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Double Bass Can one amp/rig really cover both worlds?

Nate74

Nate74

Mar 3, 2007
789
78
DFW
#1
I have an EB rig that I love. A Demeter preamp into a Stewart World 2.1 power amp into an Eden 210XLT or Aguilar GS112. I recently started playing an EUB in an Irish Folk project and while my amp setup seems "OK" it's not quite as mind blowing as it is with my EBs. I added a ToneBone PZ Pre which changed the tone for the better, but it's still not talking to me.

So for all of you who do double duty, can one rig handle both well? I guess I'm assuming that a rig that is good for UB would also be well suited for EUB.

I also have to say that if the answer is sell the Demeter and Steward and get one of the new-fangled class D heads that put out 1000 watts and weigh 18oz, I'd be pretty open to that ;)

Any thoughts would be appreciated.
 
#2
Sometimes it's hard to find a good doubling amp, and sometimes it's not...it depends on a lot of variables to include, but not limited to the following:

-What kind of bass (carved, ply, hybrid), pickup and or mic, and strings are on your upright?

-What kind of gigs? Do they require arco, pizz, slap, all of the above?

-How loud do you need it to go? Big rooms, small rooms, outdoors?

-How much bread do you have?

-How patient are you?

To sum up: What kind of sound quality and volume level do you need from the pork chop and the bull fiddle respectively?

I have an old first edition AI Contra that sounds great with uprights- it sounds great for electric bass too but it's not terribly loud...with an extra cab or house support it would do fine.

I also have a Shen SB80 strung with gut and sportin a K and K Bassmax- sounds great through anything! A friend has an old SWR Workingmans 15 that pulls double duty with this bass- I could prolly even use my SVT rig with it! :D

YMMV and all that...

Oh, and FWIW- IMO most any amp that works with a slab will cover an EUB, but not necessarily doghouse...again ymmv...

Joe
 
#3
I am a 50/50 doubler for a living. I think that your pre/power amp are great. It's the speaker choice that doesn't suit upright as well. I use (and helped design ) the EA Doubler which is a great amp, but I also have a Demeter which sounds awesome for either. My suggestion would be
check out the micro amps--many are great including obviously the EA, but also Tecamp, some of the Markbass stuff, and the Genz Shuttles. To me, the EA sounds best (which is why I endorse them) but the others mentioned have models with more available power. The Doubler is cool unless you play some wicked loud electric gigs. Which I do. I'm likely going to get a digital Peavey or Crest power amp to go with my Demeter for my loud gigs. Some of the best doubling speakers are the Thunderchilds and some of the older EA's. I have owned all of the EA stuff and the only speaker I kept was the CXL112. It needs some eq to really get it hoppin" but works great for both. The Thunderchild is probably the best all around doubling speaker I've ever heard. But I have to state---I endorse Thunderchild and build composite cabs for them. But I wouldn't endorse them if they didn't fit my needs. To be honest, I've been offered endorsements with Markbass and Acoustic Image but turned them down because they didn't fit my needs. If I only played electric I might have gone with Markbass---but I don't like them for upright. And I don't dig their speakers. That's the hard part----the speakers. That's why I'm building my own in composite. I build my own 8"er and 12 in composite for small to louder gigs and the Thunderchild when I have to pull out all of the stops. I'm pretty excited abut a new double 8 with tweeter cab I;m making this week. Kindof like a more hifi version of the EA VL208. That weighs 20#
I can get by with quite a few amps---but only a very small group of speakers will work for me. Man---I'm starting to get nostalgic for a simpler time---jonesin' for a Polytone Mini Brute.
 
#5
Nate74 said:
So for all of you who do double duty, can one rig handle both well? I guess I'm assuming that a rig that is good for UB would also be well suited for EUB.
Click to expand...
In the end, it's personal preference. Let me say up front that I don't gig much, but when I do, I play a variety of instruments - electric guitar, double bass, electric bass, keyboards - and I use an Acoustic Image Ten2 for everything.

I figure that I've bought a combo amp that's about as clean and honest as I can reasonably expect to find for money that I can afford (I bought it used), and if I want something other than the sound of what I'm putting in, but louder, to come out of the speaker, it's my job to figure out how to get that sound via an amp simulator, the built-in effects or a pedal, etc.

That's just one way to look at things, I realize, but it works for me. I happen to like, e.g., the sound of my MIM Precision straight into my Ten2, no effects and no EQ except the tone control on the bass, and I'd just as soon change my sound by putting different strings on my instrument or playing it differently as by any other means.

I know, for some people, my logic would be flawed - the AI just doesn't have enough punch for them, and if I played a lot of metal, I think I'd probably want something else, but for what I do, the Ten2 is perfect - it's basically a small PA that'll handle anything I throw at it.

-S-
 
#6
Some great input guys. Thanks. I sort of like the idea of sticking with my pre/power combination and just swapping out cabs, though eventually I'd like to find a gigging situation where I am playing both EB and UB/EUB.
 
#7
Nate74 said:
Some great input guys. Thanks. I sort of like the idea of sticking with my pre/power combination and just swapping out cabs, though eventually I'd like to find a gigging situation where I am playing both EB and UB/EUB.
Click to expand...

Nate,
Unless, you're playing really loud a TC 112 is the perfect compliment to your power amp and pre amp. It's well worth the money, for a one stop doubling cabinet.

Ric
 
#8
This feedback has been most helpful. I too need an awesome dbl duty amp! I play straight ahead trio gigs to loud punchy elec latin and reggae gigs where the bass must cut thru! Would love a Walter Woods Ultra, but not sure if that's the way to go? I know its a killer amp..........Presently I'm using an Eden WT800 w SWR 4x10 Goliath & Eden 2x10 XLT cabs for elec, and Acoustic Image Clarus 2R w Bag end 15 cab & a GK 150S combo amp. Your ideas, opinions, suggestions etc are most appreciated.......btw I also use a Music Man 5string Sting Ray, and a German 7/8 DB with D'addario hybrids...(I am however experimenting with other db strings). thanks.
 
#9
Jadag said:
This feedback has been most helpful. I too need an awesome dbl duty amp! I play straight ahead trio gigs to loud punchy elec latin and reggae gigs where the bass must cut thru! Would love a Walter Woods Ultra, but not sure if that's the way to go? I know its a killer amp..........
Click to expand...


Jadag
I own a Walter Woods Ultra and it's a great amp, but their very pricey now. They do often come up used on ebay and talkbass. Of all the "micro amps" out there the Tecamp is less expensive than the Woods by about $700.00 and has lots of power. So that's certainly a consideration.

Ric





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#11
I agree with Mike Arnopol. Your pre and power are probably fine. Although you might need a buffer pre if your EUB has a Piezo pickup. You need something in the 4 -10 megohm range for a Piezo pickup.
I think the speakers are the problem too. I've owned the XLT
2x10. Not a box I'd ever use for upright bass. Along with the Thunderchild, you might look at the Baer ML112 boxes. They're a 12/6 speaker box. Its an excellent doubling cab. Small, light weight, and takes a lot of volume.
 
#12
I gig regularly on EB, DB and tuba. For EB & DB, I have a Carvin MB-12 that is very clean and neutral and has all the features a gigging musican needs. When I need that extra bottom 1/2 octave to carry a room, I have a 1X15 ported cab to add that also sounds great with both. If I need anything larger, the amp has a clean line out to the house system. I've either sold or relegated to other duties my other bass amplification gear.
 
#13
Jadag said:
I will check out the Tecamp amps. .......but I would jump at the opportunity of getting a Walter Woods Ultra! What do you think about the GK1001RB?
Click to expand...

Jadag,
Personally, I'm not a GK endorser . I liked their earlier amps like the little 200MB and 400RB. Mike and B String right on the money in regards to your speakers though. Even if you had a Walter Woods Ultra that Eden 210 XLT won't sound great for Double Bass. I've tried that combination.
 
#15
Jadag said:
I will check out the Tecamp amps. .......but I would jump at the opportunity of getting a Walter Woods Ultra! What do you think about the GK1001RB?
Click to expand...

I think the 1001 is decent for both EB and URB, but its just a single channel amp...to me a real doubling amp needs 2 pres.

I use a Genz ShuttleMax 12.0...the 9.2 is cool as well...2 great channel, separate fx loops for each channel, and a master fx loop...tons of power, super light. I'm endorsed by Genz, but like Mike, I endorse 'em because I love 'em. AudioKinesis, fEARful/greenboy and Barefaced make the best cabs out there, period, IMO :)
 
#16
Ric Vice said:
Jadag,
Personally, I'm not a GK endorser . I liked their earlier amps like the little 200MB and 400RB. Mike and B String right on the money in regards to your speakers though. Even if you had a Walter Woods Ultra that Eden 210 XLT won't sound great for Double Bass. I've tried that combination.
Click to expand...

You're right! I have an Acoustic Image Clarus (not a WW I know) that I've used with my 2x10 Eden XLT, and I didn't like it.
However I did p/up a Bag End 15 cab several months ago, which I like, but now not so happy with the Acoustic Image! Any ideas how the Aguilar amps work with DB?.....(I've never played one). Thanks for the help!
 
#17
dukeorock said:
I think the 1001 is decent for both EB and URB, but its just a single channel amp...to me a real doubling amp needs 2 pres.

I use a Genz ShuttleMax 12.0...the 9.2 is cool as well...2 great channel, separate fx loops for each channel, and a master fx loop...tons of power, super light. I'm endorsed by Genz, but like Mike, I endorse 'em because I love 'em. AudioKinesis, fEARful/greenboy and Barefaced make the best cabs out there, period, IMO :)
Click to expand...

I will check them out. Thanks
 
#18
I ended up with a Shuttle 6.0 with the 2x10 cabinet and am loving it. Found both used for a pretty good deal. Played EUB on St. Patrick's Day, upright at a practice and electric with a blues/rock project and it was great at all 3. Very happy and now ready to say good-bye to some other gear to boot!
 

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