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Carol Kaye Controversey Solved?

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#101
By the most fortuitous of coincidences, I get home today to find that my lovely 11 year old daughter has given me the DVD of Standing in the Shadows of Motown for my birthday. She has no idea who Jamerson or the Funk Brothers are, she just somehow felt this was something Dad would like.

So rather than say anything more on this thread right now, that's where I'm gonna be this evening ....
 
#107
Originally posted by BassLand
This is worth mentioning, just because I point someone to a link on the internet I am not 100% responsible for what information is on that link, I did not write it, I just pointed you to it...
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The question is not whether your wrote it, it's whether you read it. It doesn't really matter though. :D
 
#108
Happy B-day Richard...you're gonna dig that DVD man!

I think I got this thing figured out, and sorry if somebody already pointed this out.

It's very interesting about this TCB (Takin' Care of Business) TV show. It's clearly stated by Motown's west coast musical director that the tracks were re-recorded for the Motown artists appearances for that show, and that Carol played on those sessions.

Carol says she was played "demos" of the tunes in question, and therefore she must have been playing on the released tracks and not making demos herself, because you "never make a demo from a demo". Very true.

But dig...she wasn't being played demos. She was being played the actual tracks as played by the Funk Bros., and asked to duplicate the parts for the TCB TV show tracks.

She says herself that at the time she lived very close to the studios where she recorded, and never had time to listen to the radio. Those studio cats spent upwards of 18-20 hours a day cutting tracks. She may not have even realized that these tunes had already been released.

Make sense?
 
#109
Originally posted by Richard Lindsey
By the most fortuitous of coincidences, I get home today to find that my lovely 11 year old daughter has given me the DVD of Standing in the Shadows of Motown for my birthday. She has no idea who Jamerson or the Funk Brothers are, she just somehow felt this was something Dad would like.

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Happy Birthday, dude. I went out to buy the Led Zeppelin DVD today; all over town it is sold out, so I ended up buying the Standing in the Shadows of Motown DVD.
 
#110
You guys are not going to believe this.I finaly caught up with the Lochness monster(a very nice guy to)well he informed me that it was neither Carole or Jamerson that played on the songs in question,it was him and because he was a monster they thought no one would believe him.and he has proof to back it up(he has pics of all the sessions.so what do you know.The controversy really is solved. :p
 
#111
Originally posted by Craig Garfinkel
Happy B-day Richard...you're gonna dig that DVD man!

I think I got this thing figured out, and sorry if somebody already pointed this out.

It's very interesting about this TCB (Takin' Care of Business) TV show. It's clearly stated by Motown's west coast musical director that the tracks were re-recorded for the Motown artists appearances for that show, and that Carol played on those sessions.

Carol says she was played "demos" of the tunes in question, and therefore she must have been playing on the released tracks and not making demos herself, because you "never make a demo from a demo". Very true.

But dig...she wasn't being played demos. She was being played the actual tracks as played by the Funk Bros., and asked to duplicate the parts for the TCB TV show tracks.

She says herself that at the time she lived very close to the studios where she recorded, and never had time to listen to the radio. Those studio cats spent upwards of 18-20 hours a day cutting tracks. She may not have even realized that these tunes had already been released.

Make sense?
Click to expand...

Makes sense to me, that is what I was trying to say earlier (just not as well).
 
#112
Originally posted by SMASH
Good one Craig.

BTW, that isn't sarcasm.
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I can dig it, Smash...that's not sarcasm, this is:

quoting Jauqo III-X

You guys are not going to believe this.I finaly caught up with the Lochness monster(a very nice guy to)well he informed me that it was neither Carole or Jamerson that played on the songs in question,it was him and because he was a monster they thought no one would believe him.and he has proof to back it up(he has pics of all the sessions.so what do you know.The controversy really is solved.

I know you're just trying to interject a little humor here J, but it is a subject that I believe is pretty serious, especially to James' friends and family and the surviving Funk Brothers.

The Loch Ness Monster? Well that's a fantasy until proven as fact.

Carol Kaye playing on the originally released track of "Bernadette"?

That's just fantasy...period.
 
#113
Originally posted by JAUQO III-X
You guys are not going to believe this.I finaly caught up with the Lochness monster(a very nice guy to)well he informed me that it was neither Carole or Jamerson that played on the songs in question,it was him and because he was a monster they thought no one would believe him.and he has proof to back it up(he has pics of all the sessions.so what do you know.The controversy really is solved. :p
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Cool!

Can you ask him what it was like working with Joely Richardson in Loch Ness?

:D
 
#114
With all due respect.this issue is just going in circles.and the issue is much deeper than some of us in this lifetime can grasp.I have on a zillion occasions had the chance to sit one on one(or via phone)with Carole and ask her anything that comes to mind and for me personaly it's something(and Im only speaking for myself)I am not interested in investigating,because it is what it is,a controversy that will continue on way past my departure.I love both Carole and Jamerson's bass playing and will continue to do so.why not they both move me.I have talked to Chuck Rainey(who will be appearing on my soon to be released debut CD)and he has shared his views with me on the topic and they are what they are.can we all just respect the great work these two talented Bassists have given us?I hope I haven't offended anyone.
 
#116
I dig where you're coming from Jauqo, and it's all cool. You certainly havn't offended me, and I doubt anyone else here.

But I still feel this is a legitimate debate that can and is being pursued with both thought and concern. And it's been pretty civil too (at least in this thread as of late).

Yes we can and should give both of these fine bassists their due, and with respect. But that's kinda the point of this whole discussion...dig?

It's not about choosing sides. At least not to me.
 
#117
Originally posted by JAUQO III-X
With all due respect.this issue is just going in circles.and the issue is much deeper than some of us in this lifetime can grasp.
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With equal respect, after reading everything I could find on the topic, and especially after watching SITSOM and seeing how Jamerson's peers spoke about him and what they did ... see, I don't think the issue is that "deep" at all. This thing doesn't have to be made into an Area 51 sized conspiracy theory. It's not rocket science, and it's not Cold War espionage. Either Jamerson did those tracks or he didn't. AFAIAC the overwhelming evidence says Jamerson did those tracks, and the only reason the issue might seem so "deep" is that it has been needlessly and pointlessly complicated by other parties. I'm not getting into the motivations or psychological makeup of anyone involved, and I'm certainly not putting the onus for this controversy this on you personally. I just don't see how any reasonable person could come to another conclusion than the one I just listed, given the state of the available evidence.

None of this means that I don't deeply respect the contributions *both* Kaye and Jamerson have made to our instrument. I do, and so, I'd venture to say, do most if not all of the posters on this thread. It's quite possible to feel that way, with full sincerity, and still feel that this controversy is a crock.
 
#120
Originally posted by JAUQO III-X
With all due respect.this issue is just going in circles.and the issue is much deeper than some of us in this lifetime can grasp.
Click to expand...

I agree with what Richard said on this - but my first thought was hell no - this is in fact a very petty and shallow debate, that is entirely unnecessary.

All any reasonably competent bass player needs do, is listen to the tracks and it is immediately apparent who plays what and the differences in styles - very simple!
 
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