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Confessions of a Flatwound convert...

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#401
OK. You guys got me. When all is said and done, your logic is unimpeachable. I also play mostly classic rock and R&B. That sound, for the most part, IS the sound of flats.

Since I first read this post, I have been deconstructing every song on my XM radio asking, "Is that bass wearing flats or rounds?" Come to realize that the tone I really love and try to emulate is unquestionably produced with flats.

So, who cares what strings my childhood bass heroes endorse?

I just ordered some Chromes for my Gibson. First time in 30 years that my #1 won't be wearing roundwounds. Looking forward to my next gig.
 
#402
funkytoe said:
OK. You guys got me. When all is said and done, your logic is unimpeachable. I also play mostly classic rock and R&B. That sound, for the most part, IS the sound of flats.

Since I first read this post, I have been deconstructing every song on my XM radio asking, "Is that bass wearing flats or rounds?" Come to realize that the tone I really love and try to emulate is unquestionably produced with flats.

So, who cares what strings my childhood bass heroes endorse?

I just ordered some Chromes for my Gibson. First time in 30 years that my #1 won't be wearing roundwounds. Looking forward to my next gig.
Click to expand...

LOL...for those who are counting...

We snagged another one, boys! jk

I do know what you mean though. I still love Geddy and Squire, et al...and I really do love the sound of a Rick with bright rounds. But heck, I just don't play that kind of music anymore, so there is no point in trying to emulate the tone of players I admire, just to play it by myself.

As a working, gigging bass player I don't get enjoyment out of playing alone. When I'm playing alone I'm working, so what I sound like is irrelevent. Playing out is the fun part and that's what I work towards.

As far as listening to recorded music and trying to figure out whether or not the bass is using flats or rounds...aside from solo parts or quieter sections, for the most part they all sound like flats when the whole band is playing. Some stuff like Rush have a more obvious roundwound tone to the bass, but most do not. And studio bass tone doesn't always translate into that same tone live. In my case that roundwound tone is worse for me and the flats do it better.

Let us know how it goes.
 
#404
sixway said:
Sundogue, what kind of wireless are you using?

Ian
Click to expand...

My guitarist gave me a cheap Samson Airline wireless ( Invalid Link Removed ) for fixing his computer (he only has about 4 or 5 different wireless units of various brands...techie kind of guy).

While not the best wireless unit, after taking it completely apart and fixing a design flaw in it (that is the cause of all the complaints with this unit), it's been performing flawlessly. Works like a charm now and unlike many complaints about wireless units (in general) not being good for bass, my bass sounds better with this wireless than it does plugged in with a cord.
 
#407
smeet said:
Huh?:confused: Could you be esplainin?
Click to expand...

Well, my wireless receiver allows me to boost the signal quite a bit beyond just "optimal" for best signal to noise ratio.

I run the wireless into my Zoom B2, then the Zoom B2 into my Superfly head (I run the Superfly's DI out - Pre EQ so the PA gets only my bass and Zoom B2).

I have an active bass and the signal going into my Zoom B2 from the wireless is pretty damn hot. It's also pretty bright. Running into my Zoom B2 with a cord only, it sounds much duller and dark.

Why? I don't know. All I know is that the sound I have when using my wireless is pretty damn cool, so I not only get the benefit of being cut free of the leash, but my sound is so much better. If it's luck, I'll take it!!!
 
#408
Sundogue said:
While not the best wireless unit, after taking it completely apart and fixing a design flaw in it (that is the cause of all the complaints with this unit), it's been performing flawlessly. Works like a charm now and unlike many complaints about wireless units (in general) not being good for bass, my bass sounds better with this wireless than it does plugged in with a cord.
Click to expand...

Interesting... a friend gave me one, and I could never get it to sound as good as my cable, so I sold it. What kind of design problem did you fix? I'd like to try one of the XDS systems some time...

Ian
 
#409
sixway said:
Interesting... a friend gave me one, and I could never get it to sound as good as my cable, so I sold it. What kind of design problem did you fix? I'd like to try one of the XDS systems some time...

Ian
Click to expand...

A few things come to mind. First off, the flexible antennae on the transmitter flopping around as you move causes static, scratchy sounds as well as occasional pops and dropouts. But the real culprit is how the antennae is attached only via one small solder joint on the circuit board, with no support around it whatsoever. Once the outer case was removed, I taped up the antennae where it it soldered and put the case back on, so any movement does not cause the connection to move. I also taped a small graphite rod to the case and antennae so the antennae cannot move.

Secondly, My guitarist swears his rechargeable batteries work better than off the shelf non-chargeables (in all of his wireless units). He's measured them and the rechargeables carry slightly higher voltage. Whether or not it's true, once I switched to using rechargeables (plus the above fix) it's never had a single scratchy/pop/ dropout glitch. Not once, when it once was a big problem throughout every gig.

Thirdly, the receiver really needs a 12 volt REVERSE polarity power supply. Even fresh batteries in the receiver just blow for sound quality. If you do not use reverse polarity (which is recommended in the manual), you'll still get weird glitches.

And last of all, I keep the antennas on the receiver spread pretty far apart (slightly above horizontal) instead of what the manual recommends.

After all of that, I've never had one single glitch, my tone is wonderful using it and I have just as much range as the guitarists with much more expensive wireless units.

Link Removed

Link Removed
 
#410
Sundogue said:
A few things come to mind. First off, the flexible antennae on the transmitter flopping around as you move causes static, scratchy sounds as well as occasional pops and dropouts. But the real culprit is how the antennae is attached only via one small solder joint on the circuit board, with no support around it whatsoever. Once the outer case was removed, I taped up the antennae where it it soldered and put the case back on, so any movement does not cause the connection to move. I also taped a small graphite rod to the case and antennae so the antennae cannot move.

Secondly, My guitarist swears his rechargeable batteries work better than off the shelf non-chargeables (in all of his wireless units). He's measured them and the rechargeables carry slightly higher voltage. Whether or not it's true, once I switched to using rechargeables (plus the above fix) it's never had a single scratchy/pop/ dropout glitch. Not once, when it once was a big problem throughout every gig.

Thirdly, the receiver really needs a 12 volt REVERSE polarity power supply. Even fresh batteries in the receiver just blow for sound quality. If you do not use reverse polarity (which is recommended in the manual), you'll still get weird glitches.

And last of all, I keep the antennas on the receiver spread pretty far apart (slightly above horizontal) instead of what the manual recommends.

After all of that, I've never had one single glitch, my tone is wonderful using it and I have just as much range as the guitarists with much more expensive wireless units.

Link Removed

Link Removed
Click to expand...

Thanks for the pics and info Sundogue. Wish I'd seen this before a I sold the unit!

Ian
 
#412
IMO, Samson should have made it with a rigid antenna. Neat little transmitter though. I've even removed it from the case once and mounted it inside the control cavity of a previous bass (for "onboard" wireless) with the antenna running along the cavity cover and the jack plug removed with the wires hardwired to my instrument jack. People thought I was playing "air-bass" because nothing was ever plugged into the bass. ;)

My other bass was a passive bass though. If I could find a way to use a switch to "unplug" the hardwired wireless on my new active bass (so it wouldn't drain the active battery) I'd install it again in my new bass.

Here's a pic of it in my old passive bass...

Link Removed

Link Removed
 
#413
alexclaber said:
It's for similar reasons that although I need the openness of rounds for some of my playing I prefer them when they're well worn in and mellowed out, and I am obsessed with muting.

Alex
Click to expand...

I used to mute obsessively myself. But I'm too wild onstage now to be able to play the way I do and still mute effectively all the time. Flats work for me that way too.

Suffice to say, I rock out too much to have "proper" technique. :D
 
#414
Sundogue said:
I used to mute obsessively myself. But I'm too wild onstage now to be able to play the way I do and still mute effectively all the time. Flats work for me that way too.

Suffice to say, I rock out too much to have "proper" technique. :D
Click to expand...

If I always stayed in that tonal spectrum then I'd have shifted to flats but I have a habit of going off on a tangent and demanding some of the nastiness that only rounds can provide, or doing one of my chordal thangs which need plenty of clarity.

One day I shall indulge myself and acquire a P-bass and stick some heavy flats on it. As it is my RIM Custom 5 does everything nowadays - 36" scale, Q-Tuners and a really resonant characterful acoustic sound that seems to always sit right when played with the right attitude.

Alex
 
#415
The Chromes are absolutely THE best set of strings I've ever used, round or flat.

I am really digging my sound with these strings. Last night at the gig I could hear every single note distinctly as the Chromes are bright but not in a roundwound kind of way. They are broken in but they have this kind of 'snap' to them along with a nice deep punch.

I can pick closer to the neck and get a full deep thump or pick next to the bridge and get a very bright snappy tone (think Twilight Zone on that Danelectro)

PUNCH! There is just no other string I've tried under any kind of settings that give me this kind of bass tone. The drummer and I were smiling all night long.

Of course it could also be the two QSC 4050's we just bought to match with our JBL SRX728 subs. Damn, we had some sweet LOW END last night!!!
 
#416
I'm beginning to feel like we are on the verge of a huge wave of bass players switching over to flatwounds.

Might we be going back to the days when bass players wanted to play bass and not play guitar? :eek:

Can it be? Can modern era bass players play the on the low end of the low end? ;)

Is it possible that the rhythm section is going to have some rhythm again? :smug:

Hey don't get me wrong...I'm all for playing bright sounding roundwound strung basses and noodling all over the bass like it was a Les Paul in a soloing frenzy. But are we really going back to the cave man days where bass players only played bass?

:hiding:

Hmmm...I wonder. Flats sure make me want to lay back and groove with the drummer instead of soloing with the guitar player.

:ninja:
 
#419
Darkstrike said:
Why not have both, who's stoppin' ya layin' down a solo on flats?
Click to expand...

Who's stopping me?

Me!!! :hyper:

I'm actually having way more fun and enjoying music more, by playing less.

My previous post was in jest. Just kind of struck me funny how many people are trying out flatwounds lately. I think it's cool that some who may never have even played on flats are at least trying them. Both flats and rounds are cool with me and I do still use both, though I'm more a flatwound guy most of the time now.
 
#420
Sundogue said:
Who's stopping me?

Me!!! :hyper:

I'm actually having way more fun and enjoying music more, by playing less.

My previous post was in jest. Just kind of struck me funny how many people are trying out flatwounds lately. I think it's cool that some who may never have even played on flats are at least trying them. Both flats and rounds are cool with me and I do still use both, though I'm more a flatwound guy most of the time now.
Click to expand...
Haha, I'm only jokin' around too, I play both myself, and have done with a few years, lol, I remember the first time I bought a set, shopkeeper says

"You know they're flats, right?"

"Yes, of course"

"Any you still want them?"

"Yeah, sure"

"They're different from rounds, you know that, do you?"

"I do."

"And you're sure you want them.........?"

Took me 20 mins to buy a pack of strings in an empty store....

Geez, usually they'd be happy to make a sale, lol!
 
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