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Countryman Type 85 DI Box

#61
bassboysam said:
I've been with this current band for 8 years. when we have a show I introduce myself to whomever is running the sound. I explain that I use effects and distortion and feedback and would prefer to use a mic and that I brought one that they can use. I also offer to let them use the mic for all the bands playing that night if it makes it easier. I have never been denied my request.


I really dont know where you guys live and what is in the water that makes your sound guys so hard to work with. All the towns and cities we have played the sound guys have been super supportive and willing to work with us.


having said that, assuming a mic is "allowed" I don't think it is as inconsistent as to get a good sound as many say. mic position makes a difference, but in loud live situation, if the mic is off by a few inches or degrees no one can tell the difference. At the end of the day you're still at the mercy of the guy behind the board regardless of mic or DI. With my cabs i actually have a little "X" drawn on the grill where i like the mic. makes it easy. if i'm using a backline cab I jut point the mic at the center of the speaker and be done with it. live sound is overrated anyway. no one will notice and no one really cares in the rock/metal/punk scenes. it's just a wall of distortion anyway.
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Chicagoland area. And it's not like they're pushy about it. Most times. But I have asked to be mic'd numerous times always to be told that they either won't and or that it's easier to do a DI. Since I don't have a mic of my own I've never been in a position such as yours. Maybe that would make it easier to stand my ground and or then more willing to use it.
 
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#63
bassboysam said:
I've been with this current band for 8 years. when we have a show I introduce myself to whomever is running the sound. I explain that I use effects and distortion and feedback and would prefer to use a mic and that I brought one that they can use. I also offer to let them use the mic for all the bands playing that night if it makes it easier. I have never been denied my request.


I really dont know where you guys live and what is in the water that makes your sound guys so hard to work with. All the towns and cities we have played the sound guys have been super supportive and willing to work with us.


having said that, assuming a mic is "allowed" I don't think it is as inconsistent as to get a good sound as many say. mic position makes a difference, but in loud live situation, if the mic is off by a few inches or degrees no one can tell the difference. At the end of the day you're still at the mercy of the guy behind the board regardless of mic or DI. With my cabs i actually have a little "X" drawn on the grill where i like the mic. makes it easy. if i'm using a backline cab I jut point the mic at the center of the speaker and be done with it. live sound is overrated anyway. no one will notice and no one really cares in the rock/metal/punk scenes. it's just a wall of distortion anyway.
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It might be an LA thing, but being that many of the venues here have shows nightly and see tons of bands all the time they mostly want to streamline the setup as much as possible. A few of the local dudes have been doing the routine for too long and are burnt out as well. There also isn't much that these guys haven't dealt with before so I am hesitant to suggest that my way is better when they are the pros. When playing outside of LA I generally feel a bit less of that vibe, especially being the "touring band" on a gig where we are given a bit more care/attention, but locally here backlines and DIs are just a part of life in alot of venues.
 
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#64
bassboysam said:
I've been with this current band for 8 years. when we have a show I introduce myself to whomever is running the sound. I explain that I use effects and distortion and feedback and would prefer to use a mic and that I brought one that they can use. I also offer to let them use the mic for all the bands playing that night if it makes it easier. I have never been denied my request.


I really dont know where you guys live and what is in the water that makes your sound guys so hard to work with. All the towns and cities we have played the sound guys have been super supportive and willing to work with us.


having said that, assuming a mic is "allowed" I don't think it is as inconsistent as to get a good sound as many say. mic position makes a difference, but in loud live situation, if the mic is off by a few inches or degrees no one can tell the difference. At the end of the day you're still at the mercy of the guy behind the board regardless of mic or DI. With my cabs i actually have a little "X" drawn on the grill where i like the mic. makes it easy. if i'm using a backline cab I jut point the mic at the center of the speaker and be done with it. live sound is overrated anyway. no one will notice and no one really cares in the rock/metal/punk scenes. it's just a wall of distortion anyway.
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I agree with everything you just said. I've never had an issue asking politely to use the gear I brought to a gig, and giving a good reason as to why. Maybe it's a Canadian thing. ;)

Usually all it takes is to convince the sound guy that plugging a DI into the speaker output of my head won't cause anything to blow up, and they're game to try it. I usually follow it all with "and if you don't like it we can do it your way", but I haven't ever had to unplug it after convincing the sound guy to at least hear how it sounds.
 
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#65
sunbeast said:
It might be an LA thing, but being that many of the venues here have shows nightly and see tons of bands all the time they mostly want to streamline the setup as much as possible. A few of the local dudes have been doing the routine for too long and are burnt out as well. There also isn't much that these guys haven't dealt with before so I am hesitant to suggest that my way is better when they are the pros. When playing outside of LA I generally feel a bit less of that vibe, especially being the "touring band" on a gig where we are given a bit more care/attention, but locally here backlines and DIs are just a part of life in alot of venues.
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This. Most soundguys I know have been at it for years, and are really interested in doing what they know for sure will work with minimal fuss. They know what works for them in their room with their gear. They likely don't know you, and probably don't really care about "your sound" because they've already mixed one band before you and probably have to mix two more after you're done, and then have to clean everything up at the end of the night after you leave. Your precious tone is just a blip on the radar and I'm sure the bass tone in general is not in the Top 5 most important things on their mind at any given time.

Obviously I'm generalizing and being a bit facetious, not all sound guys hate life this much. But not every sound guy is mixing his favorite band every night either. Most guys are just doing their job, or more likely their second job, grinding out another Saturday night, no doubt pretty thanklessly on top of everything else. When's the last time you approached the soundguy after a show and told him how great the mix sounded?

This is why I bring a simple (ie foolproof), high quality (ie bombproof), name brand (ie familiar) solution to help get the tone I want. I tell them "Lets try this out. I've used it before and it's always sounded pretty good. Let me know what you think, and we can try something different if it's not working for you". They just see Radial JDI (or Shure/AKG/etc) and say "that should work", and then go about micing the drums up.

Usually, come soundcheck time, they're too busy to second guess anything anyway so unless there's something drastically wrong with the signal you're sending the board, they'll probably work with it.
 
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#66
Man...it's great watching this thread because I think many of us have had this journey before (finding a good DI for dirty bass) and many more will have this same journey in the future.

Hell I even came up with a schematic for a passive 8x10 DI that ended sounding like garbage but that's how hurt up I was for a "good" di. I put "good" in quotations because I eventually realized their were plenty of good DI's out there. I was just trying to get them to do things they weren't design for. DI's are designed to get our signal to the board as cleanly and with as little interference as possible. Asking it to perfectly EQ our signal is wishful thinking.

I love the Countryman and have used it plenty with great results. I would have one on my board if it ran on 9V power supplies (I did email them and they did provide some suggested mods that would work). Maybe I should get one anyway and just ask for phantom from the board. I personally have an H&K Red Box which I have used in a pinch and it sounds great. The PDI-09, JDI and JDX are great compromises too. I think the best solution for all is for manufactures to design pedals to sound good on their own and not require specific cabs with specific frequency response in specific conditions to sound great. That's harder than it sounds but I think Darkglass is a good example of a pedal that sounds great direct.

But what I find interesting (hilarious maybe?) is that this thread reminds us of exactly why the Sansamp exists in the first place. Used gingerly it can be a great DI for effects junkies. No need to bemoan it. It'll always work in a pinch.

One last thought. The man who combines a Green Russian and Palmer in a box will be my hero.
 
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#68
I've always asked the soundmen if I can use my own Countryman DI. They have always agreed so far. I always have to remind them to turn on the phantom power. It's surprising how often they forget that.

The Countryman always works and no one has ever complained.

Fuzzwise, I've modded the tone stack of my Mad Professor Fire Red Fuzz (a Big Muff type fuzz) so that it isn't too fizzy straight to the board. It's been ok so far.
 
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#70
father of fires said:
Man...it's great watching this thread because I think many of us have had this journey before (finding a good DI for dirty bass) and many more will have this same journey in the future.

Hell I even came up with a schematic for a passive 8x10 DI that ended sounding like garbage but that's how hurt up I was for a "good" di. I put "good" in quotations because I eventually realized their were plenty of good DI's out there. I was just trying to get them to do things they weren't design for. DI's are designed to get our signal to the board as cleanly and with as little interference as possible. Asking it to perfectly EQ our signal is wishful thinking.

I love the Countryman and have used it plenty with great results. I would have one on my board if it ran on 9V power supplies (I did email them and they did provide some suggested mods that would work). Maybe I should get one anyway and just ask for phantom from the board. I personally have an H&K Red Box which I have used in a pinch and it sounds great. The PDI-09, JDI and JDX are great compromises too. I think the best solution for all is for manufactures to design pedals to sound good on their own and not require specific cabs with specific frequency response in specific conditions to sound great. That's harder than it sounds but I think Darkglass is a good example of a pedal that sounds great direct.

But what I find interesting (hilarious maybe?) is that this thread reminds us of exactly why the Sansamp exists in the first place. Used gingerly it can be a great DI for effects junkies. No need to bemoan it. It'll always work in a pinch.

One last thought. The man who combines a Green Russian and Palmer in a box will be my hero.
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my issue with the sans amp is it sounds nothing like my amp or a tube amp in general. i ageee about darkglass but for me the darkglass sound is not appealing most of the time.
 
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#73
NKBassman said:
All of this has got me jonesing to use my tube amp at my next gig in a couple weeks. I haven't hauled it out in a while... maybe it's overdue.
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I use nothing but for gigs. I'm fortunate enough to own a really awesome tube head that doesn't weight 100 lbs. It's roughly 45/50 is that. This is why I'm really anxious/wanting to figure out a way to get that into the PA. I spent all that money and only to have it on stage is sort of a shame. I know I'm one of the only ones that care, but that's not why. I want that tone out there. A good mic would be the best way to go. But that's not realistic at times.

So, I have been doing some more research and gathering opinions. I will get a JDI, hopefully that AKG mic eventually and hopefully a Broughton LPF pedal. I think he's in the middle of a move so it will take some time, but that's ok, I dont have the money at the moment anyway. But I'm hoping with the LPF I'll be able to dial out some shrillness and and with the good DI I will be pretty set. The mic will be in case the soundguy is cool with me using. So I will have both bases covered.
 
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#77
sunbeast said:
To add some more food for thought, a TB'er in this thread made recordings comparing the Palmer PDI-09 as a speaker-level DI (on all three speaker-sim modes) off his Orange head vs a miced speaker. Granted this will also depend on your particular speaker cab and mic choice, but I think is a pretty good representation of the limits of a DI vs a mic. At least one other person in the thread speculated it was superior to the speaker sim of the JDI, but no direct comparisons made...
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'twas me.

For reference if anyone still cares to listen/comment:
Palmer PDI-09 vs. Heil PR40 - (AUDIO)

Forgive the wankery. It was three years ago. I was soooo much younger.
 
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#80
Dilbert said:
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
These are great for the price, I own 3
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I actually have the mini passive of the Orchid. I've never used it. I was planning on using it with my Meatbox but sending a clean and effected signal out of it to the DI to the FOH and the clean to my amp. Never ended up doing it. So now I just keep it on my bag for emergencies. Which, now that I think about, doesn't make a whole lotta sense considering I have the B7KU haha
 

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