Cutting through

[thefaceofbass]

I don’t play professionally,I attend a few different open mics…and listen a lot ,,take note of what amp and cab configurations are used.and basses,and strings . At these open mics,,the bass is not running through the PA..which I find irritating,,but I guess the PA system that is brought by whomever is running the jam is not capable? At least this is what has been suggested to me. Anyway,it seems to me that a 4x10 cab seems to be heard much better than other cabinets. And I have heard guys running single 15’s,,2x10’s,and even a combo one 15 and a 2x10… so does this make sense to anyone here?

Volume is generally the reason there isn't PA support at these open jams. Competent players will match the amps volume with the drums and band. A drummer, 2 guitarists with amps and a bass player can be loud for a small bar. They don't need PA support.

I ran a weekly blues jam for about 1.5 years, and have attended numerous jams in different cities. At a decent jam there will be one bass rig that all bass players will be using as they rotate through their turn to play. Some guys have active pickups with a hot signal, some basses are passive with lower output, some are passive with high output. It's difficult for a bass player to plug into an amp they're unfamiliar with and get their tone or volume dialed in the short time they have up there. I've seen everything from guys turning their volume knob down because they were timid, others trying to turn the volume on the amp way up, guys with active basses not engaging a -db switch etc... If a jam had PA support these issues would be mainly resolved by a good sound man. The majority of jams are in bars where the vocals get the PA, sometimes a kick drum or acoustic instrument and so forth. If you're doing open mics at a more amateur location, guys might be bringing in their own rigs, then you've got even more variables.

Making tone judgements about basses, amps and speaker size from listening at jams or open mics really won't offer you valuable info. If you frequent the same jam, then you can start gaining some useful info: you'll learn the particular amp being provided, you may become friends with the house bass player and maybe they spend more time with you on getting your sound up there. Has the bass player rolled back his volume or tone knob? Has the guy with the active bass boosted his mids/lows/highs by +15db? If the cab has a tweeter is the knob on the back fully open or turned down? Far too many variables.

A good 4x10" cab could be eq'd to sound muddy, bright or just right. Same with a 2x12", 1x15" etc...

 

[ctmullins]

Look up the SPL of perspective cabs ratings and compare. I don’t own any of the current cabs being made, so my experience will not help you much. That said, my Eden D series cabs are rated at 103% efficient. DNA cabs are also very efficient. If you do the math, my Eden D-210- XST when powered with 400 watts can generate up to 127 dBs. My experience with that is it can handle just about any gig with FOH support, and I’ve covered some rooms seating up to 700 people without FOH support.

However not to muddy up the waters, but from what I understand here from the engineers, certain manufacturers may be very (ahem) liberal with their testing methods to provide better specs. So as you go through the winnowing process, just keep that in mind. I can assure you, you will most likely hear the difference in output of an honest 100%+ efficient cab, a pretender, or a cab rated at say 95%

I hope this helps.

"103% efficient" - hahaha!

I'm guessing/hoping you meant "103dB".

Otherwise you have managed to break the laws of physics, and stand to make an absolute fortune selling energy back to the world!

 

[agedhorse]

Look up the SPL of perspective cabs ratings and compare. I don’t own any of the current cabs being made, so my experience will not help you much. That said, my Eden D series cabs are rated at 103% efficient. DNA cabs are also very efficient. If you do the math, my Eden D-210- XST when powered with 400 watts can generate up to 127 dBs. My experience with that is it can handle just about any gig with FOH support, and I’ve covered some rooms seating up to 700 people without FOH support.

However not to muddy up the waters, but from what I understand here from the engineers, certain manufacturers may be very (ahem) liberal with their testing methods to provide better specs. So as you go through the winnowing process, just keep that in mind. I can assure you, you will most likely hear the difference in output of an honest 100%+ efficient cab, a pretender, or a cab rated at say 95%

I hope this helps.

Just to clarify, efficiency can't be over 100% efficiency for anything, that enters into "perpetual motion" territory. Typical speaker efficiency is between 1% and 5%.

You probably mean 103dB/1W/1M, which is very efficient.

 

[Jazzdogg]

I understand that many bassist want to be heard and I'm not preaching "feel" over "hear".

IME, I think one of the best "heard" basses are the EBMM Stingrays.

But I gotta end with "bottom". As a child, it was that bottom and feel sound of the bass that made me want to learn how to play it.

"To each his/her own."

IME, what the bass sounds like on stage is seldom representative of what it sounds like in the audience.

Being mostly a fretless player, I like to hear myself clearly on stage so I can assure I'm playing in tune. In consequence, I have a strong preference for cabinets that aim the sound at my ears instead of my shins. I find the placement of my cab(s) on stage, EQ, and use of a variable high-pass filter critical to getting a good sound without playing too loudly.

I also find it very helpful to play through a wireless rig so I can go out into the audience to hear what I sound like to audience members and FOH.

 

[dbsfgyd1]

Just to clarify, efficiency can't be over 100% efficiency for anything, that enters into "perpetual motion" territory. Typical speaker efficiency is between 1% and 5%.

You probably mean 103dB/1W/1M, which is very efficient.

Thank you for the correction.

 

[dbsfgyd1]

"103% efficient" - hahaha!

I'm guessing/hoping you meant "103dB".

Otherwise you have managed to break the laws of physics, and stand to make an absolute fortune selling energy back to the world!

Lumps taken. Thanks.

 

[eaglemachine]

Speaker size is less important than the quality of the drivers and the design of the box it is in. 4x10’s can be really loud. A Greenboy F112 can get just about as loud as a basic 4x10. A GK 15 neo doesn’t actually go that low even though it’s a 15. It’s all about how the cab is tuned.

Also, If you are having trouble cutting through or hearing yourself, boost your mids where other instruments aren’t. For example, guitar tends to occupy 2-5ish kHz, so boost your mids below that frequency.

 

[tvbop]

This is an easy problem to fix. If the ensemble is bass heavy.. ie two guitars strumming neck PU's, heavy keys etc as an extreme example then you need to kill bass and push mids like crazy. On stage it'll sound mean but in the room you'll be punchin.

If the band are bass light and treble heavy then use a bit more bass in your tone. Takes a while to figure but it really is quite simple really and has little to do with speaker configuration. Also, a light touch on your strings just behind the primary PU creates more punch.