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Double Bass Definition of overstand

#42
Damon Rondeau said:
I've noticed that el cheapo Crapatinos tend to have near-vertical necks and stubby little bridges. Why is that, do you think? Is it ignorance or is there some kind of money-saving going on?
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Ignorance.


Durrl- where o' where didja get that great pic? Could we have an emoticon for popcorn-eating?
 
#44
Nnicklloyd said:
Durrl- where o' where didja get that great pic? Could we have an emoticon for popcorn-eating?
Click to expand...

I found it up in BG, an' I hadda wade through a lotta icky slab posts to get at it, too.
smiley_puke.gif



But in the end, it was worth it. :)

If ya ever wanna use it, just quote me and copy the "img" coded stuff to your machine, then paste. That pic rocks, dunnit?
 
#46
Silversorcerer said:
Are there noticeable historical trends toward higher overstands in DB construction? Does this parallel historical development of thumb position technique?
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Apparently it has something to do with gut vs. steel strings too. Luthiers and Bass experts can confirm this, but it seems like maybe the older basses had more steep neck pitch to increase the angle over the bridge, and subsequently the downward pressure on the top. If this were coupled with a higher overstand like we use today, the bridge height would be excessive. To increase the neck pitch without making the bridge too tall, the overstand has to shrink. So I guess this means that basses converted for "the modern school of steel strings" have the neck pushed out to reduce the pitch and increase the overstand making them also easier to play in thumb position. This makes sense to me physically but having not worked on many basses (read none) I don't know for sure if this is the case. Pictures I've seen of old french basses with original necks seem to conform to this hypothosis.
-Jon
 
#48
i heard that they do that so they can get them in a smaller box so they can get more on a shipment and make more money. basically it saves shipping space which saves tons of $. kays and englehardts are like that too. think about it: shave a few inches off of the width of the box and instead of say 20 basses in a certain cargo space you can fit maybe 22 or 23 or 24--now bring that out to 2000 basses - instead of shipping 2000 you can ship an extra 200 or 300 or whatever. that's big bucks.
maybe i'm wrong...
i used to ship cars in ocean containers to cambodia and they would pack those containers full-5 camrys in a single container!
 
#49
arnoldschnitzer said:
Sorry, no. Most earlier basses had lower pitch and overstand. The makers expected very high gut strings to be used. The bass bars were weaker so the tops did not need more pressure.
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Thanks Arnold. It must have been an optical illusion. That's how we learn I guess. Just out of curiosity, what was the "standard" string height back in the 1800's? It seems like most sources list ideal gut string height being about 11-16mm or thereabouts in the later part of the 20th century. I assume it used to be even higher. On restored 3-string basses Ive seen, it seems like the third string might be as much as 3/4" or more.

Jon
 
#50
CB3000 said:
i heard that they do that so they can get them in a smaller box so they can get more on a shipment and make more money. basically it saves shipping space which saves tons of $. kays and englehardts are like that too. think about it: shave a few inches off of the width of the box and instead of say 20 basses in a certain cargo space you can fit maybe 22 or 23 or 24--now bring that out to 2000 basses - instead of shipping 2000 you can ship an extra 200 or 300 or whatever. that's big bucks.
maybe i'm wrong...
i used to ship cars in ocean containers to cambodia and they would pack those containers full-5 camrys in a single container!
Click to expand...

It seems plausible, although basses arn't made or shipped in the same quantity as cars I would think, and shipping boxes are usually standard sizes like 36 x 36 x 72 or whatever. Maybe it has something to do with using the wood of the neck blanks most efficiently(?)

Jon
 
#51
KSB - Ken Smith said:
How do you put Pallotta and Stainer in the same sentence? Stainer was one of the greatest that ever lived. Pallotta was just one of thousands that made string instruments. In Europe, the 3 main Schools followed were Amati, Stainer and Stradivari. Pallotta never came close to any of them. Sorry....


I have to disagree. Neither the Amatis, Stainer, or the Stradivaris made double basses. Palotta did and his are fabulous, although there are many basses around with Palotta labels that are not by him.
Also Stainer either was trained by the Amatis or he studiously copied them as they are scarcely distinguishable.
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#52
Stainer is reported to have made Basses and there are many claims about Amati Basses as far back as the late 16th century. Stainer was married into the Amati Family as well. Strad is the only one of the 3 without Double Basses to his name.

I would rather hear names like Rogeri, Goffriller, Montagnana, Gagliano etc. instead of Pallotta if it's Italian we are looking for. I have played 1 or 2 Pallottas b4. Nice Basses but not even in the Class of the Best English Bases.
 

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