Cover band questions.

[micguy]

I've played in bands that did original material, cover bands, and now I do church gigs.

Original material bands are the easiest in terms of the demands on your playing technique - you learn a few sets of material that change slowly, everything stays in the same key, arrangements don't change very often (if at all), and you play the same stuff over and over. You do have to write (or at least someone in the band has to) new material from time to time (duh)

Cover bands are very similar skills wise. You probably have more material to learn, but the arrangements are even more set in stone - not too much changes, other than adding a couple tunes here, dropping a few there. If you have the skills for an original band, doing covers is a minor adjustment.

Church gigs are the most demanding thing I've done technically. Although the sets are short (20 to 30 minutes), the arrangements, the keys, the feel - everything changes from week to week (I play at multiple churches). I've literally played in all 12 keys. If I play the same part this week that I did last week on the same tune, it's probably wrong at least one, if not both of those times - you have to be very adaptable.

 

[51PRI]

I've played Bruno Mars and Lady Gaga and other pop acts, and a great deal of that works perfectly well in a cover band. But it isn't a cop-out to say other forms of pop don't. Granted it wasn't a top 40 hit, but here's an example of what I mean:


The artist is a friend of mine and at one point she was back in the state and talking about getting some musicians together to play a live gig. I offered the guys I was playing with to back her. Didn't work out, but the question was how a bass/drum/guitar combo would perform this. Yes, there's a melody and a chord progression, you COULD figure out a way to play it. But with standard rock band instrumentation, any straightforward cover would not work. It isn't that there are parts we'd be too lazy to learn or that we didn't like it; it's that translating it to our instruments would require a whole lot of arrangement to be at all worth listening to, and the result, good or not, would not resemble the original recording at all.

As you say this isn't a Top 40 hit, so there would be no reason to cover it. However, I like it and think it COULD be covered with no problems with the right band with the right mindset. To play current Top 40 "right" you would need, in addition to the normal guitar, bass, and drums, probably 2 keyboard players and two lead singers, a male and a female, both of which should be able to rap some, and maybe even play some horn parts. Not "easy" but doable.

When I started playing in bands in the late 1960's all of the local bands had horn players and played R&B, Motown, and played stuff like Chicago, Blood, Sweat and Tears, and Ides of March. I still recall the first local "modern" band that had the more now normal line-up of guitar, bass, drums, and keys. That was shocking. Then that became the norm, or, since keyboard players are hard to find, two guitars, bass, and drums. And that's where we're stuck today, it seems.

I still think that a band that dedicated themselves to properly covering current Top 40 would do well.

IMO much of it is keyboard heavy and keys players are hard to find. You can do it with backing tracks if someone is willing to create them.

Yes, you would need a strong keyboard player to cover modern Top 40.

Maybe. It's a hella lot of hanging whole notes, and I think the original works because there's a lot of studio texturing layered into it, that would be tough to substitute for live. It would be a challenge to get it to go over. I'd be up for trying it just because it IS a friend's song, but choosing set list for a cover band otherwise, I'd focus efforts on other kinds of songs.

So I took a look at the DJ top 200 requests list and in the top 10 of them was Usher's "Yeah," the kind of song I meant with the post originally - just not really meant to be played by your typical cover band.


Here's a video of how a traditional-instrument band covers it:


Successful?

Yes, I think it works very well.

 

[tshapiro]

When I was younger in my career I was nuts about getting everything sonically correct, getting the tempo correct and singing like the original. But then I saw Green Day style bands rock the snot out pop songs taking complete license with all aspects of the song and the crowd loving it. Next, I watched Ethan Farmer about my favorite bass player say that he doesn't even try to play things like the orig - he just rocks them. In this clip where his band is backing up a past-their-prime singing group - it is really really his group that is breathing life into this show - absolutely rediculous. Sounds like Prince's band to me

 

[Bass Viking]

When I was younger in my career I was nuts about getting everything sonically correct, getting the tempo correct and singing like the original. But then I saw Green Day style bands rock the snot out pop songs taking complete license with all aspects of the song and the crowd loving it. Next, I watched Ethan Farmer about my favorite bass player say that he doesn't even try to play things like the orig - he just rocks them. In this clip where his band is backing up a past-their-prime singing group - it is really really his group that is breathing life into this show - absolutely rediculous. Sounds like Prince's band to me

Awesome bass work! However, when the guys are strutting along the ramp I couldn't help imagining the camera cutting away to one of the members offstage. "Hi, I'm Joey from New Kids On The Block. When I'm in front of 20,000 screaming ladies I don't have time to worry about my bladder leak protection."

 

[Hurricane Jimmie]

Go to as many auditions as you can.

So Anyway, This.
Even if you don't get get hired, you might get asked to sub.

Auditioning is like a job search so go to as many 'interviews' as you can. You'll learn something at every one of them. And when your opportunity comes along, you'll be prepared. You might also want to check out some open mike nights.

Good Luck to you!

 

[51PRI]

When I was younger in my career I was nuts about getting everything sonically correct, getting the tempo correct and singing like the original. But then I saw Green Day style bands rock the snot out pop songs taking complete license with all aspects of the song and the crowd loving it. Next, I watched Ethan Farmer about my favorite bass player say that he doesn't even try to play things like the orig - he just rocks them...

I think the original artist can re-do the songs, in live concert, any way that they like and get away with it more than a bar band can. And what I mean is...most bar bands don't do N4N covers of songs, but they just do a half fast version. The lead guitarist won't take time to learn the solo but he won't write a "better" one...he'll just wing it. Same with bass player, etc., so what you get is a watered down sort of version of the song, not a cover.

Justin Beiber doing his own revision of "Peaches"

 

[tshapiro]

I think the original artist can re-do the songs, in live concert, any way that they like and get away with it more than a bar band can. And what I mean is...most bar bands don't do N4N covers of songs, but they just do a half fast version. The lead guitarist won't take time to learn the solo but he won't write a "better" one...he'll just wing it. Same with bass player, etc., so what you get is a watered down sort of version of the song, not a cover.

Justin Beiber doing his own revision of "Peaches"

Wow, that's a petty negative view of band members. To the contrary, it is possible to find players that are committed to learning the material before putting their spin on it. My band mates for example like to learn everything note for note and then we may tweak. I always learn the orig and the usually put a 'club' vibe on it. But, it's not unusual for me to play to the orig 100x times to under stand the feel of some parts.

 

[LBS-bass]

Wow, that's a petty negative view of band members. To the contrary, it is possible to find players that are committed to learning the material before putting their spin on it. My band mates for example like to learn everything note for note and then we may tweak. I always learn the orig and the usually put a 'club' vibe on it. But, it's not unusual for me to play to the orig 100x times to under stand the feel of some parts.

The way things work in one band I am in where we chase around a lot of improvised stuff that we've never played before in order to establish repertoire is like this.

Someone starts playing a song. We all chime in with our best "half fast" version of it, and we all have a ton of fun figuring out how to get all the changes under our fingers as we're usually playing something we don't really know, and doing it completely by ear. Believe it or not, these "half fast" versions usually sound pretty good because we're all pretty experienced.

If we decide to add that song to our repertoire list, we will all go and review the actual recorded version and put it under our fingers as it was recorded. We bring that back to rehearsal, play through it and eventually it develops a life of its own. So we go from "half fast" to N4N to something greater than the sum of those parts, IMO. This whole process is a lot of fun for all of us and the music part is quite rewarding in many ways. It's always good to get more material under your fingers in a studied way and it's always fun to improvise. I love that this band can marry the two.

 

[tshapiro]

The way things work in one band I am in where we chase around a lot of improvised stuff that we've never played before in order to establish repertoire is like this.

Someone starts playing a song. We all chime in with our best "half fast" version of it, and we all have a ton of fun figuring out how to get all the changes under our fingers as we're usually playing something we don't really know, and doing it completely by ear. Believe it or not, these "half fast" versions usually sound pretty good because we're all pretty experienced.

If we decide to add that song to our repertoire list, we will all go and review the actual recorded version and put it under our fingers as it was recorded. We bring that back to rehearsal, play through it and eventually it develops a life of its own. So we go from "half fast" to N4N to something greater than the sum of those parts, IMO. This whole process is a lot of fun for all of us and the music part is quite rewarding in many ways. It's always good to get more material under your fingers in a studied way and it's always fun to improvise. I love that this band can marry the two.

Cool to find like minded band mates

 

[51PRI]

Wow, that's a petty negative view of band members. To the contrary, it is possible to find players that are committed to learning the material before putting their spin on it. My band mates for example like to learn everything note for note and then we may tweak. I always learn the orig and the usually put a 'club' vibe on it. But, it's not unusual for me to play to the orig 100x times to under stand the feel of some parts.

Not negative, just realistic. I wish I was in a band like you guys

 

[bassicmike]

You sound like you're more than ready to get out there and do some auditions.

Can you pick up a song on the fly by watching the guitarist's hands? It's a helpful skill to have.

And I'll just add - be open minded about the audition process. Don't dismiss an opportunity just because. I've played in a coverband for over 5 years - Bollywood, Indian pop music covers. I'm having as much fun playing as I've ever had. Nice bandmates, fun music, and the wedding gigs are $$$!

Alright, thanks for all the replies people!!

Some of it was enlightening, some of it was terrifying, and some of it I kinda knew, or expected.

I can't possibly reply to all of these, but I'll try to hit a few...

-Do I have a good ear? Yep, I can typically listen to someone else play something, and play with it in short order.

-Can I sing? Yep (and in pitch no less )...but...I've never mastered singing AND playing, I always end up singing some kind of version of my bass line LOL, I can't separate the 2, but in fairness I've never really given it a chance...I'll start working on it...

-Do I have the gear? Yep, I've pretty much got most any bass for the job, pointy headstocks all the way to the usual Fender J & P...I recently flipped my 5er though...so I may have to buy another...As far as amps & cabs, yeah there's no problem there. And yeah all my gear is in perfect shape (junky stuff drives me insane)

-Do I know any covers now? Yep, probably have about 2 hours worth...Stuff like Mustang Sally, Brick House, Stand by Me, Escape (The Pina Colada song), all the way through a few "hair bands" (Def Leppard) then a few "Seattle favorites" (lots of AiC and STP), I have some southern rock stuff like Simple Man, and a few ZZ Top tunes, as far as Rock I have few VH tunes, and a few AC/DC tunes, Metal?...I could probably play 70% of Metallica's catalog...now, Pop or Country not so much...I don't hate it, but it's not my usual (looks like I need to check some out).

So I guess I feel like I can do this....with the proper prep (gonna need to spend a TON of time in the woodshed).

For me, I guess my list of current weaknesses are...
-Can't sing & play...Yet
-Limited catalog at the moment.
-I can read TAB, but I can't sight read sheet music
-Can really only play bass...I can play real basic "campfire cords" on guitar though.
-REALLY hate playing with a pic...but I know some songs need it so...I'll practice.

Thanks again everybody! I've got work to do.

 

[Turtle71]

OK, I guess it's time for a follow up here...

With all the help and suggestions from many of you (I truly appreciate it), I landed my first real cover band gig about a month ago! The audition was a fun yet very nervous experience, but the guys were great, and after a few minutes it felt good to be playing...It helped that I know a couple of these dudes...I had the job by the time I left.

Anyway...I got the song list, it's about 50 ish tunes (we'll be adding more), they vary in styles, and most of the songs I've heard before, so that helps.

So a question for the veterans that do this thing for a living (or at least for some "fun money")...How do you keep the songs fresh? I mean I'm not really having any issue learning them (though there are a couple that are gonna be some work...) but I don't have limitless time in the day to learn the stuff, and still have time to go back and play the entirety of the list frequently. I practice and/or work on the tunes daily.

So, what's your take? How do you guys/girls do it? Do you learn all the tunes (obviously), then maybe spend 1 day a week "playing a setlist"? or do you freshen up the tunes on a "as needed", or "per gig" basis?

Thanks again for the help peeps!

 

[LBS-bass]

OK, I guess it's time for a follow up here...

With all the help and suggestions from many of you (I truly appreciate it), I landed my first real cover band gig about a month ago! The audition was a fun yet very nervous experience, but the guys were great, and after a few minutes it felt good to be playing...It helped that I know a couple of these dudes...I had the job by the time I left.

Anyway...I got the song list, it's about 50 ish tunes (we'll be adding more), they vary in styles, and most of the songs I've heard before, so that helps.

So a question for the veterans that do this thing for a living (or at least for some "fun money")...How do you keep the songs fresh? I mean I'm not really having any issue learning them (though there are a couple that are gonna be some work...) but I don't have limitless time in the day to learn the stuff, and still have time to go back and play the entirety of the list frequently. I practice and/or work on the tunes daily.

So, what's your take? How do you guys/girls do it? Do you learn all the tunes (obviously), then maybe spend 1 day a week "playing a setlist"? or do you freshen up the tunes on a "as needed", or "per gig" basis?

Thanks again for the help peeps!

Every time a band books a gig, a set list for that show gets put together. I practice the songs on the list before the show.

Most of the time, the songs on the list will be songs already in our repertoire with a few new things added. So I don't have to learn a bunch of new material, just go over the changes to make sure I remember them and how the songs go, overall. I don't have to play the whole song, just the trouble spots or things I might forget. Then I can spend more time learning the few new ones that have been added.

 

[Reedt2000]

OK, I guess it's time for a follow up here...

With all the help and suggestions from many of you (I truly appreciate it), I landed my first real cover band gig about a month ago! The audition was a fun yet very nervous experience, but the guys were great, and after a few minutes it felt good to be playing...It helped that I know a couple of these dudes...I had the job by the time I left.

Anyway...I got the song list, it's about 50 ish tunes (we'll be adding more), they vary in styles, and most of the songs I've heard before, so that helps.

So a question for the veterans that do this thing for a living (or at least for some "fun money")...How do you keep the songs fresh? I mean I'm not really having any issue learning them (though there are a couple that are gonna be some work...) but I don't have limitless time in the day to learn the stuff, and still have time to go back and play the entirety of the list frequently. I practice and/or work on the tunes daily.

So, what's your take? How do you guys/girls do it? Do you learn all the tunes (obviously), then maybe spend 1 day a week "playing a setlist"? or do you freshen up the tunes on a "as needed", or "per gig" basis?

Thanks again for the help peeps!

I usually set aside a couple hours, figure out the parts and chords structure, make charts (got a Microsoft surface so I make my cheat sheets on it and then it's my tablet on a stand at gigs) and we start playing them out. If this is new material to everyone then you'll all be in the same boat. If you rehearse then you have even more opportunities to get stuff tight.

At first the charts guide me until it's comfortable, then stay as a guide to the lyrics (cause for some reason I can memorize crap tons of bass parts but need constant reminders for the words )

 

[buldog5151bass]

At auditions, when asked what I was looking for, my standard line is I want good gigs with a good musicians - that's more important than any particular kind of music.

 

[pepj]

To keep it fresh, i crib the basic idea of the bassline and then do my thing.
It keeps it interesting for me.
I expect other members to do the same, unless you really need the signature part.
This way each nuance retains the identity of the song but it can also throw out things to react to and take the song somewhere good.

You have to have people who can create relevant parts as opposed to play free form nonsense and stay in context of the song.

 

[SoCal80s]

I don't have limitless time in the day to learn the stuff, and still have time to go back and play the entirety of the list frequently.

I assume you're asking how to I keep the songs fresh in my mind. When I learn the song, I don't just learn how to play it, I memorize it section by section and don't consider the song to be "learned" until I can play it through by memory. Then, a day or two after each gig we put together a set list for the next gig. That means we have a firm list at least 5 days before the gig, usually. I go through the set list and ask myself "do I remember how this one goes?" If so, then I don't bother with it. If not, then I go through it again. I work my way down the set list this way. Sometimes I only have 30 minutes a day, in that case I will stop when my time is up and then pick up where I left off the next day and keep going down the list.

It helps if the band limits how often you add new songs. My band already has plenty of material to cover any gig, so we don't add more than 4 new songs a month, but a band that is just starting out might have to add 4 a week just to get enough material built up.

 

[hrodbert696]

OK, I guess it's time for a follow up here...

With all the help and suggestions from many of you (I truly appreciate it), I landed my first real cover band gig about a month ago! The audition was a fun yet very nervous experience, but the guys were great, and after a few minutes it felt good to be playing...It helped that I know a couple of these dudes...I had the job by the time I left.

Anyway...I got the song list, it's about 50 ish tunes (we'll be adding more), they vary in styles, and most of the songs I've heard before, so that helps.

So a question for the veterans that do this thing for a living (or at least for some "fun money")...How do you keep the songs fresh? I mean I'm not really having any issue learning them (though there are a couple that are gonna be some work...) but I don't have limitless time in the day to learn the stuff, and still have time to go back and play the entirety of the list frequently. I practice and/or work on the tunes daily.

So, what's your take? How do you guys/girls do it? Do you learn all the tunes (obviously), then maybe spend 1 day a week "playing a setlist"? or do you freshen up the tunes on a "as needed", or "per gig" basis?

Thanks again for the help peeps!

Congratulations on landing the gig!

A lot depends on time frame - is there a gig booked that you have to be ready for by a specific date?

When I need to be able to play a lot fast that I don't already know, then it may be necessary to bring the despised cheat sheet, maybe even (gasp) a music stand. I've done that on a sub gig, and I focus on just charting out chord progressions and playing from those (hopefully you've learned scales and chord tones - if not, time to bone up on them!).

Under more ordinary circumstances, when there's plenty of time, decide how many songs you can learn in a week (I assume this band rehearses weekly). Get those roughed in so you can at least stumble through them at rehearsal. Next week, brush them up and get them tighter, and meanwhile start roughing in a few more. I usually figure four a week is reasonable, more if they're simpler (bunch of 12-bar blues), less if they're complicated (prog rock, etc.).

Learn the common chord progressions - I IV V, or I V vi IV, whatever. You'll be able to get through a song without wasting unnecessary time on it if you spot that it's 12-bar in G. Also, think in terms of song structure - break a song into its A, B, C sections (usually verse/chorus/bridge, but some vary).

I set up my practice space with playlists on a computer running through a mixer to headphones (practicing silently - a playlist on your phone through an Aux cord will do the trick too, or whatever). Songs I've already learned I'll just put on shuffle and play them as they come up to make sure I'm fresh on them. Don't need to spend three hours going through every single one every day, just sampling enough to make sure I can do it.

Meanwhile, anything more challenging or specific that I'm working on that week I'll take some time to go over in detail.

Once you've been doing it a while, it will become second nature. I can walk into a room and if they want to play Sweet Home Alabama or Walk This Way or Hit Me With Your Best Shot, I don't need to go home and rehearse it to be able to jump in. I was in one band for a while that had been playing together for 10 or 12 years before and never used a set list. The guitarist would just start playing and say "This one's in A!" and off I went. That's not to brag, I'm not some genius musician - it's just that you get to the point after a few years that you can do that.

 

[pepj]

To learn quickly and easily, if you know the song in your head..ie, it has a verse, bridge, chorus etc, you only really want to know where the changes are. And many leads ins are pretty obvious anyway.
So, you have few sections to cover in any sequence a particular band plays them in. Learn to hear intervals and you have got 95% of popular songs pretty much covered.

You can 'learn' a popular 25 song set in about 2 day's with the above. But you need good ears and need to weed out difficult songs you've never heard much before. If you get longer to cram, then big bonus.