Club Alleva-Coppolo (Part 14)

[vision]

Wow... I'm also very disappointed to see he took the super hard line on this.

+1...I could see if it was a last minute cancel after the bass had been painted and was ready to go, but if he knew about this months ago and it still hasn't gone to paint I would think he could easily just move this order to the next person in line.

 

[Chef]

Really, even if it was painted, with a 14 month-ish wait, anything that wasn't a freak show combination of woods and colors would sell.

That's a drag.

 

[vision]

Really, even if it was painted, with a 14 month-ish wait, anything that wasn't a freak show combination of woods and colors would sell.

That's a drag.

Definitely. But I could at least understand if it was painted because at that point it is and order that is "customized" for someone else. But yeah - the worse case scenario there is that someone would get a chance to get a new LG4 without waiting 14 months.

 

[Chef]

I respectfully disagree.
If it was painted any normal color, it would sell.

Mopar metallic lime green, yeah, there's an issue there.
Any standard color: no issue. Take it to Namm. Put it on the website.

Much better, IMO, to deal with a potential future customer respectfully than run him-and maybe others who hear about this business model-off for some other potential purchase.

 

[Andrew Jones]

Perhaps,,,if you suggested getting your money back post sale of the axe to it's new owner???

That way the refund would be less out of pocket for Jimmy......


Aj

 

[Vic]

Yeah, I think it all boils down to the fact that the bass is so early on in its cycle, that there's absolutely nothing about it that would create a problem for Jimmy to sell it to anyone else, which is why I can't understand his ultra-hard line on this.

That said, there are always two sides to every story... if there's "perspective changing" information we're not privy to, I'd like to hear about it, but I can't really imagine what that could be.

 

[vision]

Yeah, I think it all boils down to the fact that the bass is so early on in its cycle, that there's absolutely nothing about it that would create a problem for Jimmy to sell it to anyone else, which is why I can't understand his ultra-hard line on this.

That said, there are always two sides to every story... if there's "perspective changing" information we're not privy to, I'd like to hear about it, but I can't really imagine what that could be.

+1 on all points.

 

[TimothyGroovy]

+2 on all points...:scowl:

It is way too harsh......... and I believe he can definitely sell whatever he make considers the demands from the circle......:scowl:

 

[icemangee]

I proposed Jimmy that i'll wait until he sell the bass & I don't need the money right away but he refused
He wrote me on the email "Let me know if I should build the bass as a basic, a classic or a 1600. At this point the only other choice that you have will be to forfiet your deposit."

 

[vision]

I proposed Jimmy that i'll wait until he sell the bass & I don't need the money right away but he refused
He wrote me on the email "Let me know if I should build the bass as a basic, a classic or a 1600. At this point the only other choice that you have will be to forfiet your deposit."

 

[jonno1707]

If I were you I would have Jimmy build/finish the basic (most affordable option) LG in the most common color as to keep cost down and increase market share.

 

[Chef]

I'm sorry, but I don't understand that at all, and find it 100% unacceptable, for all the reasons I've mentioned earlier.

If this is in fact accurate-and I'm not trying to call anyone out; it's just that this is all second and third hand info here on a forum-then this is not someone I'd choose do business with anymore.

This seems to be a lose/lose position for everyone involved in terms of good, or even fair to both parties, business practice.
Perhaps there's something I'm misunderstanding here...

 

[vision]

What is the industry standard for situations like this? If you order an NYC Sadowsky or an MTD and pay the deposit is it completely nonrefundable? I've heard about some companies where you pay the deposit when ordering and the deposit is refundable until you get to the actual build cycle.

 

[Vic]

If I wee you I would have him build/finish the basic (most affordable option)in the most common color as to keep cost down and increase market share.

Definitely. If he's gonna' force icemangee to choose, make it the most generally appealing and affordable thing you possibly can. I'd recommend a standard 3 tone sunburst, and maybe a black guard. Looks like the basic does come with the full preamp and passive tone, and I think those will be important for resale.

 

[Vic]

What is the industry standard for situations like this? If you order an NYC Sadowsky or an MTD and pay the deposit is it completely nonrefundable? I've heard about some companies where you pay the deposit when ordering and the deposit is refundable until you get to the actual build cycle.

In both those cases, only if you've ordered something that's custom enough to not have general appeal, and you cancel out after certain things have been done to commit materials to custom attributes. Even then, my experiences with them indicate they wouldn't be quite this hardlined.

 

[jonno1707]

I think to be totally fair to both parties there should be no bashing and or negativity until both sides of the story comes out...

 

[svtb15]

Im my opinion.. and only my opinion.. I dont have a horse in this race.. only speaking from my experience..
I have done gigs where there is a deposit left for the band . or for me to do a session.. if the session get canceled. or if the gig gets canceled because of something on their end or act of god.. I keep the retainer/ deposit..
Its just the way of business...
If you give a lawyer a retainer.. that lawyer keeps the retainer even if all the money isnt used up... at least from my experience..

I was between a 1600 4 strings & a LG4 & he had to send me pics of the top so I can decide if I want it or go for a simple LG4.
When I emailed him about me loosing that gig & can't go on with the order he said that he has to think about it , than after more than a month he said that there is no refund & that I have to find someone who take the order from me.that was like 7 months ago.
Now we exchange some emails & he tole me r I continue with the order & buy the bass or forfeit the deposit.
He said to me that he is not a retailer & there is no refund in any case.
The truth is that I'm disappointed at this attitude because I know that he can use the body & neck for other orders without a problem(I wrote him about that)
The body & neck are cut but not painted .

I didn't sign on any paper or contract for the order so I don't see how he can oblige me to forfeit my deposit , but I live in Europe not in the USA so I can't do much about it

Anyway , thats life , I have to deal with that ,I learned that for some people money is above everything .
I proposed Jimmy to refund me only 800$ from the 1175$ , so he'll be happy & I'll be happy , but he refused.

Anyway , thats my situation now , so I try to find someone to take the order.

Thanks for your concern !

 

[Vic]

Im my opinion.. and only my opinion.. I dont have a horse in this race.. only speaking from my experience..
I have done gigs where there is a deposit left for the band . or for me to do a session.. if the session get canceled. or if the gig gets canceled because of something on their end or act of god.. I keep the retainer/ deposit..
Its just the way of business...
If you give a lawyer a retainer.. that lawyer keeps the retainer even if all the money isnt used up... at least from my experience..

Totally different case. In those cases, it's your time that was paid for, and that time was used, and can't be reclaimed. Even if you didn't show up, you still burned calendar time and lost the ability to book something else. That's a valid expense for the deposit to cover.

In this case, all time and materials can be totally and completely recovered as he can still just use this for any next LG4 stock bass or subsequent custom order. Jimmy doesn't stand to lose a dime on it if he gives a full refund. Poor icemangee, on the other hand, is guaranteed to lose money on this now. He has a choice to either lose a ton of money on the forfeit, or lose a smaller, tho still likely significant chunk of money on the instant flip.

I sure wish I knew why this had to be. It just seems so completely unfair at this point.

 

[KJung]

Im my opinion.. and only my opinion.. I dont have a horse in this race.. only speaking from my experience..
I have done gigs where there is a deposit left for the band . or for me to do a session.. if the session get canceled. or if the gig gets canceled because of something on their end or act of god.. I keep the retainer/ deposit..
Its just the way of business...
If you give a lawyer a retainer.. that lawyer keeps the retainer even if all the money isnt used up... at least from my experience..

That is a bit of a different thing, since the retainer is for 'time spent' that cannot be recovered (cancelled gigs/session are similar IMO and IME). For 'hard goods' that can easily be sold or recycled into another product (like a simple body and neck blank), this seems a bit strange to me.


None of my business I guess, but I sure would have a hard time recommending someone put a big chunk of change down and wait for over a year with absolutely no recourse from the day the check was sent. IMO there.

 

[svtb15]

Time spent on making the neck and body can not be recovered either.. Just saying..
Do you think it is easy selling $$$$ basses in this economy

That is a bit of a different thing, since the retainer is for 'time spent' that cannot be recovered (cancelled gigs/session are similar IMO and IME). For 'hard goods' that can easily be sold or recycled into another product (like a simple body and neck blank), this seems a bit strange to me.


None of my business I guess, but I sure would have a hard time recommending someone put a big chunk of change down and wait for over a year with absolutely no recourse from the day the check was sent. IMO there.