Considering the specs, you'd be lucky to get 32hz @ -10 dB for these cabs, which would already be a respectable result but already is doub tful when a resonant frequency of 40Hz is announced.
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Bergantino CN410 = 49 pounds with no sacrifices. Add his B-Amp at 5.5 pounds.
- Nov 24, 2008
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- 7,163
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- Owner & designer, AudioKinesis; Auth. mfg, Big E (Home Audio only)
Two Kappalite 3012HO's in about 2.5-3 cubic feet vented. Loud as heck, so why isn't anybody doing that? Because the bottom end would be too weak.
We must bring balance to the force.
I agree, the shape and weight of a typical modern 2x12 is the easiest to carry for a single cab solution - that I know of. Three 10's in the similar size box might beat two similar 12s for volume, but weight might start to be an issue. Two fifteens = big and heavy. So maybe the sweet spot is two 13.5" drivers?
GK neo 212 is too heavy for one in each hand, which is what you need for hardcore metal, negating the one trip load in unless you can use a dolly and stash it in the venue.
I have played death metal with 2x12 (Berg IP112 though) along a pair of guitars with 4x10 half stacks, didn't have trouble getting heard.
I have learned a lot in this thread.
Mostly to not pose questions in the form of generalities.
...Especially among the resident engineers.
On the bright side, and true to talkbass form, we are slightly closer to finding out the best cab for metal, although a long way to go still.
I really wish a mod would lock this thread at this point, but I doubt they would be so kind.
I promise not to ask anything serious again. Gonna stick to my mild trolling and humor.
Mostly to not pose questions in the form of generalities.
...Especially among the resident engineers.
On the bright side, and true to talkbass form, we are slightly closer to finding out the best cab for metal, although a long way to go still.
I really wish a mod would lock this thread at this point, but I doubt they would be so kind.
I promise not to ask anything serious again. Gonna stick to my mild trolling and humor.
pussies. 150w triple rectifying mind melting 4x12 minimum qualifying death metalists please.
I found this thread very informative in many different ways. Thx OP & thx to all the contributors.
I haven't picked up a gk neo before but the only thing bad about carrying my cn212 in one hand with my cn112 in the other is how it knocks/rubs against my legs… ok for about 150 meter ish trip longer legs or shorter arms might vary others mileage
Sorry, I should have made a more detailed statement. IMO budget plays a realistic factor in what a person can shop for. IME most working class players have to work with in some sort of budget which will inevitability create compromise.
For example, If I want a new cab that specs out like a top tier cab from a trusted builder (Mesa, Genz, or whom ever ) then I must accept there will be a certain price point. If I can't/won't meet that price point then I must compromise to a lower tier product.
Now had the opening statement been prefaced with "money is no object" then yes price point would not be a factor. Then other more important criteria would need to be addressed as you have stated in a few posts so far.
Absolutely true, and speaker size is not so important as many around here would think. Some cab makers just seem to carry on with myths with their marketing. Selling 10's versus, 12's versus 15's, versus 4x10's, ...
Way too much promotion that size is the big difference.
But just a small point, since a fan was brought up ... sound is more vibrating the air. The sound wave moves at the speed of sound, the air doesn't.
Sound waves do travel through solids also.
The speaker driver is a hard piece of paper, and air is soft. There coupling of the cone to the air and a horn works the best, but a driver in a horn may not have much excursion. A lot of cabs aren't horns around here, but they still need to couple to air and vibrate it.
Just had to bring it up because I see some cab makers claiming to use high excursion drivers, at the same time stuffing too many in a box volume take advantage of the air coupling the drivers really need. They jump from selling size to selling excursion and it can be just as false.
- Feb 12, 2006
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- Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
I make most of my choices about driver size around what kind of midrange voicing can I obtain, and can I get good low frequency response out of the target box size. Not just low frequency extension, but can I get close to critically damped response without sacrificing mid voicing. There are combinations, no matter how attractive they might look on the surface, that just don't work well regardless of size preference.
Luck has nothing to do with it. These cabs were designed by David Nordschow who knows more than a couple of things about cabs and amps. He's not some newbie flash-in-the-pan or garage electronics technician. He started Eden as a PA manufacturer in the 70's and then decided to specialize in building high-quality bass gear. One of his first products was the first series Goliath cab for SWR that he designed for them under contract. Then in about 1976 he started releasing Eden bass amps and cabs. He designed all the Eden cabs and amps until 2010, when he left to start his new company - DNA. So all those Eden T, XLT, and XST cabs they've made, including the speakers used inside them, were designed by David Nordschow.
The DNA cabs (his current designs) use totally newly designed speakers and cabs that he designed after he sold-off Eden and started DNA. He was often called "David Eden" when he owned Eden. David is known for being conservative in his claims and is NOT known for falsifying test results. He has always made great sounding cabs and amps.
I think you can contact him by e-mail if you want to argue with him about speaker design and what he can or can't do, or you can do it in person at the NAMM shows. But you better know your sh*t. You'll need to if you want to keep up with him. Around here people like AgedHorse could carry on an intelligent discussion about designing cabs and amps with him, but not that many of the rest of us could. I sure can't. He's patented a number of his designs including a new D-class power section that he's implemented in his 1350-watt (RMS) 7-lb, mono-block amp appropriately named the DNA 1350. So he's no slouch.
Just because you can't imagine it can be done, doesn't mean he can't do it or hasn't already done it. If you haven't tried one of these cabs, you should. You probably won't believe it until you try it yourself. I can believe it because I have one of his DNS-410 cabs and I know how it sounds. It is amazing!
Bwahahahaha.....
Thats a good one. Eden under the direction of David Nordshow and now his new company are two of the worst spec inflaters in the industry. Find one measurement out there to prove their low end response or sensitivity claims and I might find a grain of seriousness towards his products.
