Confessions of a Flatwound convert...

[dorfmeister]

Just got my Warwick Corvette Standard set up with Pyramid Golds.

I don't know how much the sound will change as they break in but I'm very happy with the sound and feel right after having them put on.

 

[b4nny]

Hey guys, a while ago I took some Roto 77 flats off of my jazz bass and put on some regular Slinkys. I still have the set of flats in a coil on my desk. Recently, I've discovered that I really like the sound the bass when I dig in with the tone all the way off. If I put on the Rotos and really kill them (with grease from my noise and all), would they make a similar kind of tone when digging in (with tone all the way on) as the rounds with the tone knob off? In other words, is this true: dead flats, tone 100%, digging in = settled rounds, tone 0%, digging in?

 

[JSK5String]

Well, after having a couple of weeks to break in my new Chromes while our lead player was on vacation we finally had rehearsal tonight.



Comments from the boys in the band:
Lead Gtr: "What did you do? You sound huge but you're not as loud as usual and I can hear myself better."

Drummer: "This is awesome, I can hear everybody instead of just a roar."

Singer/Gtr: "I can't notice a difference because Jeff's amp (lead gtr's Mesa Stilleto) is pointing right at my face." (we set up in a circle looking at each other for rehearsal)

Lead Gtr at the end of practice after being told I switched to flats: "I don't know if your tone is perfect or if I've just been listening more closely, but it sure sounds cool."

So, first returns seem positive. One more rehearsal before our gig the weekend of 4/24 & 25. We'll see how it goes when I run it through the PA. Even though I've got ears trained to rounds for the last 30 years I'm going to stick it out and give these a shot through a couple of gigs and let the crowds' responses to the band be the deciding factor. My wife has no problem being brutally honest with me , so we'll see what she has to say after I gig with them.

I'll just have to watch Standing in the Shadows of Motown or one of my beatles or Stones DVD's to reassure me that my change to flats is a good idea...

 

[JSK5String]

One more thing. I didn't mess with any of my settings other than to add just a skinny hair more of the "Drive" knob on my VT Bass pedal than I used with my rounds.

 

[seanm]

I guess I am late to the party

I am pretty much a hack bassist, and I am *not* being modest here. But flats are my secret weapon. For songs like Roadhouse Blues where it is all about the open E string, the flats on a P bass give you power you don't get with rounds(*).

The only problem with flats....is switching to rounds. I find I drag my fingers lightly over the strings to move to another position. With flats, you get no noise (in fact it helps mute the string), but it sounds horrible on rounds. The solution: don't play rounds

(*) Maybe dead rounds can do it. I never kept my rounds on long enough to go really dead.

 

[dave_bass5]

I'll just have to watch Standing in the Shadows of Motown or one of my beatles or Stones DVD's to reassure me that my change to flats is a good idea...

LOL, thats also what i did.

Since ive been playing Chromes ive had about 4 or 5 bass players come up to me and comment on various things, mainly the basses but none have realised i was playing flats. In fact when ive told them ive had blank expressions.
Is it all worth it i ask myself. Of course

 

[Sundogue]

Well, after having a couple of weeks to break in my new Chromes while our lead player was on vacation we finally had rehearsal tonight.



Comments from the boys in the band:
Lead Gtr: "What did you do? You sound huge but you're not as loud as usual and I can hear myself better."

Drummer: "This is awesome, I can hear everybody instead of just a roar."

Singer/Gtr: "I can't notice a difference because Jeff's amp (lead gtr's Mesa Stilleto) is pointing right at my face." (we set up in a circle looking at each other for rehearsal)

Lead Gtr at the end of practice after being told I switched to flats: "I don't know if your tone is perfect or if I've just been listening more closely, but it sure sounds cool."

So, first returns seem positive. One more rehearsal before our gig the weekend of 4/24 & 25. We'll see how it goes when I run it through the PA. Even though I've got ears trained to rounds for the last 30 years I'm going to stick it out and give these a shot through a couple of gigs and let the crowds' responses to the band be the deciding factor. My wife has no problem being brutally honest with me , so we'll see what she has to say after I gig with them.

I'll just have to watch Standing in the Shadows of Motown or one of my beatles or Stones DVD's to reassure me that my change to flats is a good idea...

It is very interesting to hear unsolicited comments about them isn't it? I remember how my guitarists had similar reactions to my sound but didn't know what I did or why they liked it so much.

I have come to find that string choice does indeed matter. I've been playing my Chromes for a while now, at rehearsals and gigs and our sound has changed for the better. My sound has definitely changed.

The most noticeable change has been the way I EQ my amp. The last gig we played my amp was set completely flat except my lows were cut. Never have I played that same rig (for two years now) using rounds where I didn't have to boost some mids and the highs just to be heard. I am also playing at a much lower volume than ever before.

When playing rounds (too many different brands to mention here), I have always had to do like so many have...boost the mids, cut some lows, add some highs and crank the crap out of my amp and drive it hard to be heard. To "cut through the mix" as we have come to know it.

I find it interesting that "cutting through the mix" is such a prevalent issue that even entire threads are devoted to it, yet so many still have such a disdain for flats. The Chromes CUT through like no other string I've ever played. They have a punch to them unlike any other string I've tried (round or flat). It's also interesting that although they slice through that sonic wall, they also (by virtue of their flatwound design) still stick with the rhythm section and fill out the low end.

I've spent decades with rounds using various settings on my amp, bass and specific playing techniques in an attempt to get exactly the sound I get naturally with the Chromes. I never thought flats would set my playing free. For years I (like so many others) felt flats were too restricting of my playing and too limiting with my sound.

I am officially off the roundwound bandwagon. I only wish I had jumped off years ago.

Give flats a good while to settle in. Unlike rounds that go from new to horrible, flats just get better and better with time. One really needs to give them enough time to 'blossom'. Seriously, after so many years of playing rounds, stopping cold turkey and putting flats on kind of messes with your head. It's like an alcoholic quitting drinking. But once you've got a few live gigs under your belt you might find you just don't need rounds anymore. What little bit of that roundwound sound I miss is hardly worth losing what I have with the flats now.

Every time I feel I'm missing the rounds, I just remember how short a time it is that sound lasts before I need a new set of strings to keep that sound. A great side benefit to flats is no more string changes (or certainly nowhere near as often).

Post back again after you've had them a while and played a few gigs.

 

[dave_bass5]

Every time I feel I'm missing the rounds, I just remember how short a time it is that sound lasts before I need a new set of strings to keep that sound. A great side benefit to flats is no more string changes (or certainly nowhere near as often).

Post back again after you've had them a while and played a few gigs.

I must admit this was my first reason for trying flats. I used to like the midway period with rounds. after the zing has gone but before they die. Ive saved my self a fortune over the last year but keeping the chromes on (this set has now been on 3 basses, i just had t buy a low B when i got my P5).

I know what you mean about always struggling to cut through the mix with rounds but since ive been using flats i see it more as sitting in the mix, especially at the low end.
We only play covers, usual wedding stuff so i dont need to cut through, just to be in the right sonic space and i find Chromes (and Ti's) sit just where thair needed.
I normally have my amp's Eq pretty flat, with rounds as well as flats but these days i find i need to boost the low mids a lot less.

All in all, great stings although i feel they do produce a more generic tone than you get from rounds. I guess flats and P's are made for each other.

 

[Sundogue]

I must admit this was my first reason for trying flats. I used to like the midway period with rounds. after the zing has gone but before they die. Ive saved my self a fortune over the last year but keeping the chromes on (this set has now been on 3 basses, i just had t buy a low B when i got my P5).

I know what you mean about always struggling to cut through the mix with rounds but since ive been using flats i see it more as sitting in the mix, especially at the low end.
We only play covers, usual wedding stuff so i dont need to cut through, just to be in the right sonic space and i find Chromes (and Ti's) sit just where thair needed.
I normally have my amp's Eq pretty flat, with rounds as well as flats but these days i find i need to boost the low mids a lot less.

All in all, great stings although i feel they do produce a more generic tone than you get from rounds. I guess flats and P's are made for each other.

Yes, I guess it isn't really a matter of cutting through as much as it is sitting better in the mix while still have a very distinct, defined bass sound. I mean, with the Chromes I'm playing with less volume, less lows and low-mids and yet I can hear myself better.

I think what it comes down to is that with flats, the bass sounds distinctly like a bass and not a lower tuned guitar. Drums and percussion instruments are not going to sound like a guitar. A horn section is not going to sound like a guitar. Other instruments can share the same frequencies and yet not be lost in the sound of another instrument (I'm not speaking about volume here).

When two guitars are playing they often will be intertwined in their sound so that without watching, one would be hard pressed to know which guitar is producing which sound. So if the bass is strung with rounds and sounds like a lower tuned guitar it can often get lost in the guitars' sonic wash (and visa versa where the guitars get lost in the bass' sound as well). I'm not talking about volume as much as the sound itself that is produced.

With flatwounds, the bass has it's own distinct sound that sits so wonderfully with the drums in the rhythm section. Perhaps it is just this sound being heard as different from the guitars that gives the illusion of "cutting through" when in fact it has no need to cut through. It just has it's own voice.

Obviously that is not a voice every bass player wants or needs. I can appreciate that and understand that each musician and band has it's own sound requirements. I'm speaking specifically to my (and those in a similar) situation. They work for me in a way I didn't think they would. And by that I don't mean I never appreciated or understood flats, but rather I didn't think flats would fit in the situation I always felt only rounds could. I used to think, "Oh sure flats work with old country, or blues, or reggae, but rock? I need that bright, piano-like tone don't I?" I bought into the idea that flats were just dull, lifeless strings suited to only certain stereotypical genres and that rounds could do everything, including copping that flat tone just by making them sound dull too. It was total ignorance on my part, that for many it appears, is still very prevalent today still.

I wouldn't say that flats are generic, because I am able to produce quite a variety of tones with the Chromes, dependent on technique, settings and/or effects. Rounds are just as limited, but in a different way. One can make any string sound dull, but that is not what flats are unless one wants them to be.

Yes, instead of "cutting through", I think "sitting in the mix, yet hearing myself better" is a more appropriate way of putting it.

 

[dave_bass5]

With flatwounds, the bass has it's own distinct sound that sits so wonderfully with the drums in the rhythm section. Perhaps it is just this sound being heard as different from the guitars that gives the illusion of "cutting through" when in fact it has no need to cut through. It just has it's own voice.

Agreed and very well put.
If only guitarists thought that way as well

 

[JSK5String]

Seriously, after so many years of playing rounds, stopping cold turkey and putting flats on kind of messes with your head. It's like an alcoholic quitting drinking. But once you've got a few live gigs under your belt you might find you just don't need rounds anymore. What little bit of that roundwound sound I miss is hardly worth losing what I have with the flats now...

...Post back again after you've had them a while and played a few gigs.

Absolutely hilarious that you say that. This thread has seemed like an AA safe haven type place for us ex-round players. I will post back again after I gig with them. We've got a two-night gig on the 24th & 25th at one of our favorite bars here in town. Look for my next update after that...

 

[dealbreaker]

Just pulled the trigger on a set of Chromes and strung them up this morning. Easily the best $25 I've ever spent on anything bass-related.

 

[bassist4dalord]

After years of playing a jazz w/ rounds almost exclusively i've recently fallen head over heels for the sound and feel of a precision bass w/ flats. For a while I was going back and forth between the two setups but after playing a few shows w/ the precision w/ flats and recording w/ it i've realized that is THE sound i've always wanted. There's so much in that sound of a good precision bass w/ good flats on it, so much of that fundamentally good bass tone.

Anyone reading/subscribing/participating in this thread has probably already come to this sort of conclusion already, just adding my +1!

Now try flats on your Jazz

 

[sloasdaylight]

I started playing bass with Ernie Ball Super Slinkys.
After about 3 years or so of using those strings I decided it was time for a change, and went to Rotosound 77 flats, and have never looked back. There is something about playing a set of strings that won't tear your fingers apart, won't sound harshly bright, and will retain enough punch with the warmth that only flats can provide, that is pretty damned awesome.

In short, flats are pretty much amazingly underrated in rock/metal/anything really.

 

[jasper383]

Is it because amps and cabs are so much better nowadays that flats seem to be enjoying a renaissance? Volume is cheap, so the voice flats have can be heard.

 

[One Drop]

Reading about how popular flats are with session players in the thread in the misc. forum was an eye-opener for me. It makes a lot of sense for recording purposes, but I was still surprised how ubiquitous they are these days in the studio.

jasper383, I imagine that modern amplification and especially the developments in PA technology and the and the use of them by so many venues and bands has contributed immensely to the renaissance of flats for live use.

 

[madbassplaya]

 

[madbassplaya]

I have played flats before and i've loved them, but they were on passive instruments.

I now play two Stingrays and I hate the way the rounds sound, i've been wanting to go with some half or flatwounds, but everybody has said that defeats the purpose of a Stingray.

Screw that! This is my bass and I love the look, sound, and construction of the bass. The roundwounds are what I don't like, so I can change that. This thread definately helped me decide to go with some Flats on my Ray.

 

[Surly]

With proper mixing, and/or volume levels, and/or EQ'ing, you don't *need* flats to sit thumpily in the mix. I've experimented a lot and I can get the tones I need from either flats (I use Chromes) or rounds like DR Lo-Riders which give a nice low mid bump. Always on a P-bass. Of course YMMV. Steve Harris has an amazing live tone and the sound team for Maiden isn't going to let him be buried in the mix with any string. I've told people that Harris uses flats and they're actually surprised.

I believe everything that people say on here about flats because I use them. Only thing I don't like is the pick tones I get with flats, they sound a little "twangy" to me.

 

[Nashrakh]

Screw that! This is my bass and I love the look, sound, and construction of the bass. The roundwounds are what I don't like, so I can change that. This thread definately helped me decide to go with some Flats on my Ray.

+1

This video is some proof of that awesomeness