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chords

#21
Binnie said:
W, H, W, H, W, H, W Is the Minor Scale Stepping ?
Click to expand...

Not quite.

Let's say we're in A minor. That has all natural notes, just like the C major scale.

So we start on the root and work our way up:

A B C D E F G

easy huh?

So the intervals between each note from root is as follows:

T S T T S T T

T = tone (whole step, or two frets)
S = semitone (half step, or one fret)

If you were to start on any given note and played this formula, or series of intervals, you would have a minor (or Aeolian if we're talking modes) scale. Note that the root note along with the scale formula determines the key.
 
#23
Binnie said:
I just tried asking my friend the question ( "does it matter where the Gmajor starts from(E3/E12)"). He replied it's played on e12 but can't explain why it is played here, can anyone shead some light on this please?
Click to expand...

E12? Do you mean the 12th fret E string? That wouldn't be the start, if you were meaning to start from the root note of the scale. If you were meaning to start from the VI degree of the scale (being the note E) then yes, you could start from the 12th fret on the E string if you wanted to.
 
#24
Yes the 12th Fret on the E string. sorry my way of putting things down on paper seems to be only understandable by me.

SO if I wanted to Start from The root Note "E" i could choose anywhere on the fretboard covering that note?

E string - 12 / open?

yea i just relised that question was flawed.
 
#25
Umm, it depends entirely on which key you wish to play the major scale (or indeed any other scale) in.

So you start on any given note and play, from the first note,

T T S T T T S

and you will arrive at the octave of the root note. It's not the starting note that makes the scale major or minor, it's the intervals of each note after it. Change one note and you have a different scale. If you were to start on E and play those intervals, you would play the E major scale.
 
#27
They're pretty much the same thing.

Key of C major - C D E F G A B

Where C is the root note and major is the formula of intervals following it.

Key of G major - G A B C D E F#

Where G is the root note and major is the formula of intervals following it.

Note here that whilst the root note changes the formula is the same - however you are still in a different key (C major and G major respectively).


You have also what's called a relative minor. It's the same series of notes, with a different root.

A minor - A B C D E F G

Same notes as C major, but different root. Because they use the same notes we call this the relative minor. The relative minor of G major is E minor. Uses the same notes but has a different root.

If you start on E and play the notes of G major, you'll have

E F# G A B C D

The intervals between the notes are: T S T T S T T - the same intervals as the minor scale (it is the minor scale). Therefore G major and E minor are related (E minor is the relative minor of G major).

I hope that isn't confusing.
 
#29
It's actually pretty easy.

The key of C major = the major scale with the root note being C.

Ok, here's another:

Key of A major = the major scale with A as it's root note.

A few more:

G major = the major scale with G as the root.

A minor = the minor scale with A as the root.

F# minor = minor scale with F# as the root.


Getting it?


On that page you're reading, each major scale goes across as the root of each chord, and from those root notes and using notes from that specific scale those chords are derived using notes from that particular key.

Ok, so let's look at it a bit closer.

C I
D II
E III
F IV
G V
A VI
B VII

The roman numerals are scale degrees, with I being the root (C), III being the 3rd (E) and V being the 5th (G).

These three notes (C, E, G) played simultaneously gives us the C major chord. Chords are generally built from a root, the 3rd and 5th of any given scale. Different scales give us different chords.

If we take the II scale degree (D) and a 3rd above that (IV, which is F) and the 5th above that (VI, which is A) you get another chord. This one is Dm. If you look at the interval between it's root (D) and it's 3rd (F) you'll notice it is 3 frets apart, or 1 1/2 tones or steps. This particular interval is called a minor third. If you look at the relationship of the root and the 5th (A), you'll notice the interval is 7 frets, or 3 1/2 tones or steps. This interval is known as a perfect 5th, or more commonly just the 5th. Therefore, with it's root, minor 3rd and 5th we have a D minor chord. Going back to C, the distance between it's root (C) and it's 3rd (E) is 4 frets, or 2 tones or steps. This interval is known as a major third. Thus with the 5th (the note G) in there as well we get a C major chord. This continues along through the scale.

Make sense?
 
#30
Binnie said:
now i've just gone and completely lost myself with keys now.

I was looking at this site http://www.cyberfretbass.com/theory/major-key-harmony/page2.php, and the tables just threw me off the plot completely.
Click to expand...

Sometimes I've found if you go too far into this stuff initially it can be a little overwhelming. What that chart is showing you is that in the key of say "C" the II chord that is contained in that scale. The II chord is always minor and in this case is Dm.

The II is just a way to refer to the 2nd note of the particular scale you are using. It is going to be the same with the modes that go along also but instead of II it would be D Dorian which would be a minor mode.

I'm not well versed in this either so this is a test to see if I'm full of crap or understand it. ;)
 
#32
now i've just gone and completely lost myself with keys now.

I was looking at this site http://www.cyberfretbass.com/theory/...mony/page2.php, and the tables just threw me off the plot completely.
Click to expand...

What you have there is a chart of Diatonic chords.

We will work in the key of C for simplicities sake...

You already know that you get chords by "stacking thirds" so this is how that chart is made/used...

The bold letters represent chord tones, the other ones are scale tones (tones the key of C but not the chord)

C major or I
C - D - E - F - G - A - B - C

D minor or ii
C - D - E - F - G - A - B - C

E minor or iii
C - D - E - F - G - A - B - C

F major or IV
C - D - E - F - G - A - B - C

G major or V
C - D - E - F - G - A - B - C - D

A minor or vi
C - D - E - F - G - A - B - C- D - E

B diminished or vii
C - D - E - F - G - A - B - C - D - E - F

You could change the key but you would still be stacking thirds and you would still get major, minor, minor, major, major, minor, diminished

Notice how because of the W, W, H, W, W, W, H pattern even though you are stacking every other note some of the thirds (the second bold notes) fall closer to the root or closer to the fifth. When it falls closer to the root (the first bold note) it sounds minor, when it falls closer to the fifth (the 3rd bold note) it sounds major. Diminished is strange...it has a minor (or flat) 3rd and a flat 5.

Major chord:

G
F#
F
E
D#
D
C#
C

Minor chord:

G
F#
F
E
D#
D
C#
C

Another Major Chord (with A as the root):

E
D#
D
C#
C
B
A#
A

Another Minor Chord (with A as the root):

E
D#
D
C#
C
B
A#
A

Notice how the C major and the A minor chords are both in the key of C (or diatonic to the key of C), where as the C minor and A major chords are not.

BTW dude you are attempting to soak up basically a whole semester of basic music theory in a day :) so you are doing quite well.
 
#34
im just basically writing it down all on paper and going to stick it around my room, just seems less hastle trying to get it all down on paper before i start trying to study it, at least ill get bits and pieces in my head before i start properly.
 
#35
Get a keyboard. Or write a couple octaves of one on a piece of paper. It'll make more sense that way. And play the scales and chords on the keyboard, or your bass if you don't have one. It'll allow you to hear what's going on with the chords and scales and it'll make more sense.

6:37 am. Time for 4 hours sleep then work Xmas lunch. G'night/morning... zzzzzzz...
 
#36
Binnie, it may be helpful for you to spend some time examining how different keys are laid out on a piano and compare to how they lay on the bass neck. Make sure you can play a note on the piano and then find it on your bass. In terms of geography they are vastly different, but beneath the differences, the abstract rules of "keys" are the same.

Piano is useful for examining theory because each key looks physically different, and you can't confuse one pitch for another. Fretted instruments are confusing because there are a variety of places to play the same pitches.

On the other hand, Fretted instruments are useful for examining theory because you can see the symmetry of a scale in any key; and a piano can confuse you because the symmetry is hard to see on the keyboard.

also, for clarity, if you are discussing theory, and begin throwing out letters and numbers, most people will assume you are speaking of scale degrees, chord tones or chords. NOT frets and strings.
 
#37
BTW I learned all this stuff and I was like "Sweet I finally get it! Time to make music!" WRONG

The next step is to memorize the fingerings for all these chords (major, major6, major7,dominant7, minor, minor7, diminished, augmented)

As well as the major and minor, and pentatonic major and minor scales.

Then the modes, and inversions....

In other words none of this will do you any good unless you spend a lot of time "teaching it to your fingers"
 

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