David Goldflies & The Bros, why didn't it work out with Gregg?

[JimmyM]

My biggest revelation was when I saw him play with a Carl Thompson bass!!! Wow! That's something to take notice of! ....and Claypool wasn't even born yet! (Maybe?).
JimmyJam

LOL! Les is 54 and was born in 1963

On a side note, I once read an interview with Gregg where he said why they chose Allen Woody...apparently the bassists they were auditioning would show up with one amp, sometimes a small one, and Allen showed up with a truck full of SVT's and they appreciated that he knew what it took to hang in a band like theirs

 

[s_wood]

... and Allen played his Alembic at the audition, btw.

 

[JimmyJammin]

Wow! Interesting info on Allen's audition!

... and Allen played his Alembic at the audition, btw.

 

[mihayloff]

from '79-'81 he was imo the perfect bass sound for the ABB as the '80s sound usurped most of rock music giving them a good taste of the old Berry flavor yet updated with his stylish Alembic perkiness which seemed to jell perfectly with the Toler / Betts era boys. but it's often said Gregg wasn't so thrilled and eventually wanted him out as some members continued a tumultuous path for many years of uneven releases. was it really Gregg vs David or were others involved in the unhappy marriage as well that caused further change, label pressure for hits, or just collateral damage from the tough times they faced internally and externally? for me there's far too few examples of the band in top form at that stage of their career to enjoy and David always excels.

This is disappointing to hear and I'm surprised by it. Did Gregg think the same about Allen Woody who also played a Series 1 much of the time during his tenure?

 

[Roger W]

IMO the Alembic does not pair well with the ABB sound although Barry had hot rodded a P bass.
Lots of factors can come into play but some bands were very specific about the P Bass sound.
I read Stephen Stills was insistant about having a P bass for CSN&Y.
Hats off to Barry for playing some great lines with a great band.

It was a J with an added Hagstrom pickup.

 

[msw]

Allen Woody was loved by all. In Greg Allman's book he had many nice things to say about him including his playing and sense of humor.

 

[Ross W. Lovell]

from '79-'81 he was imo the perfect bass sound for the ABB as the '80s sound usurped most of rock music giving them a good taste of the old Berry flavor yet updated with his stylish Alembic perkiness which seemed to jell perfectly with the Toler / Betts era boys. but it's often said Gregg wasn't so thrilled and eventually wanted him out as some members continued a tumultuous path for many years of uneven releases. was it really Gregg vs David or were others involved in the unhappy marriage as well that caused further change, label pressure for hits, or just collateral damage from the tough times they faced internally and externally? for me there's far too few examples of the band in top form at that stage of their career to enjoy and David always excels.

And yet, when I saw them in the 80's apparently the guy playing the key-tar wasn't a problem?

Wasn't enough pharma to erase that image from my mind.

 

[msw]

Very true. They lost their way there for awhile. All in all there were some really good periods throughout their nearly 50 year run. I guess the first band and the last were my favorites if I had to choose. I'm still amazed that guys in their early twenties could play that great.......even while high!

 

[Bass V]

And yet, when I saw them in the 80's apparently the guy playing the key-tar wasn't a problem?

Wasn't enough pharma to erase that image from my mind.

if it was Dan Toler it should have been a great nite

 

[mihayloff]

if it was Dan Toler it should have been a great nite

It was Mike Lawler who played that thing. Should have just left it to Jan Hammer and Miami Vice.

 

[dsteinschneider]

Rook was very talented, without doubt. But his playing was always in front of the beat.

I was just listening to the 83 Jessica outdoors. Rook was playing the right soaring bass lines but I noticed the entire song seemed rushed. I found another song from that day that also seemed rushed. Maybe not his fault but there it was.

 

[s_wood]

A lot of the shows from that last tour seem really rushed. By that time Jaimoe had been replaced by David Toler. Before that the tempos were fine. I would be inclined to attribute the increased tempos to the personnel change, although in Gregg Allman's book he said that Goldflies played "like he got paid by the note." A change in the band's recreational chemistry can't be ruled out, either. In the "One Way Out" book Jaimoe says cocaine led "edgy and fast" tempos.

 

[s_wood]

Here's Goldflies reply to Gregg Allman's criticism, excerpted from Allen Paul's "One Way Out:"
"In his book, Gregg said that I played too many notes. But I never once remember Gregg asking me to play any specific way. I would have loved some feedback from a musician of his caliber! Conversely, Dickey and I spoke all the time about music and he was like, "Jazz it up … rip it out." I was playing the way Dickey wanted me to, and he was very patient and gracious with his time, showing me what he wanted. We spent a lot of time on buses and in hotel rooms playing together and working things out. It became a mentor/mentee relationship."

 

[jerry]

Here's Goldflies reply to Gregg Allman's criticism, excerpted from Allen Paul's "One Way Out:"
"In his book, Gregg said that I played too many notes. But I never once remember Gregg asking me to play any specific way. I would have loved some feedback from a musician of his caliber! Conversely, Dickey and I spoke all the time about music and he was like, "Jazz it up … rip it out." I was playing the way Dickey wanted me to, and he was very patient and gracious with his time, showing me what he wanted. We spent a lot of time on buses and in hotel rooms playing together and working things out. It became a mentor/mentee relationship."

That probably was the bottom line on the problem, Goldflies was playing in Dickey's band before and Dickey brought him in, politics. The tempo thing was probably the blow they all were doing!

 

[sowilson]

Love the picture of the B-302 Guild, great bass BTW. I started on a Jazz bass (circa 1975) and it had a lot of dead spots so I sold it and bought a black Guild B-302. As I remember it sat in the mix quite well. I wish I still had it, sold it to have an Alembic Spoiler made. I think the Alembic sat in fine with ABB. It's a good bass for fitting into a busy band (muti drums, multi keyboards, multi guitars like ABB).

 

[s_wood]

I think the Alembic sat in fine with ABB. It's a good bass for fitting into a busy band (muti drums, multi keyboards, multi guitars like ABB).

I'm an Alembic player, and I completely agree. Alembics are uniquely well suited to cut through a busy mix. I loved Rook's Alembic tone with the ABB - and also Allan Woody's, who often used an Alembic with them, especially in the studio.

 

[edmidlifecrisis]

I saw David play late last year at the GABBA fest in Macon where my wife's band opened the weekend. He was great- he played in some end-of-festival ABB jams with a bunch of folks who played over the weekend and seemed like a nice fellow as I was backstage for most of the shows. He was playing a 5 string J bass.

Here's a photo

 

[bigswifty1]

I guess I'm super late to this thread but I just watched the University of Florida gig on youtube and I really enjoyed Rook's playing and tone although it took me by surprise at first. Really pretty jarring if you're used to some of their other bassists, but by the middle of the first song (Jessica) I totally loved it, and I found his busy (sometimes almost hyperactive) playing to be a pretty nice change for the band. I was entirely happy with how the Alembic sat in the mix and enjoyed how I could really hear his occasional chordal work.

I can see what a few people have said about the Alembic and his style but I really dug it and it was one or the best parts of the performance for me.

 

[dsteinschneider]

Just listened to the audio book version of "One Way Out". Reminded me to give the Goldflies era ABB another listen. A point made strongly in the book is that they worked to avoid turning into a Duane era ABB karaoke version of themselves so Rook's playing makes sense to me although I prefer Lamar, Allan and Oteil. I give Rook credit for doing something different.

 

[Rook]

I guess I'm super late to this thread but I just watched the University of Florida gig on youtube and I really enjoyed Rook's playing and tone although it took me by surprise at first. Really pretty jarring if you're used to some of their other bassists, but by the middle of the first song (Jessica) I totally loved it, and I found his busy (sometimes almost hyperactive) playing to be a pretty nice change for the band. I was entirely happy with how the Alembic sat in the mix and enjoyed how I could really hear his occasional chordal work.

I can see what a few people have said about the Alembic and his style but I really dug it and it was one or the best parts of the performance for me.

Thanks bigswifty1. This all happened so long ago. What strikes in this thread is that pretty much all the time everything was made up. What I mean by that is that no one ever ssid to me "sound like Berry or "sound like Lamar". Dickey did have preferences but and I was encouraged to bring my "take" to the music. And that's what I did for better or worse.

As to the tempos, yes they could be insanely quick - especially on the Gainesville show. In my legacy ABB group a Brothers Revival we specifically decided to use the tempos on some tunes (Jessica, Southbound) to be able to authentically represent that era of the band. I do know the band had traveled all night the night before the gig and got to Gainesville about an hour and a half before the show. I can't speak for anyone else but I was beyond tired. No artificial energy for me on the gig though. That night I learned that being tired can result in a performance where limitations are disregarded. You exist the moment and go for it. Which, we did!