Thanks! Can't wait too see it too!
@chef: if u look hard enough at the bass, you'll see an old man fishing lol!!'
@chef: if u look hard enough at the bass, you'll see an old man fishing lol!!'
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I see the old man fishing, and just beautiful btw, but for some reason I keep hearing "get off my lawn!" when I look at it.
I've been playing my passive P Bass most of the morning (it has the same, I would guess, Nordstrand P5 pickup as is used in the Sadowsky).
In all my experiences with P Basses (mostly Fender, but now my Nordstrand), I've noticed that the 'sweet spot' for tone is with the passive tone control dialed down about 75% for the most part. Seems like that is what most P players do. The Nordy pickup allows you to turn the passive control up more for a LOT of brightness without the really nasty 'clank' of a traditional Fender P pickup IME.
So, here is my question... more curious than anything. With a J bass like the Sadowsky J's I've owned, I rarely turn down the passive tone control, and even if I want to 'old school it', the passive control turned down about 25% takes out most of the upper treble.
So, with a PJ, how does that work for you guys? Seems like if you dialed the passive down enough to tame the massive upper midrange and lower treble response of the P pickup, the J pickup would sound very dull, and if you turned it up, it would be brutally clacky?
Again, not a PJ guy at all, mostly curious. Is there some extra circuity in the electronics, are does the interaction between the two pickups somehow balance the way different tonality.
Thanks in advance!
In all my experiences with P Basses (mostly Fender, but now my Nordstrand), I've noticed that the 'sweet spot' for tone is with the passive tone control dialed down about 75% for the most part. Seems like that is what most P players do. The Nordy pickup allows you to turn the passive control up more for a LOT of brightness without the really nasty 'clank' of a traditional Fender P pickup IME.
So, here is my question... more curious than anything. With a J bass like the Sadowsky J's I've owned, I rarely turn down the passive tone control, and even if I want to 'old school it', the passive control turned down about 25% takes out most of the upper treble.
So, with a PJ, how does that work for you guys? Seems like if you dialed the passive down enough to tame the massive upper midrange and lower treble response of the P pickup, the J pickup would sound very dull, and if you turned it up, it would be brutally clacky?
Again, not a PJ guy at all, mostly curious. Is there some extra circuity in the electronics, are does the interaction between the two pickups somehow balance the way different tonality.
Thanks in advance!
No extra circuitry. Just a P & J pickup & a good o’l blend knob (or Vol/Vol).
Anytime I played a PJ and tried to play it like a JJ (tone control wide open) it was way too bright (and I’m just not fond of the tone). I always reverted back to using it like a standard P, favoring the P pickup 90%, tone control rolled back 75%-90%, just barley giving the hint of the J pickup for a slightly less boomy sound. That’s the only way I found a PJ to “work” for me. Tone control back 90% and P pickup favored 90%... all this, to the point that I just stick with a regular P. Got sick of being driven nutz by the J pickup and how much to use it (5%, 10%, 15%) if at all. Love the simplicity of mind using a strict P.
Bit of a ramble but to answer your original question – wide open, too bright. It’s very much a P pickup dominant sound, with the J adding a modern sizzle that just never sat right with me like a JJ.
OK, that makes sense. I'm not a particular fan of the PJ either, and always thought it was a bit of a mismatched design, but so many love them, that I was confused. Seems like once you roll down that tone control, the impact of the J would be very little (even with the blend at unity), especially with a pickup like the Nordstrand.
Seems like a capacitor to tame the P pickup top end would help (i.e. with the P starting out at 50% of the passive tone control or whatever), or separate passive tone controls for each pickup, or maybe even bypassing the J pickup from the passive tone control.
very much describes how I set my Metro P/J, although for certain songs in a set list, where I don't really want the traditional P sound, I will move the blend knob about 60/40 towards the J, that's as far as I usually go on the blend.
Chef
In Memoriam
With my MV5PJ:
I don't move the blend very far off center; just enough for the flavor to change to "this pickup or that pickup."
I mostly think of it as a P bass, and use it as such.
As far as tone goes, I kinda have "my way I run everything."
I tend to knock passive tone down to about 70% open,
boost treble 20%;
and very seldom boost bass, until I favor the bridge pup significantly.
This doesn't apply only to the Sadowsky PJ, but, to both my Sadowsky JJ's, the two similarly spec'd Valenti, and, both the Nord and Alleva.
From that baseline setting, I can get pretty much all my tones via blend and right hand placement and technique; unless it's a song that calls for some particularly dark/vintage feel. Then, I might snap active treble shut, and/or palm mute.
I don't move the blend very far off center; just enough for the flavor to change to "this pickup or that pickup."
I mostly think of it as a P bass, and use it as such.
As far as tone goes, I kinda have "my way I run everything."
I tend to knock passive tone down to about 70% open,
boost treble 20%;
and very seldom boost bass, until I favor the bridge pup significantly.
This doesn't apply only to the Sadowsky PJ, but, to both my Sadowsky JJ's, the two similarly spec'd Valenti, and, both the Nord and Alleva.
From that baseline setting, I can get pretty much all my tones via blend and right hand placement and technique; unless it's a song that calls for some particularly dark/vintage feel. Then, I might snap active treble shut, and/or palm mute.
What I usually do on my PJ depends on the song:
dense mix / rocking stuff: VTC wide open
sparse mix / softer stuff : VTC around 50%.
If I cut more treble on the VTC I usually boost treble to compensate. This adds more definition without the clank and noise.
Whew... I just can't imagine that P pickup with the VTC wide open. There must be something going on when you add the J.
I guess the cab would have something to do with it. A warm, mid oriented cab with no tweeter, I can see that, or I guess if you are using flats.
Again, more curious than anything. With my 'modern full range rigs' and roundwounds, I just can't imagine.
I have a pj 4 and have had a couple pj 5's. I go pan in the middle, vtc about 90%, no treble boost, bass boosted to warm up the stage. Ill adjust pan for certain tunes but this is the norm for me
Chef
In Memoriam
Different people's hands do different things.
I think you've looked at my gear and settings at points and wondered "*** is he doing"....
I think you've looked at my gear and settings at points and wondered "*** is he doing"....
- Nov 4, 2003
- 11,943
- 3,137
- Disclosures
- Endorsing artist- Suhr basses, PedalTrain, GHS, Ultimate Ears
Dang it.......
I thought I averted a crisis, but I couldn't hold it off......
Pull me off the wall Bluesy, I gotta sell my WL.....
PM me for pics/deets , but you guys know it and really, it's mint.
$2050+ shipping. (If I'm paying fees- at least pay the shipping. Double Stop lever NOT included- regular lever put back on)
Gonna post it up for the "general public of TB" later tonight......
When I get back on my feet, I'll be getting another WL FOR SURE.
I thought I averted a crisis, but I couldn't hold it off......
Pull me off the wall Bluesy, I gotta sell my WL.....
PM me for pics/deets , but you guys know it and really, it's mint.
$2050+ shipping. (If I'm paying fees- at least pay the shipping. Double Stop lever NOT included- regular lever put back on)
Gonna post it up for the "general public of TB" later tonight......
When I get back on my feet, I'll be getting another WL FOR SURE.
Different people's hands do different things.
I think you've looked at my gear and settings at points and wondered "*** is he doing"....
+1
I can actually see the super bright deal with a P with the VTC turned up working great with more vintage style rigs. Same thing with the Sadowsky treble control. I never, ever boosted that control (I understand the deal about dialing down the VTC and boosting treble, but that was so subtle that on the gig I never bothered). However, I use bright, modern cabs and very 'clean' heads for the most part. If I was playing out of a fridge, or grinding a tube amp or whatever, I can see cranking the treble, etc. and it sounding wonderfully grindy.Anway, interesting stuff. That Nordstrand P pickup is capable of SO much top end, that even my relatively bright 'tone in my head' is satisfied nicely. I guess back in the day, when the top end of those old P pickups was pretty cruddy (i.e., bright in a very harsh way when you cranked the passive tone control open), it made much sense to add that J to 'un-mud' the sound a bit but still control the gank.
Someone once told me that he was in favour of winding the J pup of a P/J configuration be a more symbiotic fit for the P pup. Being a P-Bass "lifer", I have always had an issue with the "flattening" of the inherent complexity of the P pup when the J was even blended in at a "P favoured" setting, VTC not withstanding. The pup blend has to be tied to the CHARACTER of the tune/mix as well I feel, which sometimes makes the said issue redundant.
B.
Interesting topic for me. Interesting fusion of designs/voicings that obviously works very well for many. I was again just kind of musing when I was thinking of the massively different 'VTC' settings I use for a P versus a J.
My typical settings on my Alder/Braz PJ5 with Blue Nickels....
Active
P pup +10%
VTC +25%
Bass boost off
Treble boost +10%
Or
Passive
J pup +10-15%
VTC +25-50%
Bass boost off
Treble boost off
Active
P pup +10%
VTC +25%
Bass boost off
Treble boost +10%
Or
Passive
J pup +10-15%
VTC +25-50%
Bass boost off
Treble boost off
Sadowsky flats, I think I've had rounds on this bass for around 3 days in the almost four years it's been with me and it was like two years ago that I left the rounds behind and never looked back.
