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Click In Your Ears or Not?

jaywa

jaywa

May 5, 2008
7,702
283
Iowa City, IA
#1
Apologies if this is in the wrong forum (maybe Live Sound?) and also for the vague title but what I'm wondering is: if you're in a situation (as I am at my church) where you have the click track as a channel you can control in your personal mix, do you take none, some, or a lot? When we first started using the click, I would mute it, knowing the drummer had it and figuring I would just follow him (I'm kinda old school that way). Plus I figured if the drummer got off the click it was more important I follow him than stick to the click and torpedo the rhythm section. More recently though I find if I turn up the click to where it's just under the rest of the drum kit in my ears, it helps me. It also helps if there are instances (rare) where I need to keep time without the drums playing.

In any event I never have the click just pounding in my ear but I do find having it underneath helps and especially if it's set up to click subdivisions (i.e. 8ths vs. quarter or half notes).

What are others' experiences or best practices with this?
 
#2
I'd always prefer to do without, but have found that if it's going to be there and the producer is going to hold you to it, then you and the drummer should both lean on it and make it your friend as best possible. If you play with the same drummer enough, the click can become like an extra percussionist - not necessary, but useful.
 
#3
Long story short; I prefer to lock with the drummer. When the drummer is not present I become the beat master and changing the settings for each song is something I really do not want to get into. Yes I hate it when the drummer is absent and I'm the beat master...

When I'm the beat master I lock with the lead vocalists and rely upon the lyric flow for my groove pattern. I have not used a click track, in a live performance enough to feel comfortable using one. Simple as that.
 
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#4
jaywa said:
Apologies if this is in the wrong forum (maybe Live Sound?) and also for the vague title but what I'm wondering is: if you're in a situation (as I am at my church) where you have the click track as a channel you can control in your personal mix, do you take none, some, or a lot? When we first started using the click, I would mute it, knowing the drummer had it and figuring I would just follow him (I'm kinda old school that way). Plus I figured if the drummer got off the click it was more important I follow him than stick to the click and torpedo the rhythm section. More recently though I find if I turn up the click to where it's just under the rest of the drum kit in my ears, it helps me. It also helps if there are instances (rare) where I need to keep time without the drums playing.

In any event I never have the click just pounding in my ear but I do find having it underneath helps and especially if it's set up to click subdivisions (i.e. 8ths vs. quarter or half notes).

What are others' experiences or best practices with this?
Click to expand...

IMHO, the drummers - ONLY - should have that click in their headphones. And the drummers should be capable (!) and comfortable(!) playing with the click.
If you have no drummers - then the bass player should take that responsibility with the click track,
or
just play without any click.
 
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#6
rufus.K said:
Can you route the click thru a volume pedal to your personal feed?
Click to expand...
In my situation we each have an app on our phones that lets us set our own in-ear mix. It's basically the FOH board on your phone and you can adjust each channel (including click) up or down. Given a situation where it was click at a set volume or no click at all, I would probably go with no click and follow the drummer cause it drives me nuts if it's too loud.
 
#7
jaywa said:
In my situation we each have an app on our phones that lets us set our own in-ear mix
Click to expand...

Maybe I am old-fashioned but I am trying to understand this.

If your drummer can comfortably play with the click, why do you need to have a click track.
I would try to do my best to play the bass-line that is suited for the song, the drummer's feel, tone, other instruments' tones, feel, dynamics, etc...
I would not listen to the click and the drummer both.
I would spend my energy on trying to weave my bass-line into the current song's/band's texture.
It's only my opinion and I'm not talking about serious instrumental/jazz music.
 
#8
MalcolmAmos said:
Long story short; I prefer to lock with the drummer. When the drummer is not present I become the beat master and changing the settings for each song is something I really do not want to get into. Yes I hate it when the drummer is absent and I'm the beat master...

When I'm the beat master I lock with the lead vocalists and rely upon the lyric flow for my groove pattern. I have not used a click track, in a live performance enough to feel comfortable using one. Simple as that.
Click to expand...

Did the OP specify live playing in the question? I've never played live with a click and I wouldn't. The click exists to make punches and edits easier in editing software when cutting tracks - no other reason I could think of.
 
#10
Picking up here with a different senerio.

So here's my issue, I am in a band where I as the bass player need to have the click, we use a Korg Electribe and run sequences, because there are parts of the music where my drummer is not playing or at least not holding down the beat, I need the click. We are not in a position financially for the whole band to be using in-ear monitors, I would also like to not need a mixer as I only need the click and am hoping to rely on the stage monitor and my cabinet and stage sound for everything else. I want to find a pair of earbuds that I can have only the click and still hear my bass cabinet and stage monitor well, basically the only thing in my ear is the click. I am also open to find other solutions and methods, but i don't want to wear bulky headphones because they WILL fall off...I am very active on stage!
 
#11
I practice with a metronome and yes I do record with a click in my ear even if I record with a backing track.

Most tune only have one metric and one bpm so it isn't very hard to setup but a Dream Theater song is quite a challenge to setup correctly since it changes often.

Also ... you never ever follow someone else, if you do, you'll always be behind. No you want to be in sync and the only time I trusted someone else to setup the tempo is when I had a conductor in classical music ... you get in sync with what he want, never follow a drummer.
 
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#12
We also use a click track at my church. It's routed through the behringer aviom equivalent where I mix my own ears. I would love to leave it muted but my MD insists I have it on. My philosophy has always been play with the drummer but with different players of differing skill levels it can be helpful. I don't love it but I'm making due.
 
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#13
I haven't used click live, but I like having the click when practicing before recording, and then recording to the drum track with no click. I feel that the click helps me learn the song, but ultimately it's not part of the music, and I need to work with the drums.

edit: so live, I would probably let the drummer have the click to himself. At least with my usual drummer.
 
#15
The worship leader at my church has been considering the use of a click track for the band. I'm not concerned about it for myself because I don't use a monitor. I grew up playing music with a band in college... so I got used to playing without a monitor (due to being poor) and to be honest, I wouldn't have it any other way.

Playing in a church setting is very different from playing in a band. As noted by the statement about varying skill levels. One thing that you learn quickly is that a band can only become as good as it's weakest member. The better players have to "play down" (to some extent) to the weakest member's ability level.

If the weakest member can't play with a click track, and you're right on top of the beat with the click track... then you're music is going to sound like garbage. That would be my #1 caution about a live sound click track. Let the music go where it goes, it's your job as the bass player to unite the rhythm with the guitars/keys/vox. In a church setting, that can be a tall order indeed.
 
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#16
I played in an original band that used backing tracks for either keyboard or guitar as we could not find a fourth member. The singer switched between guitar and keys. Only the drummer had in ears. He got the click -- four clicks for him, then he clicks us in four more and we start. He had to keep a hi hat or ride going for us anytime there wasn't a drumbeat going, but it worked fine.

Obviously we weren't going to route the click track into our floor wedge monitors, but we got the rest of the backing tracks.
 
#17
Clef_de_fa said:
...
Also ... you never ever follow someone else, if you do, you'll always be behind. No you want to be in sync and the only time I trusted someone else to setup the tempo is when I had a conductor in classical music ... you get in sync with what he want, never follow a drummer.
Click to expand...

Don't quite understand - if you follow a click, why wouldn't you be behind that also?

I always followed the drummer and never got behind.

-
 
#20
CRich0205 said:
My philosophy has always been play with the drummer but with different players of differing skill levels it can be helpful. I don't love it but I'm making due.
Click to expand...
Same here... I PREFER not to use it, but that is very dependent on drummer skill. I monitor the click FAR more at church - lots of young kids "learning", but seldom on secular gigs.
I have been known to if the drummer warrants it. We put it into our IEM mix... all we have to do is bump the level (from zero) if any of us wants to play to it.
 
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