Confessions of a Flatwound convert...

[Sundogue]

Haha, I'm only jokin' around too, I play both myself, and have done with a few years, lol, I remember the first time I bought a set, shopkeeper says

"You know they're flats, right?"

"Yes, of course"

"Any you still want them?"

"Yeah, sure"

"They're different from rounds, you know that, do you?"

"I do."

"And you're sure you want them.........?"

Took me 20 mins to buy a pack of strings in an empty store....

Geez, usually they'd be happy to make a sale, lol!

That's funny. Probably typical and I'm sure I'd get the same thing if I bought strings in a store.

I buy online..but it would be funny if I'd get a phone call from Juststrings..."Hi this is juststrings. You just placed an order with us and we just wanted to confirm...you do know you ordered flatwounds, right?"

 

[Darkstrike]

That's funny. Probably typical and I'm sure I'd get the same thing if I bought strings in a store.

I buy online..but it would be funny if I'd get a phone call from Juststrings..."Hi this is juststrings. You just placed an order with us and we just wanted to confirm...you do know you ordered flatwounds, right?"

I'd probably fall off my chair, lol.

 

[klyph]

Jesus.. I can't believe I just read this whole thread! Like eating a whole pint of Ben& Jerry's in a sitting! I can certainly relate to darkstrike's post- many of the packs of flats I have bought from stores were accompanied by a layer of dust on the package and a funny look (both free of charge!). Of course, it's nothing compared to the hassle I got when I started on 5-string back in '87! Of course what really sucked was having to wait 10 years before being able to put flats ON my five string... yeah, I tried just a round B and the rest flat but it was too weird- kudos to those who can stick with a mixed set.

I just put a new set of DR flats (replacing a 5 yr. old set of Chromes med./light) on my G&L 1505 after a good friend raved about them. They sound good, and the fit and finish is spectacular, but the "stickiness" is sooo pronounced on these strings! You know, it's weird how tightly wound these are- there's NO visible space between the windings. They look like I strung my bass with long lengths of solder! Anyway the stickiness was so bad on my 2nd or 3rd gig with them that I played my backup bass (G&L 1500 with rounds) on my last gig. Anybody else have this problem with DR flats? I should probably start a thread about this, huh? I think I'm going to start playing this bass at home to break in the strings and see if that makes a difference. Usually it sits in the case between gigs and I have a "beater" that I play at home. If it doesn't get better I'm gonna have to switch back to Chromes! If I do they will have to be extra long because I like stringing through the body and the 34" scale old set wouldn't allow for that. Of course, for a long time I used DA Half Rounds- maybe I'll try those again...

Ugh. Now I'm rambling. Keep thumpin' and leave the string noise to the guitarists!

 

[sixway]

Hey KLYPH, I tend to have the same problem with my TI Nickles. I have a bottle of Gibson "Luthiers Choice" String Cleaner/Lubricant, so I wiped them down with it today before going of to a recording gig. I think it's mainly alcohol with some sort of lube/oil in it.

There might be some residue left on the strings from the manufacturing process that needs to be cleaned off, and rubbing them with a good cloth to polish to shine them up a bit may help, especially during gigs.

Finger lubes help... I like StringLife, but there are a number of them out there.... even oil from the side of your nose will help in a pinch!

If the DR's are nickle, they will be more "sticky" than chromes. That's all I've got for now!

Aloha,
Ian

 

[Sundogue]

Jesus.. I can't believe I just read this whole thread! Like eating a whole pint of Ben& Jerry's in a sitting! I can certainly relate to darkstrike's post- many of the packs of flats I have bought from stores were accompanied by a layer of dust on the package and a funny look (both free of charge!). Of course, it's nothing compared to the hassle I got when I started on 5-string back in '87! Of course what really sucked was having to wait 10 years before being able to put flats ON my five string... yeah, I tried just a round B and the rest flat but it was too weird- kudos to those who can stick with a mixed set.

I just put a new set of DR flats (replacing a 5 yr. old set of Chromes med./light) on my G&L 1505 after a good friend raved about them. They sound good, and the fit and finish is spectacular, but the "stickiness" is sooo pronounced on these strings! You know, it's weird how tightly wound these are- there's NO visible space between the windings. They look like I strung my bass with long lengths of solder! Anyway the stickiness was so bad on my 2nd or 3rd gig with them that I played my backup bass (G&L 1500 with rounds) on my last gig. Anybody else have this problem with DR flats? I should probably start a thread about this, huh? I think I'm going to start playing this bass at home to break in the strings and see if that makes a difference. Usually it sits in the case between gigs and I have a "beater" that I play at home. If it doesn't get better I'm gonna have to switch back to Chromes! If I do they will have to be extra long because I like stringing through the body and the 34" scale old set wouldn't allow for that. Of course, for a long time I used DA Half Rounds- maybe I'll try those again...

Ugh. Now I'm rambling. Keep thumpin' and leave the string noise to the guitarists!

Yes, flats tend to feel stickier than rounds. Which is kind of counter intuitive as one would think flats should feel more slippery than rounds.

But because of rounds' windings, your fingers only come in contact with just the very top of the winding, so they are touching less surface. They feel rougher, but don't grab as much skin as you slide on them.

I've found that (especially on gigs) I need to use one of the numerous brands of string cleaner/lubes. Once I spray that on and wipe it down, the flats are far more slippery than rounds then.

I can't speak to the DR flats as I only use TI's or Chromes (Chromes now). My favorite roundwound are the DR Sunbeams. My TI flats have more of a gap between the windings and for some reason grab more than the Chromes, but using the string cleaner/lube just once before the start fo a gig helps throughout the night. If it's particularly hot, maybe I'll do it a couple more times.

I'm not sure if your analogy of reading my thread being like eating a whole container of ice cream is a good thing or bad. Hope it didn't leave you feeling sick.

I hardly ever buy any bass gear from stores anymore as all three of the music stores around here have pretty much stopped carrying much of any bass gear anymore. Not enough of us I guess. If they do have any flats in stock they are probably one set of old Fenders that have an inch of dust on them.

 

[Rugaar]

.... even oil from the side of your nose will help in a pinch!

Hah! I thought I was the only one that did that!

 

[sixway]

Hah! I thought I was the only one that did that!

We're busted! I think I read that a long time ago in BassPlayer Mag.... of course, to be done only when there's no chicken around to keep your fingers greased up!

 

[pc]

(...)

Anyway the stickiness was so bad on my 2nd or 3rd gig with them that I played my backup bass (G&L 1500 with rounds) on my last gig. Anybody else have this problem with DR flats?

I'm having the opposite problem. I just put a set od GHS precision flats on my 6er and they are excessively slippery. I want to believe that's probably because the strings are new and there isn't enough goo on them to keep them sticky.

I've been thinking about slide a candle over the strings t get them a little more "grabbier". What do you think?

My problem is only with the right hand. On the left hand any splippery is welcome.

 

[monsterthompson]

not sure about the candle idea. you may get more than you bargained for.

for more slip on the fret hand, perhaps some fretboard conditioner would be good. those tend to be oil based and good for the fret wood. perhaps some strings may be too dirty, making them more sticky. a good string cleaner could be the way.

my labella stings have been silky smooth, but not oil slick, nor duct tape sticky.

 

[dvh]

My Precision flats are definitely stickier than the DR Sunbeams I am used to but I really like that quality. The "stickiness" makes for more articulate and percussive right hand finger style. No difference at all to my fretting hand, I don't notice the "stickiness" there.

It's just another of the qualities I prefer about flats now.

YMMV

 

[lmfreeman9]

I use DR flats but don't find them nearly as stick as LaBella's and TI Jazz Flats. I use Fast Fret while breaking them in.

 

[pc]

not sure about the candle idea. you may get more than you bargained for.

for more slip on the fret hand, perhaps some fretboard conditioner would be good. those tend to be oil based and good for the fret wood. perhaps some strings may be too dirty, making them more sticky. a good string cleaner could be the way.

my labella stings have been silky smooth, but not oil slick, nor duct tape sticky.

My left hand is fine. I use that Dunlop string cleaner, which helps a lot.

At first I though about using rosin, but it's too much money for a trial & error. I can also try surfers wax (Paraphine) only above the bridge pickup, where I need precision on my touch

 

[Basstovsky]

Speaking of mixed sets, I put an old set of Chromes on the P-bass I thot of putting GHS's on, and went WOW these sound great (I previously had them on a de-fretted peavey millennium and they sounded very boring to me) until I went to replace the last string, G, and realized OH S*** its not long enough (the millenniums headstock was a 3/2, versus inline like the P-bass) so I rooted around through my few packages containing my used strings, and found an old VERY dead fender roundwound G. Surprisingly the difference isnt highly noticeable since the G doesnt have much lows to it anyways, but you can still feel that it doesnt have that superlow bass punch of the chromes.

Interesting discovery: I had thought the pickup was going weak, because the bass lacked oomph, but it turns out the roto flats i had had on it were the problem, comparitively they had less sustain and more 'thud', even though I had used the chromes for MUCH longer than the Rotosounds. Chromes are now my 2nd fav after the GHS precision flats!

 

[TRob1293]

S.I.T. Silencers
- Feel like a flat/ground
- have that bright, yet warm sound
- not a 'thud' (like GHS Bright Flats, 3 seta and all 'thud')
- not a 'ting' (like Earnie Ball's, pure piano sound)
- tension is just right to get 3/32 at 12 for my Jazz
- can EQ them to 'bite' in a 210 or 410 cab
- can EQ them wrap you in warm lows in a 115 cab
- a 210 + 115? wrap you up and then bite!

My personal faves (and under $20)!
Not affiliated with S.I.T. - just spent near $300 over the past 1.5 years finding what I like, and these are it.
Flats are nice, rounds are harsh, grounds are quite nice.

 

[Sundogue]

S.I.T. Silencers
- Feel like a flat/ground
- have that bright, yet warm sound
- not a 'thud' (like GHS Bright Flats, 3 seta and all 'thud')
- not a 'ting' (like Earnie Ball's, pure piano sound)
- tension is just right to get 3/32 at 12 for my Jazz
- can EQ them to 'bite' in a 210 or 410 cab
- can EQ them wrap you in warm lows in a 115 cab
- a 210 + 115? wrap you up and then bite!

My personal faves (and under $20)!
Not affiliated with S.I.T. - just spent near $300 over the past 1.5 years finding what I like, and these are it.
Flats are nice, rounds are harsh, grounds are quite nice.

I've tried a few "groundwound" or "halfround" strings and to me they are neither as bright as rounds nor do they give that fundamental thump like flats. Yeah, they are somewhere in between. But they are roundwound strings to begin with and then they have the outer roundwound wrap ground down so they feel more like flats do. But they don't sound like flats to me at all. They sound like duller rounds (which is what they really are). A lot of people associate flats with the word "dull", so it isn't surprising that a lot of roundwound players feel they can mimic the "flat" sound with EQ'ing and technique. But that won't change the inherent character of the string design itself. There is a reason they still make flats.

If one loves rounds but likes how flats feel, the "half-round" strings are a good option, but they really don't have the characteristic sound of flats at all...only the feel somewhat.

 

[Yodhan]

Okay, after reading this thread for the past couple days, I decided to head to work (I work at a music store) and throw a set of flats on my Jazz bass. I am auditioning for a band with two guitar players, one of whom uses a 7 string, so I really don't feel like competing for low end with him. I have been using Rotosound Swing 66's ,on my main bass, for my entire time playing, and trying various other sets on my backup. After loaning my backup to a friend, I figure I would just throw them on my main J and give it a whirl. I even called my tech up, just to make sure I wasn't going to have to re-set up my bass by doing this (the truss rod adjustment is on the body side...pain in the but), and he said he thought I would never go to flats.

I loved it. I can already tell the sound is going to thump so much more with a band. Of course, my idiot co-worker who thinks that highly compressed, very sizzly tone, is the best, tried to re-EQ the amp to get it to sound like his bass player's rig (horrible sound), but I slapped his wrist and made him leave me alone.

I am very glad I read this article and thank everyone who was able to post how they feel the strings help in a band setting. Thank you.

 

[Sundogue]

Okay, after reading this thread for the past couple days, I decided to head to work (I work at a music store) and throw a set of flats on my Jazz bass. I am auditioning for a band with two guitar players, one of whom uses a 7 string, so I really don't feel like competing for low end with him. I have been using Rotosound Swing 66's ,on my main bass, for my entire time playing, and trying various other sets on my backup. After loaning my backup to a friend, I figure I would just throw them on my main J and give it a whirl. I even called my tech up, just to make sure I wasn't going to have to re-set up my bass by doing this (the truss rod adjustment is on the body side...pain in the but), and he said he thought I would never go to flats.

I loved it. I can already tell the sound is going to thump so much more with a band. Of course, my idiot co-worker who thinks that highly compressed, very sizzly tone, is the best, tried to re-EQ the amp to get it to sound like his bass player's rig (horrible sound), but I slapped his wrist and made him leave me alone.

I am very glad I read this article and thank everyone who was able to post how they feel the strings help in a band setting. Thank you.

Cool. You'll have to post back here after you've played them in a band settings for a while (different clubs, etc.). It's always good to read first impressions and how things progress as one goes along.

Some continue to dig them, so love them even more, and some want to change back because it just isn't their thing. It will be interesting to hear how the are for you in the long run.

 

[Sufenta]

OK, its been a month using TI flats on both my '72P and Kawai FB2. When I first put them on the P, I had to adjust the action up a bit, but it seems the neck adjusted itself over the month and I was able to lower the action back down.
I feel I gave the flats a fair trail, but my conclusion at least as far as the TIs go is that they lack the aggressive bite and snap that I need in my rock trio. The low end is nice, but its no better than what I can get out of DR Chromes and I can easily cop a more subdued vibe out of the chromes by palm muting to taste.
So the flats will be coming off both those basses but I'll keep them around just in case there is a future need for recording or another type of band that doesn't require the snarl I need in my current band.
I'm glad I re-tried them after all these years, and its been fun keeping up with this thread, but I came to exactly the same conclusion once again, that flats are just not my thing.

 

[Sundogue]

OK, its been a month using TI flats on both my '72P and Kawai FB2. When I first put them on the P, I had to adjust the action up a bit, but it seems the neck adjusted itself over the month and I was able to lower the action back down.
I feel I gave the flats a fair trail, but my conclusion at least as far as the TIs go is that they lack the aggressive bite and snap that I need in my rock trio. The low end is nice, but its no better than what I can get out of DR Chromes and I can easily cop a more subdued vibe out of the chromes by palm muting to taste.
So the flats will be coming off both those basses but I'll keep them around just in case there is a future need for recording or another type of band that doesn't require the snarl I need in my current band.
I'm glad I re-tried them after all these years, and its been fun keeping up with this thread, but I came to exactly the same conclusion once again, that flats are just not my thing.

DR Chromes? D'Addario Chromes are flats. DR...Sunbeams?

I hear what you're saying. Flats definitely have their own sound and not everyone is going to dig that, not even in a band setting.

I do use the Chromes and I can get them to be pretty growly depending on what my EQ settings are along with some subtle effects, but really they still don't sound like rounds. Just like no matter how close one can get, rounds won't ever sound like flats either.

Gotta go with what works for you.

 

[Sufenta]

DR Chromes? D'Addario Chromes are flats. DR...Sunbeams?

I hear what you're saying. Flats definitely have their own sound and not everyone is going to dig that, not even in a band setting.

I do use the Chromes and I can get them to be pretty growly depending on what my EQ settings are along with some subtle effects, but really they still don't sound like rounds. Just like no matter how close one can get, rounds won't ever sound like flats either.

Gotta go with what works for you.

My bad. I was a bit distracted writing that post. I meant DR Nickels. I do think the Nickels are nice, I'm not really picky on the type of rounds I use. Its more of a global flat v.s. round issue for me.