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DI = mud
- Thread starter Floyd Eye
- Start date
I couldn't tell from the videos, and if you mentioned it here, I missed it. What kind of cabinet(s) are you playing through?If your drummer couldn't head you, you could have turned your rig toward him. I do it all the time.
Normally my rig is angled towards the center and he is set up slightly in front of me. This wasn't really possible last night. The headliners were backlined and we were cramped up on stage between all their stuff.
I have Carvin cabs. A 1x18 and a 4x10. The amp is a Carvin RL1000 with a blown out preamp ( hence the SansAmp, which sounds boatloads better than the Carvin ever did anyway). Carvin apparently sells rigs with mismatched impedance. I have an 8 ohm and a 4 ohm, so I'm only really getting about 600 watts out of it. Like I said, it is normally plenty loud. Really loud even. But they had a monster PA last night and there is no way my rig could have kept up with it.
The sound guy did not have two mixes to use? That is probably why you were in the monitors.
It might be beneficial to give the sound man two signals - one of just your bass and one with all the effects. Two DI signals. Sounds like he mixed the tone you gave him to sound good on it's own, but never realized where it will sit in the mix. Nor did he realize that you needed more midrange in the signal to get it above the drums and at least close to the vocals volume-wise. Or he might have scooped out too much midrange on his end. Not sure.
Justin Chancellor currently run three GK heads with various pedals for a total of three sounds. All three are blended and messed with to give him whatever he wants in the studio. I am pretty sure he is doing something very similar live.
It might be beneficial to give the sound man two signals - one of just your bass and one with all the effects. Two DI signals. Sounds like he mixed the tone you gave him to sound good on it's own, but never realized where it will sit in the mix. Nor did he realize that you needed more midrange in the signal to get it above the drums and at least close to the vocals volume-wise. Or he might have scooped out too much midrange on his end. Not sure.
Justin Chancellor currently run three GK heads with various pedals for a total of three sounds. All three are blended and messed with to give him whatever he wants in the studio. I am pretty sure he is doing something very similar live.
OK, a few things....
18"s are cool for the rehearsal room, but don't bring one on stage. (Unless you're using an Acoustic 370 rig, and need to fill the room.) I used to run a 410 and 18, and soundguys HATED me. You're gonna be pushing LF all over the place and mudding up the FOH mix. You're much better off with an 810 of sorts.
Secondly, 8ohms plus 4 ohms actually equals approximately 2.6 ohms.
18"s are cool for the rehearsal room, but don't bring one on stage. (Unless you're using an Acoustic 370 rig, and need to fill the room.) I used to run a 410 and 18, and soundguys HATED me. You're gonna be pushing LF all over the place and mudding up the FOH mix. You're much better off with an 810 of sorts.
Secondly, 8ohms plus 4 ohms actually equals approximately 2.6 ohms.
Yeah, 2. something. Either way, doing the math I am not getting 1000 watts, which I would if they were both 8 ohm cabs for a total load of 4, which is what the amp is rated for. At 2.6 ohms, I am getting somewhere near 600 watts.
Lots of people use 1x15 and 4x10 cabs on stage. However, I agree and it is my intention to ditch these cabs altogether ASAP for an 8x10. Alas, I am a broke mofo.
If the amp is only rated for 4 ohms, and you're running it at 2.6, stop! You'll eventually melt your amp! If the RL series can run at 2 ohms, disregard this statement.
I bet you could find a used Ampeg 810 for around 500 bucks. I wouldn't pay a dime more for one, and I own 2.
Sell that 18 and 410!If the amp is only rated for 4 ohms, and you're running it at 2.6, stop! You'll eventually melt your amp! If the RL series can run at 2 ohms, disregard this statement.
I bet you could find a used Ampeg 810 for around 500 bucks. I wouldn't pay a dime more for one, and I own 2.
The amp can handle 2 ohms. Carvin sold the rig that way.
I totally agree. I actually saw one the other day on CL for $350. Like I said, broke mofo.
I thought the bass sounded fine in the last two clips. Sounded much clearer on Sober really... With the PA
I would try the bass into a DI and run effects post DI and mic the cab to get the sonic characteristics of your effects through the cab, you're only a 3 piece band, I myself as a Soundguy would DI and mic you to get some extra channels to play with out front to sculpt your sound and help make the band sound fatter!
I've found I have to run the HPF on basses to an astonishing 150hz sometimes to clean up the muddiness in the system, once I've done that I have their true tone. I also have to attenuate my subs to -2db to get them to "gel" with the mids and highs.
That being said, A poorly tuned PA can result in muddy bass.
I would try the bass into a DI and run effects post DI and mic the cab to get the sonic characteristics of your effects through the cab, you're only a 3 piece band, I myself as a Soundguy would DI and mic you to get some extra channels to play with out front to sculpt your sound and help make the band sound fatter!
I've found I have to run the HPF on basses to an astonishing 150hz sometimes to clean up the muddiness in the system, once I've done that I have their true tone. I also have to attenuate my subs to -2db to get them to "gel" with the mids and highs.
That being said, A poorly tuned PA can result in muddy bass.
The amp can handle 2 ohms. Carvin sold the rig that way.
I totally agree. I actually saw one the other day on CL for $350. Like I said, broke mofo.
Ahh cool. No transformer meltdown worries then.
@broke mofo: Start saving your portion of money from your gigs, unless you need it to survive. Almost half of my gear is from the spoils of gigging...and I've got a LOT of gear.
The amp can handle 2 ohms. Carvin sold the rig that way.
I totally agree. I actually saw one the other day on CL for $350. Like I said, broke mofo.
Trade/sell the rig you have. That would leave you rigless, but if you line it up just right, you can grab the 810e before it ends up hurting you.
- Apr 20, 2009
- 2,101
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- I'm the Squier of Fenderbirds
http://www.carvin.com/manuals/R600-R1000-seriesIII.pdf
Bridged at 4ohms you are getting 1000 watts. Mismatched ohms with two cabs...well, my nose is bleeding trying to figure it out. Is it bridged 2.6 ohms? That seems like a bad idea.
Don't know about the DI, but it seems like a soundman problem, not a DI problem.
Bridged at 4ohms you are getting 1000 watts. Mismatched ohms with two cabs...well, my nose is bleeding trying to figure it out. Is it bridged 2.6 ohms? That seems like a bad idea.
Don't know about the DI, but it seems like a soundman problem, not a DI problem.
It would have to be lined up just right for sure. Rigless will not do.
As for gig money, right now all the money we make is going to pay off the 16' enclosed trailer we just bought. Before that it was a new power amp for our PA. So gig money on personal gear is at least 2 months away.
If you like your rig, dont touch it.
I would get out of the monitors. You don't talk about what FOH even consists of, or what the monitors are, but like lots of other loud rock bands I have seen, there is more than enough guitar and vocals in the monitors to muddy up the sound. Try staying out of them. If the drummer has to have it, make sure his monitor can handle it, and it isn't facing you or the crowd. Bring your stage rig up just loud enough to hear yourself. The PA should be providing all the a$$ in the system.
I see no reason why you wouldn't get good sound out of the sansamp, especially if you aren't boosting the bass excessively.
It might be worth it to ask if the soundman is running you through a compressor, and finding out what kind of unit he is using, and if it's set up properly. You might want to ask him what else he is doing to the bass, and what his goal is.
Wes
I would get out of the monitors. You don't talk about what FOH even consists of, or what the monitors are, but like lots of other loud rock bands I have seen, there is more than enough guitar and vocals in the monitors to muddy up the sound. Try staying out of them. If the drummer has to have it, make sure his monitor can handle it, and it isn't facing you or the crowd. Bring your stage rig up just loud enough to hear yourself. The PA should be providing all the a$$ in the system.
I see no reason why you wouldn't get good sound out of the sansamp, especially if you aren't boosting the bass excessively.
It might be worth it to ask if the soundman is running you through a compressor, and finding out what kind of unit he is using, and if it's set up properly. You might want to ask him what else he is doing to the bass, and what his goal is.
Wes
Case closed
Gee, you're a real helpful guy ain't ya?
Impart some of your wisdom instead of taking shots.
You quoted parts of the opening post, did you bother to read it or are you just looking for opportunities to be an *******?
A lot of the nicer stages I've played have had a HUGE full range monitor with a dedicated mix just to the left of the drum riser. If he's just getting a wedge, bring along a box or stand for that wedge to sit at ear level. Tiltback monitors don't work as well for drummers.
