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Boost and Growl

A

awelti

Oct 21, 2008
22
3
#1
Has anyone out there tried the MK.4.23 Boost or the Holy Fire Overdrive pedal on a bass yet? Disclosure, I'm with Creation Audio... Most of us are bass players (sort of) and Mike here is pro, so we aim to make all our stuff go down to 20Hz and be good for bass... seems most of the people buying our stuff and reivewing it on the forums are guitar players, and I was wondering if bass players just aren't interested in adding a little boost and growl, or if maybe the word just hasn't gotten out about the MK.4.23 and Holy Fire to the bass community yet?

Here are a couple of links to a reviews by guitarist - I'd like to get some reviews from the bass community:

http://guitargear.org/2008/12/11/gear-review-creation-audio-labs-mk-423-clean-boost/

http://www.oldtonezone.com/2009/01/holy-fire-overdrive-distortion-demo/#more-329

Thanks,
skip
 
#2
You can't of looked too far. Grygrx the moderator of this effects forum has a website called Bassfuzz.com where he reviews pedals on bass. The clips are also on youtube. He did the Holy Fire.

Edit:

Also if your going to come into our forum specifically to generate discussion for your product, please at least read the rules.

You must declare that you are a commercial user in your profile so that it shows with every post you make.

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/faq.php?faq=commuserpolicy#faq_cup
 
#3
He also made several posts about the MK.4.23, as he had one of those too.

I think "the problem" with bass consumption of these goods is severalfold:

-The economy has made everyone a penny-pincher; guitarists can easily justify owning multiple OD pedals, but I think generally most bassists have a hard time justifying owning more than one. And they either already have one, or they are looking to buy something "known good", something popular. Kind of a catch-22.

-Creation hasn't really been marketing much. Ideally the goods would market themselves, but sometimes they need a push. I suppose that's part of your post here now. ;) I say that approvingly, not discouragingly--we like it when companies have a presence in the forum, for direct feedback and support.

-Until you guys went to direct sales, the prices were way high compared to other OD pedals that were already known and popular. I think many people may have turned away when the prices were high, and may not have known about the more recent price drops with the direct sales.

FWIW I'm into reviewing gear, check out the reviews link in my sig. I wouldn't put a review on my site since you don't make a compressor, but I'd happily post a detailed and thoughtful review here on TB, if you sent me one for that purpose. PM me if that interests you.

I mean to buy a Redeemer one of these days... :)
 
#4
Another thing that may work against you in the bass market:

Boosts are generally not as helpful to the average bass player as the average guitarist. Many people are running Solid State amps where there are no tubes to push into drive. Further the old issue of overcoming volume drops from poor bypass in certain pedals is becoming less of a problem as newer pedals generally have better bypass and less volume drop issues.

Dedicated power supply. Bass players seem to be especially picky about functional/practical issues and having tidy pedalboards. I don't think it would be unfair to say that a fair amount of Talkbass users would probablly overlook the Holy Fire entirely as soon they read the power requirements. Then some others who do buy it and fall in love with it would still be looking for something that sounds the same and has 9volt power to replace it.

Just checking your site aswell:

You don't have any clips/videos available of bass run through either of these pedals. We know better than to assume a good sounding guitar OD means a good sounding Bass OD. Further you have no bass playing endorsing artists who have used anything but the Redeemer. This might seem superficial. But as far as international purchasers go, we have to rely alot on word of mouth. There are simply less options to try before we buy. There needs to be a wealth of information to tip us into taking an expensive gamble.
 
#5
Hello Skip,
I mean no disrespect, I just want to give my honest opinion, so please do not take this as a rant. :) To be completely honest, a clean boost pedal sounds more like something for a guitarist who wants all of their higher register strings and solos to come through without distortion. In my opinion not really a bass-centric effect as many of us like some tone shaping to our boost. Two very famous boost pedals on these forums that I can think of are the Cream Pie Deluxe and the Electronix Submarine. There are so many different boost pedals that range from clean to mean to tone shaping and can get into the light/medum overdrive ranges. These pedals range in prices below, at, or even above the Mk 4.23... Personally, I find everything that I need in a boost within the Build Your Own Clone Triboost which has a modified Rangemaster (hi/mid/fullrange selectable boost), EHX LPB, and a mosfet based boost in it.

What I'm trying to say is that if you want to reach out to the bass community with your pedals, you need to prove to us why we want to pay $150 for this pedal.
One way would be to get some people to review this pedal for you. You could also demo it through a video and sound clips on your site. You could also start getting some current bassists to try the pedal and maybe get some endorsements going.

Obviously, I am also appreciative that more and more pedal building companies are making their presence known on these forums. Welcome to TalkBass! :)
 
#6
I bought a Mk4.23 last year, while trying out several other clean boost pedals. I put it in front of an o/d for an extra kick. Very pleased with it, but I'm apparently not the "typical" player. I will say that after trying out around 6 other boosts, The 4.23 exceeded my expectations, and will remain a part of my "utility" board from now on.
 
#8
icarussmicarus said:
Dedicated power supply. Bass players seem to be especially picky about functional/practical issues and having tidy pedalboards. I don't think it would be unfair to say that a fair amount of Talkbass users would probablly overlook the Holy Fire entirely as soon they read the power requirements. Then some others who do buy it and fall in love with it would still be looking for something that sounds the same and has 9volt power to replace it.
Click to expand...
Yeah, the voltage requirements and the price together were enough for me to consider it impractical. It looked cool. I'm sure it sounds great (another subtle hint that quality bass samples work wonders at encouraging GAS), but if it requires me to dedicate an entire wall-wart to power it plus costs a pretty penny, it's got to be light years better than the competition, and so far there hasn't been too much word of mouth on it proclaiming it to be significantly better than some of the alternatives which are much more compatible with my needs.:)
 
#9
They are both beautiful pedals but I find the MK4.23 to be bit on the large size for a clean boost. Something like the Catalinbread Serrano Picoso I find to be a bit more attractive. As a SS user if I'm going to have a clean boost...it's going to be in a loop and it's going to be small as not take up valuable space on my PB...Just my constructive criticism.
 
#11
Thanks for the feed-back and constructive ideas...

One problem I see with loaning out pedals to have reviews done is bias. I can understand, because the reviewer wants the builder to be happy so they will give them the next new pedal to review... I suspect even magazine reviews have to be politically correct, so as not to upset the builder and lose advertising dollars... But then mediocre pedals sometimes get stellar reviews, and that makes reviews in general less meaningful.

In the end, reviews that come from guys who have actually bought a pedal are best because you guys don't owe anybody any favors and can tell it like it is... I'm just hoping to encourage some of those guys to speak up...

I'm sure we can do something to add bass clips and bass players to the website...

One other thing, since we decided to sell direct, we do have a return policy - Here's the fine print: Link Removed. There is a 15% restocking fee (think of it as a rental fee). If you try it and love it (which I think you would), then great... if not, there is a way out...

Thanks,
skip
 
#13
awelti said:
Thanks for the feed-back and constructive ideas...

One problem I see with loaning out pedals to have reviews done is bias. I can understand, because the reviewer wants the builder to be happy so they will give them the next new pedal to review... I suspect even magazine reviews have to be politically correct, so as not to upset the builder and lose advertising dollars... But then mediocre pedals sometimes get stellar reviews, and that makes reviews in general less meaningful.

In the end, reviews that come from guys who have actually bought a pedal are best because you guys don't owe anybody any favors and can tell it like it is... I'm just hoping to encourage some of those guys to speak up...

I'm sure we can do something to add bass clips and bass players to the website...

One other thing, since we decided to sell direct, we do have a return policy - Here's the fine print: Link Removed. There is a 15% restocking fee (think of it as a rental fee). If you try it and love it (which I think you would), then great... if not, there is a way out...

Thanks,
skip
Click to expand...

People who buy the pedal are usually biased towards justifying the cost of the purchase, the more expensive the pedal, the worse the bias. Further they go through the honeymoon phase. So yes if you wait around for users to chime in, of course they are going to be positive, perhaps that is your perogative.

Seriously look at Bongomania's reviews. He doesn't play games, he says when something is good and something is bad, and in a fair,elequant and reasoned manner. He isn't worried about advertising dollars either. He will be honest, wether that helps you or not.
 
#14
Bongo's honesty and candor has brought down the ban hammer on him more than once, but that means that I trust his opinion no matter how brutal it is. Whenever I learn of a comp I've never heard of...I always check for a review on his site first.
 
#17
I would love to get a Holy Fire but as bongo said ..times are hard and I already have an OD on-board. Creation Audio seems like an awesome company but for me personally I can't justify getting someone else without losing something right now. When work picks up again I wil definitely grab a Holy Fire.
 
#18
My options on the Holy Fire on bass (well documented I think)
1) Low Gain Tones are great.
2) Mid-Higher Gain are pretty average.
3) Unique power supply is not pedal board friendly.
4) I felt a little burned after buying one and watching the price drop over $100.
 
#19
grygrx said:
4) I felt a little burned after buying one and watching the price drop over $100.
Click to expand...

I felt the same way last fall when my son saved-up lawn-mowing money and I helped go in halves on an X-Box 360. Then the price dropped over $100 about a month later... Not to mention - I can go out and buy a better lap-top today for $800 less than I paid for this one just two years ago...

With the Holy Fire it wasn't that the price was dropped, but rather the dealers, which needed all that margin in order to compete with each other... don't get me wrong, they tried real hard to make it work, but it was just too expensive - and we parted on good terms - maybe someday they will be back on-board when times are better... for now, it's direct only, and it will probably be that way for a while longer...

Skip
 

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