Dingwall Owners Club

[Selta]

I try to respect a weight constraint but with some flex. Ultralight aspirations haven't worked for me: I like wood and solid bodies. I've been sticking to the ash/alder combos with tops and finishes adding a bit of spice. Any of the alder/ash options should be much lighter than solid walnut, even the northern ash variants. The z is a very svelte design considering the extra 3 inches in the neck length. My z3 5er is 9.04lb with a dual ash solid body and burl maple top (I'd guess my bodacious top options from the SJ5 above might have added .5-.6 lb). I would not have any regrets with a 9.8lb Z3 6er. Here's Claude's take:

Z3 Weight Comparison summary​

	5-string	6-string
Average	8.90 lbs	9.67 lbs
Median	8.84 lbs	9.61 lbs
Range	1.13 lbs	1.11 lbs
Std deviation	~0.35–0.37 lbs	~0.42–0.47 lbs

Takeaways:

• Adding the 6th string adds roughly 0.75–0.8 lbs on average — less than you might expect for a whole extra string/tuner/wider neck, which tracks with owner comments that Z3s tend to balance well even at the higher end of the weight range.
• Both body counts show similar absolute spread (~1.1 lbs), meaning the variability is comparable — it's not that 6-strings are more inconsistent, they're just uniformly heavier.
• The 6-string's higher std deviation is mostly driven by two outliers around 10+ lbs (both custom builds with heavier finish/hardware options), while the 5-string sample clusters more tightly.
• General consensus from players lines up with this data — Dingwall owners on forums reported weights around 9.5 lbs or less, and TalkBass posts describe lighter builds around 8 lbs 14 oz, both consistent with the ranges above.

I... don't know that I believe this. The _median_ being 8.84 lbs just sounds too low. You'll certainly see a lot of sub 9lb Z3 5s, but, to say the median is 8.84 (suggesting a high population of weights under that) just sounds really low to me, anecdotally. I'd love to see whatever claude used for actual data on this, which it will tell you if prompted.
I'd personally take this with a grain of salt. I almost bet Dingwall themselves has data, though I'm not sure they can or would give it up publicly. @Dingwall - CSR , any thoughts?

 

[ThisYouCanTrust]

Yeah, maybe ask AI if it didn't forget bessel's correction

 

[Scott McArron]

I... don't know that I believe this. The _median_ being 8.84 lbs just sounds too low. You'll certainly see a lot of sub 9lb Z3 5s, but, to say the median is 8.84 (suggesting a high population of weights under that) just sounds really low to me, anecdotally. I'd love to see whatever claude used for actual data on this, which it will tell you if prompted.
I'd personally take this with a grain of salt. I almost bet Dingwall themselves has data, though I'm not sure they can or would give it up publicly. @Dingwall - CSR , any thoughts?

Idk, seems it could be legit to me. My Z3-6 is just a bit over 9 lbs. Standard dual density ash/maple/wenge fretboard. (Waaaay more comfortable to play than my NG-6 that tips over 10lbs.) 8.84lbs seems on point for a 5er, at least with something close to standard config.

 

[TTA]

when you look at the dingwall pickup frequency diagrams the super fatty is very high output and lots of lows. fdv very mid heavy (my super j has them) and moderate outpyt. fd3 get pretty hot again but are comparativly well balanced.

i love mids, but with the dg preamp i find the fd3 very versitile. mids are not lacking so i have less of a use case for fdv.

will report back on the neck super fatty on the z3 when it arrives. goal is big bottom when needed for a different vibe.

 

[TTA]

Idk, seems it could be legit to me. My Z3-6 is just a bit over 9 lbs. Standard dual density ash/maple/wenge fretboard. (Waaaay more comfortable to play than my NG-6 that tips over 10lbs.) 8.84lbs seems on point for a 5er, at least with something close to standard config.

my green bass is wenge/walnut f# so possibly as heavy as it gets. i think dingwall did a superheavy model maybe 10 years ago and this lines up somewhat.

i went walnut for a few reasons. one, i originally ordered ab2 but swapped to ab1 abd forgot to swap the body wood.

but i kept it to ensure no neck dive (100% priority over weight, and it was perfect in the end). Dingwall also felt it was an excellent choice for the f#. it has been my dream bass: it is in the 11bs range i think. i weighed all my basses once in my life and posted, but it has been a few years.

z3 will be a 5er, wenge neck, black limba body, ziricote fretboard and body. no idea the weight of black limba. lol.

 

[warbassick]

Happy fourth of July god bless our troops that have given the ultimate sacrifice and to the men and women of our Armed Forces. God bless you and America

 

[Element Zero]

when you look at the dingwall pickup frequency diagrams the super fatty is very high output and lots of lows. fdv very mid heavy (my super j has them) and moderate outpyt. fd3 get pretty hot again but are comparativly well balanced.

i love mids, but with the dg preamp i find the fd3 very versitile. mids are not lacking so i have less of a use case for fdv.

will report back on the neck super fatty on the z3 when it arrives. goal is big bottom when needed for a different vibe.

I can’t seem to understand what I’m hearing with my own experience with the FD3n’s in the NG. Assuming the import and domestic versions of the FD3n/FDV are fairly close as has been mentioned, I find myself adding a few db of a very specific low mid frequency area via EQ that’s incredibly satisfying. Yet, when listening to various videos on YouTube courtesy of John Fox, I VASTLY prefer the tones I hear with the FDV vs the Super Fatties and FD3’s. Knowing the FD3/FD3n’s have a healthy amount of low mids, I don’t get why I want MORE vs the more emphasized high mids of the FDV.

As much as I tinker with EQ I’m consistently enjoying the passive sound vs engaging the Darkglass pre. The DG seems to scoop some of the low mid freq that gives me the goosebumps when I’m in passive.

Ears are weird.

There’s something magical I hear with the various vids of the FDV/Neve combo that feels like the end game for me. Kinda Fender J, kinda Warwick Thumb, yet distinctly Dingwall/piano like.

 

[gustobassman]

I can’t seem to understand what I’m hearing with my own experience with the FD3n’s in the NG. Assuming the import and domestic versions of the FD3n/FDV are fairly close as has been mentioned, I find myself adding a few db of a very specific low mid frequency area via EQ that’s incredibly satisfying. Yet, when listening to various videos on YouTube courtesy of John Fox, I VASTLY prefer the tones I hear with the FDV vs the Super Fatties and FD3’s. Knowing the FD3/FD3n’s have a healthy amount of low mids, I don’t get why I want MORE vs the more emphasized high mids of the FDV.

As much as I tinker with EQ I’m consistently enjoying the passive sound vs engaging the Darkglass pre. The DG seems to scoop some of the low mid freq that gives me the goosebumps when I’m in passive.

Ears are weird.

There’s something magical I hear with the various vids of the FDV/Neve combo that feels like the end game for me. Kinda Fender J, kinda Warwick Thumb, yet distinctly Dingwall/piano like.

From my experience, the FD3N are actually closer to the SF2's than they are to the FD3'S. In output AND tone. The FD3N have a big bottom and a lot of top but more meat in the middle than the SF2'S. The FD3s don't go as deep or as high. Again, more of that "meat and potatoes" vs having extended frequency range.

The FDV were closest to say a regular Fender style Alnico P or J-ish tone (to me anyway). Not as much output as the FD3's, definitely less than the SF2's or FD3N. Much more of a traditional vibe vs the modern tone of the FD3N.

SF2's- I think fingerstyle, slap, gospel, chordal, flowing style lines, much more hi fi type tone. Big bottom, clean top end, kind of a light scoop if you ask me. Much more "refined" vs the FD3N although similar in character. I always seem to need to juice the mids.

FD3- rock or metal beasts, cuts like crazy with a pick or fingers, really nails *that* tone with the DGTC. Midrange dominates, but not obtrusive. More 'in your face' if you need it.

FDV- good all around balanced pickup for a more traditional feel while still being all Dingwall. A more "organic" feeling midrange, i.e. traditional tone to my ears.

FD3N- versatile, meaty, can get delicate if eq'd as such, can cover many styles. To me Eq is essential for these, although passive sounds freakin great on my JT3. Not sure if its the body woods or what, that bass has TOAN.

At this point I prefer the FD3N/Neve in the JT3 vs the SF2/Neve in my Z. Sounds crazy but the Z sounds way thin in comparison. Needs a lot more midrange EQ on the amp to get "there". The JT3 is "there" to start with. I think that Z would vastly improve with a pickup swap. For some with a delicate touch or into scooped out hifi tones, it's probably perfect. For me it's lacking meat.

Others will probably feel way different than me about this, this is just from my own experiences and the styles of music I play.

Sorry for the novel, lol..

 

[Element Zero]

From my experience, the FD3N are actually closer to the SF2's than they are to the FD3'S. In output AND tone. The FD3N have a big bottom and a lot of top but more meat in the middle than the SF2'S. The FD3s don't go as deep or as high. Again, more of that "meat and potatoes" vs having extended frequency range.

The FDV were closest to say a regular Fender style Alnico P or J-ish tone (to me anyway). Not as much output as the FD3's, definitely less than the SF2's or FD3N. Much more of a traditional vibe vs the modern tone of the FD3N.

SF2's- I think fingerstyle, slap, gospel, chordal, flowing style lines, much more hi fi type tone. Big bottom, clean top end, kind of a light scoop if you ask me. I always seem to need to juice the mids.

FD3- rock or metal beasts, cuts like crazy with a pick or fingers, really nails *that* tone with the DGTC. Midrange dominates, but not obtrusive. More 'in your face' if you need it.

FDV- good all around balanced pickup for a more traditional feel while still being all Dingwall. A more "organic" feeling midrange, i.e. traditional tone to my ears.

FD3N- versatile, meaty, can get delicate if eq'd as such, can cover many styles. To me Eq is essential for these, although passive sounds freakin great on my JT3. Not sure if its the body woods or what, that bass has TOAN.

At this point I prefer the FD3N/Neve in the JT3 vs the SF2/Neve in my Z. Sounds crazy but the Z sounds way thin in comparison. Needs a lot more midrange EQ on the amp to get "there". The JT3 is "there" to start with. I think that Z would vastly improve with a pickup swap. For some with a delicate touch or into scooped out hifi tones, it's probably perfect. For me it's lacking meat.

Others will probably feel way different than me about this, this is just from my own experiences and the styles of music I play.

Sorry for the novel, lol..

No no it’s all good. I don’t mind novels. This is all stuff that’s hard to search for to get real world experience. Thank you.

 

[warbassick]

From my experience, the FD3N are actually closer to the SF2's than they are to the FD3'S. In output AND tone. The FD3N have a big bottom and a lot of top but more meat in the middle than the SF2'S. The FD3s don't go as deep or as high. Again, more of that "meat and potatoes" vs having extended frequency range.

The FDV were closest to say a regular Fender style Alnico P or J-ish tone (to me anyway). Not as much output as the FD3's, definitely less than the SF2's or FD3N. Much more of a traditional vibe vs the modern tone of the FD3N.

SF2's- I think fingerstyle, slap, gospel, chordal, flowing style lines, much more hi fi type tone. Big bottom, clean top end, kind of a light scoop if you ask me. I always seem to need to juice the mids.

FD3- rock or metal beasts, cuts like crazy with a pick or fingers, really nails *that* tone with the DGTC. Midrange dominates, but not obtrusive. More 'in your face' if you need it.

FDV- good all around balanced pickup for a more traditional feel while still being all Dingwall. A more "organic" feeling midrange, i.e. traditional tone to my ears.

FD3N- versatile, meaty, can get delicate if eq'd as such, can cover many styles. To me Eq is essential for these, although passive sounds freakin great on my JT3. Not sure if its the body woods or what, that bass has TOAN.

At this point I prefer the FD3N/Neve in the JT3 vs the SF2/Neve in my Z. Sounds crazy but the Z sounds way thin in comparison. Needs a lot more midrange EQ on the amp to get "there". The JT3 is "there" to start with. I think that Z would vastly improve with a pickup swap. For some with a delicate touch or into scooped out hifi tones, it's probably perfect. For me it's lacking meat.

Others will probably feel way different than me about this, this is just from my own experiences and the styles of music I play.

Sorry for the novel, lol..

When I hear the Nashville edition THAT gets that deeper more mainstream tone compared to the JT I’ve got supers and a DG on my Z36 and it’s (to my ears ) deep and thick and heavy also JOHN Fox always plays through a DI and this in itself lets you hear the bass sound exactly as it plays . Not like when. We play. Ears are weird

 

[gustobassman]

When I hear the Nashville edition THAT gets that deeper more mainstream tone compared to the JT I’ve got supers and a DG on my Z36 and it’s (to my ears ) deep and thick and heavy also JOHN Fox always plays through a DI and this in itself lets you hear the bass sound exactly as it plays . Not like when. We play. Ears are weird

I agree, ears are very weird, lol. When I had my custom IEMs made, I was blown away at how completely different my right ear canal was shaped than the left. Not even close, lol. No wonder I could never get off-the -shelf buds to fit right, like ever.

 

[Subscript]

Just to add confusion to the discourse of FD3 vs FD3n, here is what supposedly Dingwall said on a post in the Facebook group.


"Hi Joey, the Canadian FD3 pickups are hand manufactured at our facility in Saskatoon, while the FD3N are manufactured on license by one of our offshore partners in Korea. They are built using the same specs so you shouldn't notice any difference in performance as they are essentially identical."

 

[TTA]

I can’t seem to understand what I’m hearing with my own experience with the FD3n’s in the NG. Assuming the import and domestic versions of the FD3n/FDV are fairly close as has been mentioned, I find myself adding a few db of a very specific low mid frequency area via EQ that’s incredibly satisfying. Yet, when listening to various videos on YouTube courtesy of John Fox, I VASTLY prefer the tones I hear with the FDV vs the Super Fatties and FD3’s. Knowing the FD3/FD3n’s have a healthy amount of low mids, I don’t get why I want MORE vs the more emphasized high mids of the FDV.

As much as I tinker with EQ I’m consistently enjoying the passive sound vs engaging the Darkglass pre. The DG seems to scoop some of the low mid freq that gives me the goosebumps when I’m in passive.

Ears are weird.

There’s something magical I hear with the various vids of the FDV/Neve combo that feels like the end game for me. Kinda Fender J, kinda Warwick Thumb, yet distinctly Dingwall/piano like.

My ears probably suck. i try not to overthink things and am more in the “this sounds cool” vs “less cool” camp.

here is dingwalls data:

i can 100% hear the mid/high mid voicing of the fdv. I always thought the fd3 was mid heavy also, just a bit lower. that is about as good as my ears get. have yet to try the rest.

wonder if the ptone : mid/bridge in series is the flattest output curve?

I also dont trust videos for tone… but then i suppose most use pretty high end di recordings. but 99% of the time i am using my potato phone, not my studio headphonez. But so much can influence the end result in a recording, that i generally trust my own ears first.

i will be tempted to put a ptone in the mid pickup in the z3. i feel like it would be versitile with sf2, ptone, fd3.

 

[5StringPocket]

From my experience, the FD3N are actually closer to the SF2's than they are to the FD3'S. In output AND tone. The FD3N have a big bottom and a lot of top but more meat in the middle than the SF2'S. The FD3s don't go as deep or as high. Again, more of that "meat and potatoes" vs having extended frequency range.

The FDV were closest to say a regular Fender style Alnico P or J-ish tone (to me anyway). Not as much output as the FD3's, definitely less than the SF2's or FD3N. Much more of a traditional vibe vs the modern tone of the FD3N.

SF2's- I think fingerstyle, slap, gospel, chordal, flowing style lines, much more hi fi type tone. Big bottom, clean top end, kind of a light scoop if you ask me. Much more "refined" vs the FD3N although similar in character. I always seem to need to juice the mids.

FD3- rock or metal beasts, cuts like crazy with a pick or fingers, really nails *that* tone with the DGTC. Midrange dominates, but not obtrusive. More 'in your face' if you need it.

FDV- good all around balanced pickup for a more traditional feel while still being all Dingwall. A more "organic" feeling midrange, i.e. traditional tone to my ears.

FD3N- versatile, meaty, can get delicate if eq'd as such, can cover many styles. To me Eq is essential for these, although passive sounds freakin great on my JT3. Not sure if its the body woods or what, that bass has TOAN.

At this point I prefer the FD3N/Neve in the JT3 vs the SF2/Neve in my Z. Sounds crazy but the Z sounds way thin in comparison. Needs a lot more midrange EQ on the amp to get "there". The JT3 is "there" to start with. I think that Z would vastly improve with a pickup swap. For some with a delicate touch or into scooped out hifi tones, it's probably perfect. For me it's lacking meat.

Others will probably feel way different than me about this, this is just from my own experiences and the styles of music I play.

Sorry for the novel, lol..

Good synopsis, thanks for posting. I have a Z3 with SFII's and Neve pre and it does have that hifi type tone. I have a 6-way selector switch which allows the DROC middle/bridge series in parallel with neck. It has more midrange presence, doesn't sound hifi, and is my finger style go to. I'm curious how the voicing might change keeping the SFII neck/middle and installing an FD3 bridge pickup? Perhaps neck/bridge in parallel would be a bit less scooped?
Note: I think the SFII frequency graph should have the highs up another notch. They are scooped in the upper mids but quite bright to my ears.

 

[TTA]

I... don't know that I believe this. The _median_ being 8.84 lbs just sounds too low. You'll certainly see a lot of sub 9lb Z3 5s, but, to say the median is 8.84 (suggesting a high population of weights under that) just sounds really low to me, anecdotally. I'd love to see whatever claude used for actual data on this, which it will tell you if prompted.
I'd personally take this with a grain of salt. I almost bet Dingwall themselves has data, though I'm not sure they can or would give it up publicly. @Dingwall - CSR , any thoughts?

i bet people with lighter basses are more likely to post the numbers. thus ai working with skewed data.

 

[Bartrinsic]

This is a sample of 9, just to have somewhere to start. The two 8.5 lbers do not look like the same bass. I think its fair to say there are a lot of z3-5ers at <= 9lb. The median is more variable than the mean so in the absence of outliers I'd rely on the latter. 8.9lb doesn't seem far off, The small sample size is an easy explanation if this seams small: 8.9lb is only the sample mean of 9 units, with a standard deviation of .366. True means between 8.68 and 9.13 are consistent with these data based on a 90% confidence interval.​

5-String Z3 (n=9)​

Source	Weight
John Fox Bass (candy black cherry)	8.5 lbs John Fox Bass
John Fox Bass (roasted ash neck, ceruse)	8.5 lbs, described as possibly the lightest Z3 encountered John Fox Bass
John Fox Bass (purple reverseburst CPO)	8 lbs 10 oz with BEADG tuning (8.625 lbs) John Fox Bass
John Fox Bass (Honey Burst flame maple)	8.84 lbs John Fox Bass
John Fox Bass (purple-turquoise reverseburst)	8.9 lbs John Fox Bass
John Fox Bass (maple burl, indigo-white)	8 lbs 13 oz (8.81 lbs) John Fox Bass
Ish Guitars (indigo-orange fade)	9.2 lbs Ish Guitars
FretSpot (flamed maple/wenge/Darkglass)	9 lbs 2 oz, described as "perfectly balanced" (9.125 lbs) Fretspot
Reverb/Eddie's Guitars (Master Series, pastel blue-purple)	9 lbs 10 oz (9.625 lbs) Eddie's GuitarsReverb

• 
  
• Average: ~8.90 lbs
• 
  
• Median: 8.84 lbs
• 
  
• Range: 8.5 – 9.625 lbs (spread of ~1.13 lbs)
• 
  
• Std deviation: ~0.366 lbs

 

[silky smoove]

Note: I think the SFII frequency graph should have the highs up another notch. They are scooped in the upper mids but quite bright to my ears.

Agreed. Specifically I think they’re lightly scooped around 1khz. By the time you get to 3khz and higher they have plenty of response. The Dingwall chart on them makes me think they’d sound like a Mudbucker but they’re more like an MTD type of sound.

 

[Callum Gibson]

I... don't know that I believe this. The _median_ being 8.84 lbs just sounds too low. You'll certainly see a lot of sub 9lb Z3 5s, but, to say the median is 8.84 (suggesting a high population of weights under that) just sounds really low to me, anecdotally. I'd love to see whatever claude used for actual data on this, which it will tell you if prompted.
I'd personally take this with a grain of salt. I almost bet Dingwall themselves has data, though I'm not sure they can or would give it up publicly. @Dingwall - CSR , any thoughts?

Don't forget the spready that someone was compiling here.

And that has TTA's green walnut AB1 at 10.88lbs. I should weigh all mine and have them added but I forget who was editing it.

 

[Bassheart365]

My ears probably suck. i try not to overthink things and am more in the “this sounds cool” vs “less cool” camp.

here is dingwalls data:

View attachment 7529501

View attachment 7529502

View attachment 7529503

View attachment 7529504

i can 100% hear the mid/high mid voicing of the fdv. I always thought the fd3 was mid heavy also, just a bit lower. that is about as good as my ears get. have yet to try the rest.

wonder if the ptone : mid/bridge in series is the flattest output curve?

I also dont trust videos for tone… but then i suppose most use pretty high end di recordings. but 99% of the time i am using my potato phone, not my studio headphonez. But so much can influence the end result in a recording, that i generally trust my own ears first.

i will be tempted to put a ptone in the mid pickup in the z3. i feel like it would be versitile with sf2, ptone, fd3.

I've had Dingwalls with all of these pickups. The FDV EQ chart is way off. Way too much mid boost/not enough bass and treble

 

[Bartrinsic]

I've had Dingwalls with all of these pickups. The FDV EQ chart is way off. Way too much mid boost/not enough bass and treble

I'd guess that there is more to the sound than FR, such as frequency-dependent attack/dynamics, decay, saturation/compression, etc. Not everything will EQ out. With audio speakers, including monitors, we can easily flatten the FR in a room with a mic and software, but different speakers can still sound very different, even when EQ'd flat. Without standard measurements like Klippel for audio speakers, even the FR is in doubt, let alone everything else that might alter the perceived timbre.
Not only should we trust our ears for bass pups; we currently have no practical option. This is not to say it can't be done--It'd be a lot of work to define target sounds (e.g. classic 'P' sound; theoretical flat/neutral sound) and describe measured deviations that make each pup sound different from those reference target sounds: who wants to volunteer to develop a systematic pup measurement database?