D and G.

I was thinking that Chromes are pretty bright for flats, but they're certainly not brighter than the Spirocores on my upright.

 

[Rich48]

Thank you to everyone for your interest and reply's. I had a Takamine, the cheeper one, for a while and it sounded more like a guitar tuned down an octave then an upright. It was large and I found it hard to play, so I don't think I will go for another ABG. I'm not sure I would like something as small as a U bass, but if I get the chance to try one locally, I would. The Allen and the Christopher are just more then I want to spend. That Christopher may be the most beautiful bass I have ever seen. The Wendler looks very interesting and is less then half the price. I think I may try to pickup a used cheep fretless, just to see if I can play it in tune. If that works out I may take a chance and order the Wendler. I will also try some of the playing techniques that have been posted.

 

[Coolhandjjl]

Guild Starfire with flatwounds, neck pickup solo'd, and the tone rolled off a bit

*Headphones or proper studio monitor speakers will give you the best idea of Starfire bass demos since they have the most wonderful, pillowy bass tone.

This video's a good example even though the audio of the recording isn't very good. I'm pretty positive he's got roundwounds on there... so the flats just take it a step closer


Also, here's my 1970 Starfire, neck pickup, flatwounds, with a variable mid-notch filter switch installed. The first few notches of the switch are pretty bright, but as the clicks go down the line it gets more and more into upright territory.
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Sounds pretty cool!

I wonder if a Curtis Novak Darkstar/Bisonic reproduction pickup on a modern Guild or other modern semi-hollow body's would sound as good?

 

[darwin-bass]

U-bass

 

[GretschWretch]

I play weekly in a jazz jam where there is a string bassist who is also there. I'm no jazz snob, but believe me, it ain't the same.

No, it isn't; and it won't be because it can't be. So far nobody has addressed the fact than a DB just moves the air differently than an EB or an ABG and there's no getting around that. And as far as "close but no cigar," an EB can get you there as well an an ABG. As others have pointed out, set-up, strings, and strike point of the plucking hand will have as much to do with the sound produced as the instrument itself, but only a DB or an instrument braced like a DB will get you spot on.

 

[bholder]

Sounds pretty cool!

I wonder if a Curtis Novak Darkstar/Bisonic reproduction pickup on a modern Guild or other modern semi-hollow body's would sound as good?

I have a couple of sets of his BS/DS dual mode (coil tapped) pickups, have some projects in mind to some day find out exactly that.

 

[Jim C]

No, it isn't; and it won't be because it can't be. So far nobody has addressed the fact than a DB just moves the air differently than an EB or an ABG and there's no getting around that. And as far as "close but no cigar," an EB can get you there as well an an ABG. As others have pointed out, set-up, strings, and strike point of the plucking hand will have as much to do with the sound produced as the instrument itself, but only a DB or an instrument braced like a DB will get you spot on.

Have you played anything under $1K that was as good or better than the Kala U Bass?
I have yet to hear an ABG that got as close as the Kala at this price point.

 

[fesem]

I have played a Kala Ubass with the black polyurethane strings with a bluegrass band and many times had people come up and ask where the upright bass is. One guy, who is a bass player, was wondering if it was pre-recorded. They were all shocked when they realized it was the little ubass.

 

[mellowgerman]

Sounds pretty cool!
I wonder if a Curtis Novak Darkstar/Bisonic reproduction pickup on a modern Guild or other modern semi-hollow body's would sound as good?

Thanks! Curtis's pickups are the best. Extremely faithful reproductions going by all the original Bisonics that have come through my hands in various old Guild basses. Of course, at that age, a lot of pickups are at varying levels of magnet decay and could always be a clean rewind, so there's a degree of variation in the originals as well.
My #1 bass is that 1970 Starfire. It was actual a single pickup model, but since I know I'm never letting it go, I added a bridge pickup and opted for a Novak to serve that purpose. Wonderful tone and makes the bass even more versatile.

 

[mellowgerman]

Nice tone, but sounds nothing like an upright bass.

Thanks, of course a fretted shortscale semi-hollow electric bass is never going to sound just like an upright, nor was the purpose of that demo to emulate an upright. Really nothing sounds just like an upright except for an actual upright. That said, the Starfire is extremely versatile with the incredibly smooth frequency response curve of Bisonic pickups giving you one of the most true electric representations possible of your string's actual vibrations and all the fundamental and harmonic nuances that go with it. Couple that with the semi-hollow resonance and some flatwound strings (and if you take the time to dial everything in just right with whatever amp you're playing through) you can get very close to a natural woody upright tone. Tonally this becomes even more convincing if you're playing in a group, live with other musicians.

 

[logdrum]

It's kinda difficult. Honestly - fretless bass guitars is more distinct as a fretless bass guitar than just a P-Bass fretted with old flat strings or/and a foam under the bridge. I think this is because a fretted instrument tends to be higher action. It's really how you dig in on the strings. I am playing a friend's NS NXT and it came with low action like a fretless bass and sounded like one. Once the action was raised, then it sounded like an upright amplified.

Also low action fretless, then is always that tendency to do a wide vibrato and it is a dead give-away that it is a fretless bass guitar.

I love fretless sounds like Jaco and Michael Maring but for the money work, just an honest to goodness walking with a P Bass or MM with old flats is where it is at. My opinions of course.

And yeah -- Steve Swallow, pick and fretted. Sounds like a very supportive upright bass player

 

[buldog5151bass]

Thanks, of course a fretted shortscale semi-hollow electric bass is never going to sound just like an upright, nor was the purpose of that demo to emulate an upright. Really nothing sounds just like an upright except for an actual upright. That said, the Starfire is extremely versatile with the incredibly smooth frequency response curve of Bisonic pickups giving you one of the most true electric representations possible of your string's actual vibrations and all the fundamental and harmonic nuances that go with it. Couple that with the semi-hollow resonance and some flatwound strings (and if you take the time to dial everything in just right with whatever amp you're playing through) you can get very close to a natural woody upright tone. Tonally this becomes even more convincing if you're playing in a group, live with other musicians.

The thread was about finding a bass guitar that sounds like an upright (your post says those Starfire recordings do). Nice tone, but nothing at all like an upright.

 

[PSPookie]

The closest thing I've played was a fretless Renaissance strung with tapes

 

[Bob_Ross]

Rob Allen MB-2 or Rick Turner (where Rob worked before starting his own shop).

Wow, I had no idea Rob worked for Rick! That's very cool.

 

[Bob_Ross]

I've never seen anyone string a double bass with tapewounds, so I can't imagine why anyone would think the sound of a double bass can be had with tapewounds.

How about because the mechanism of sound production between the two instruments is so completely different when you look at every component individually -- e.g., shape/composition of the bridge, shape/composition of the body, how much acoustic energy comes off the body, modalities of transduction for most common electric pickups, and scale length, just for starters -- that to try to point to any one thing and say "this has to be the same or they won't sound the same" ignores the fact that tone is a result of the entire system; it's all about synergy & symbiosis.

 

[2F/2F]

The main key is to play the thing like an upright. The parts you choose to play are different, and the manner in which you hit the strings is different.

You want to kill your sustain too. Use heavy muting on your electric.

And, to state the obvious: flatwounds.

Most of the rest is e.q.

Fretless helps a bit, but is not necessary.

It'll never sound just like an upright, but playing it like an upright and making the bass sustain like a plucked upright will give you a lot of the elements.

 

[porterbass]

There are a lot of good suggestions here to get as close as possible but here's another thought in addition... A Malekko Sneak Attack pedal.

I've tried it after reading a couple of threads here on TB. It works exactly as stated in the threads it is discussed in, and helps significantly by being able to tweak the decay to emulate an upright bass. I was surprised how well it worked. I'd highly recommend reading the threads here and trying it.

 

[swink]

20y ago I defretted an old Maya P-bass and inverted the PJ into JP, some flatwounds and it was good to go, still does it's job.

 

[Jim Carr]

Thank you to everyone for your interest and reply's. I had a Takamine, the cheeper one, for a while and in sounded more like a guitar tuned down an octave then an upright. It was large and I found it hard to play, so I don't think I will go for another ABG. I'm not sure I would like something as small as a U bass, but if I get the chance to try one locally, I would. The Allen and the Christopher are just more then I want to spend. That Christopher may be the most beautiful bass I have ever seen. The Wendler looks very interesting and is less then half the price. I think I may try to pickup a used cheep fretless, just to see if I can play it in tune. If that works out I may take a chance and order the Wendler. I will also try some of the playing techniques that have been posted.

IMHO, if you want to sound like an upright while playing an electric in a Jazz style, you need to play lines like those played on the by a Jazz artist on upright, including register, open strings, rhythmic motives and feel, line shape, harmonic language, dynamics, and articulation. Great Jazz playing on a P-bass is still great Jazz playing—regardless to exact tone.

Music matters so much more than the instrument.

 

[chadds]

'51 P or RI. Use the correct technique and you can use rounds.

Also what sound are you after. Doghouse, doghouse slapped, Contrabass? All require different technique and even in the upright world different basses, strings and setups.