Dingwall Owners Club

[Element Zero]

To add more to the “ears are weird”…

I’ve been playing A LOT with headphones over the last few years. More so than with my amp… which has been fine, but nothing like really movin some air with my cabs. Anywho.

Despite me really liking my DT770 Pro headphones, they sound completely different to what my cabs are like. Even though I have the high freq driver basically turned off, there’s WAY more upper end coming from them vs my headphones. Midrange is different and especially the low end. Headphones the low end is awesomesauce flat vs cabs I crank the Bass knob up more than halfway to sound similar.

Room acoustics, positioning, headphones, ears, pickups, pickup positions even, scale length, cabs, speakers, amps, pedals, STRINGS…

It’s enough to make your head spin. When when it comes down to it, comfort rules them all, something Dingwall has in spades

 

[gustobassman]

Good synopsis, thanks for posting. I have a Z3 with SFII's and Neve pre and it does have that hifi type tone. I have a 6-way selector switch which allows the DROC middle/bridge series in parallel with neck. It has more midrange presence, doesn't sound hifi, and is my finger style go to. I'm curious how the voicing might change keeping the SFII neck/middle and installing an FD3 bridge pickup? Perhaps neck/bridge in parallel would be a bit less scooped?
Note: I think the SFII frequency graph should have the highs up another notch. They are scooped in the upper mids but quite bright to my ears.

Agreed. Specifically I think they’re lightly scooped around 1khz. By the time you get to 3khz and higher they have plenty of response. The Dingwall chart on them makes me think they’d sound like a Mudbucker but they’re more like an MTD type of sound.

Man, it's a good feeling to see others have *somewhat* similar experiences to mine- I got a lot of flak on a different site for bringing up the hifi/MTD-ish thing with the SF2/Neve or just the scoop of the SF2's in general.

The thing was- I never complained about the sound. It's freakin killer- just what tje new Z puts out is not really me, so to speak.

Usually when I play a new bass I know right away which band/style im gonna use it with. That new Z - as amazing as it does sound - I still haven't used it with a band yet. I doesn't really fit with anything I'm doing currently. I really wasn't expecting that... bums me out a lil bit tbh. I tried installing a set of flats to use for reggae, but La Bella no longer tapers the B on the multiscale set and I couldn't get the action where I like it.

 

[silky smoove]

Man, it's a good feeling to see others have *somewhat* similar experiences to mine- I got a lot of flak on a different site for bringing up the hifi/MTD-ish thing with the SF2/Neve or just the scoop of the SF2's in general.

My SF2s are paired with a Trickfish Flexcore that has effectively identical specs to the Neve on paper. I’m sure they sound slightly different but certainly more similar than different. I have an SJ5 3X with SF2s and a Neve inbound in September/October, so I’ll know for certain. Having said all that, to me it is VERY much like an MTD with just a touch less top end way up in the 6-8khz range where MTDs have an above average response. At least the couple 535s I’ve played have been like that. The SF2s are very high fidelity, very modern RnB, very gospel sounding pickups when run wide open. The slight 1’ish kHz scoop is very real and pleasant sounding. Probably not ideal for rock and metal, which suits me just fine on my pop, RnB, soul, funk, dance gigs, though I’ve done a lot of rock studio sessions with the middle SF2 soloed and gotten great results.

 

[NaH]

I tried installing a set of flats to use for reggae, but La Bella no longer tapers the B on the multiscale set and I couldn't get the action where I like it.

Have you tried Payson flats?

 

[gustobassman]

Have you tried Payson flats?

oh yeah.. I had a set of those on for about 3 years before the G string just stopped tuning up. Boatloads of gigs (and there were actually some gigs on boats).

I went to the La Bella set right after they were introduced, I preferred the gauges just slightly more than the Payson set. They sound/feel AMAZING to me. A slightly heavier made a pretty big difference for the reggae I play. I was real bummed to discover they had discontinued the tapered B. I bought this other set only a few months after I had bought that first one, as a backup set. I finally got around to opening it last week when i tried to install them on the Z.

 

[ThisYouCanTrust]

With audio speakers, including monitors, we can easily flatten the FR in a room with a mic and software, but different speakers can still sound very different, even when EQ'd flat.

Because FR does not matter much unless wildly inaccurate (which it will be in any untreated room anyway). Phase response, directivity, off-axis behavior, group delay, etc those make or break the deal.

Despite me really liking my DT770 Pro headphones, they sound completely different to what my cabs are like.

The 770 (and 990) are known to be scooped, the 880 is the one you want if you're after a "high-fidelity" sound.
And cabs are never hifi anyway, when monitors try to avoid any weakness good cabs will try to turn their weaknesses into strength - totally different approach.

 

[5StringPocket]

My SF2s are paired with a Trickfish Flexcore that has effectively identical specs to the Neve on paper. I’m sure they sound slightly different but certainly more similar than different. I have an SJ5 3X with SF2s and a Neve inbound in September/October, so I’ll know for certain. Having said all that, to me it is VERY much like an MTD with just a touch less top end way up in the 6-8khz range where MTDs have an above average response. At least the couple 535s I’ve played have been like that. The SF2s are very high fidelity, very modern RnB, very gospel sounding pickups when run wide open. The slight 1’ish kHz scoop is very real and pleasant sounding. Probably not ideal for rock and metal, which suits me just fine on my pop, RnB, soul, funk, dance gigs, though I’ve done a lot of rock studio sessions with the middle SF2 soloed and gotten great results.

My Berg HP2 Ultra amp has a lower mid at 250 Hz and an upper mid control at 1kHz which are quite effective at dialing in the SF2s on my Z3. The Neve treble and passive tone shapes the high end response of these pickups quite well.

 

[DeltaPhoenix]

In the next day or two, I am going to checkout my Z w/SF2s + DGTC using a spectrum analyzer. I will report back.

 

[Element Zero]

In the next day or two, I am going to checkout my Z w/SF2s + DGTC using a spectrum analyzer. I will report back.

That’s cool! I’ve wanted to see that info with a bunch of basses. Looking forward to your findings.

 

[NaH]

oh yeah.. I had a set of those on for about 3 years before the G string just stopped tuning up. Boatloads of gigs (and there were actually some gigs on boats).

I went to the La Bella set right after they were introduced, I preferred the gauges just slightly more than the Payson set. They sound/feel AMAZING to me. A slightly heavier made a pretty big difference for the reggae I play. I was real bummed to discover they had discontinued the tapered B. I bought this other set only a few months after I had bought that first one, as a backup set. I finally got around to opening it last week when i tried to install them on the Z.

I have a set of TIs on my fretless, but the B there isn't tapered either. I still am able to get decent action.

 

[dazmond]

I've never heard this?

The z is a very svelte design considering the extra 3 inches in the neck length

 

[Subscript]

I really didn't like the B on the thomastik's when I tried them. The A and E are on the thin side at .072 and .096, and then the B is way up at .136. Maybe it works better on a 34" scale, but I found it lacking, especially compared to the other strings. I've had a four string set on another bass for years and love them.


I'm currently considering the Payson's, but would look at other brands if they had a tapered B. I much prefer them for dealing with the setup.

 

[NaH]

The z is a very svelte design considering the extra 3 inches in the neck length.

I've never heard this?

I think he is just referring to the 37" on the B string vs. the scale on 'normal' basses (or maybe even the medium scale Dingwalls). Nothing new there in respect to long scale Dingwalls.

 

[dazmond]

Oh I see . I actually wonder though if the AB are a little longer in the neck because they sit further into the body. If that is the case, does it impact the tone?

I think he is just referring to the 37" on the B string vs. the scale on 'normal' basses (or maybe even the medium scale Dingwalls). Nothing new there in respect to long scale Dingwalls.

 

[Bartrinsic]

Oh I see . I actually wonder though if the AB are a little longer in the neck because they sit further into the body. If that is the case, does it impact the tone?

Sorry for the confusion. The original discussion was around a concern that a 6 string Z3 with a walnut body might come to 12 lbs. OP found the owner of the original example: 10.4 lbs. Svelte body indeed! https://www.talkbass.com/threads/dingwall-owners-club.394482/page-3190#post-29664198

 

[Bartrinsic]

Oh I see . I actually wonder though if the AB are a little longer in the neck because they sit further into the body. If that is the case, does it impact the tone?

Tricky question, since the bridge to nut distance is the same for each string. I'm finding the Z about 1/4" longer than the AB-I, due to a longer headstock above the nut. On the bass side the the neck pickup is 1/2" closer to the 24th fret on the AB-I (2 1/4" for the AB-I vs 2 3/4" on the Z) and 1/8"+ closer on the G-string side (2 7/8" for the AB-I vs 3"+ for the Z), so the pickups are more slanted on the Z and a little further from the neck toward the bridge vs the AB-I: both of these will affect the tone. Lastly the Z body on the bass side extends 2 more frets, to 8 vs 6 for the AB-I.

 

[gklijs]

To all the custom owners- has anyone been filled with a deep regret on their choice of wood top/body color? It’s not offensively ugly or anything… just not what I’d hoped and it’s eating away at me should I look into a trade/sale or give it time and see if it will grow on me?

Thanks for this post. Otherwise I might not have reached out to my dealer. We now reserved this wonderful top.

 

[dazmond]

I would be curious what parameters they use to select their stock. When I was looking through a lumber shop on my own build, the weights between some pieces were vastly different. I wouldn't be surprised if some pieces were double the weight of others.

no idea the weight of black limba.

 

[dazmond]

Tricky question, since the bridge to nut distance is the same for each string. I'm finding the Z about 1/4" longer than the AB-I, due to a longer headstock above the nut. On the bass side the the neck pickup is 1/2" closer to the 24th fret on the AB-I (2 1/4" for the AB-I vs 2 3/4" on the Z) and 1/8"+ closer on the G-string side (2 7/8" for the AB-I vs 3"+ for the Z), so the pickups are more slanted on the Z and a little further from the neck toward the bridge vs the AB-I: both of these will affect the tone. Lastly the Z body on the bass side extends 2 more frets, to 8 vs 6 for the AB-I.

Even though the scale length is the same, I think the AB neck is actually maybe a few inches longer in the heel just to attach to the body with that huge cutaway. That's curious about the pickups being slightly closer to bridge in Z. Wonder if that's an intentional sound design, or necessary due to body design.

 

[Mexay]

Bit of a silly question, but how do you guys go about ensuring your strings don't twist with the minimalist bridge when restringing?

I find the slot for the strings tends to lock them in, but once you start tightening the string it seems like it wants to twist a smidge, but the minimalist bridge won't let it so it ends up being twisted, whereas a 'normal' bridge would let it shift.

Maybe I'm just stupid? Would love a bit of guidance.

My KK3 is sounding a bit "echoey" and just a bit meh. I'm not sure if it's my technique or an aforementioned twist or what. Has had a very good professional setup, PUPs are set to recommended spec (4/64 through to 9/64th in, measured fretted at 24th fret").