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Dirt pedals that kill your highs?

M

MGR

Inactive
Jan 18, 2015
1,797
1,325
Bronx, NY
#1
As my tastes get a little more refined, I am finding that pedals that kill my top end bite are not my cup of tea. I know we're bassists and are mainly concerned about keeping the lows in our dirt, but for me, the highs should not be sacrificed. Nothing makes my playing feel better than having that nice zip on the highs, especially when I can control it with playing dynamics and how I attack the strings. I hate pedals that I feel like I have to fight to get more zip. More than a few of my recent acquisitions seem to be very lacking in treble, and have since gone on Reverb.com.

I am wondering what the general consensus is around here on treble bite in a dirt pedal, good, bad or indifferent?
 
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#2
While I don't mind if a pedal darkens the tone a little bit (like, the Pork Loin is totally fine in my book), there is a distinct blanket-covering change to the sound when you roll the tone too far back on any dirt pedal. That I don't like - it sounds like a full range signal that somebody has just tossed a pillow in front of, rather than an actual musical EQ change.
 
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#3
DDXdesign said:
While I don't mind if a pedal darkens the tone a little bit (like, the Pork Loin is totally fine in my book), there is a distinct blanket-covering change to the sound when you roll the tone too far back on any dirt pedal. That I don't like - it sounds like a full range signal that somebody has just tossed a pillow in front of, rather than an actual musical EQ change.
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Yes, the pillow toss is a good analogy. I don't mind if I pedal's tone knob does that, as long as when I open it up all the bite comes back. I am just finding that a few pedals I thought would have more top end just don't open up like I want them to, even with the tone knob dimed. That's what get's me. Treble should be built in so that it is harsh and then can be tamed. But not having it at all is a bummer.
 
#4
MGR said:
Yes, the pillow toss is a good analogy. I don't mind if I pedal's tone knob does that, as long as when I open it up all the bite comes back. I am just finding that a few pedals I thought would have more top end just don't open up like I want them to, even with the tone knob dimed. That's what get's me. Treble should be built in so that it is harsh and then can be tamed. But not having it at all is a bummer.
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Oh yeah if the maxed-out tone isn't just "zero cut" on the highs (like a passive bass tone knob) then I suppose that makes sense. I'm not sure I can think of any dirt that just doesn't give you a bitey option at all...
 
#7
MGR said:
I am wondering what the general consensus is around here on treble bite in a dirt pedal, good, bad or indifferent?
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It's a fine line you have to walk on. So many dirt pedals seem to emphasize/boost treble which is not what I, personally, like. I recently picked up a Joyo California sound mainly because it has a 3-band EQ (and the high praise these pedals get here). If I were to design my own effects, that would be in all of my dirt pedals.
 
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#10
DDXdesign said:
Me too, and I assume MGR as well, but I don't like the kind that adds a bunch of highs - too grating. Even on octave-fuzzes I can't crank the gain lest I make my own skin crawl.
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You assumed correctly. Like you I don't want shrill or added highs. I just don't want to fight the pedal to get the bite I need because of a tone knob that doesn't provide me the highs. I am loathe to publicly name the handful of pedals I've bought recently that disappoint because one man's bad eq curve is another man's dream, but I got some real duds that will probably end up for sale at some point soon.
 
#11
All about mids in distortion for me! i also have a low action so add a bit of clank from frets etc, the high are always present even at times when i have an octave sound underneath still want the highs and mids in there, think thats why the cat tail is always a part of my drive sound, parallel rat and helio is sooooo good!
 
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#12
Andy westwood said:
All about mids in distortion for me! i also have a low action so add a bit of clank from frets etc, the high are always present even at times when i have an octave sound underneath still want the highs and mids in there, think thats why the cat tail is always a part of my drive sound, parallel rat and helio is sooooo good!
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I have a real love/hate thing going on with mids. I have a BBR Rat that has a mid-scoop toggle that makes the pedal sound so mean and aggressive but still cutting. This made me rethink the whole "scooped mids" sound as something that I actually like. I find too much mids seems to interfere with a lot of the frequencies taken up by the guitars and synths in my music. But at the same time I also can see your point about mids sort of fattening up the overall sound. I guess it all comes down to the instrumentation of the music we are all writing. Thanks for your post.
 
#13
MGR said:
I have a real love/hate thing going on with mids. I have a BBR Rat that has a mid-scoop toggle that makes the pedal sound so mean and aggressive but still cutting. This made me rethink the whole "scooped mids" sound as something that I actually like. I find too much mids seems to interfere with a lot of the frequencies taken up by the guitars and synths in my music. But at the same time I also can see your point about mids sort of fattening up the overall sound. I guess it all comes down to the instrumentation of the music we are all writing. Thanks for your post.
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yeh for me in metal and heavy music it connects the bass and guitars etc

most of my drives deal with mids in different ways
 
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#14
MGR said:
I have a real love/hate thing going on with mids. I have a BBR Rat that has a mid-scoop toggle that makes the pedal sound so mean and aggressive but still cutting. This made me rethink the whole "scooped mids" sound as something that I actually like. I find too much mids seems to interfere with a lot of the frequencies taken up by the guitars and synths in my music. But at the same time I also can see your point about mids sort of fattening up the overall sound. I guess it all comes down to the instrumentation of the music we are all writing. Thanks for your post.
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mids are funny that way. There is a general consensus in the effects forum that scooped = bad and yet so many bass players out there seek that sound and love it. I am not totally sure where I stand except for the fact that I recognize the importance of mids in cutting through the mix. One of my favorite EHX muffs that i have owned was a Bubble Font muff that was pretty scooped. But as a result it sounded absolutely crushing and had the best low end of any muff I have heard. Unfortunately, that muff didn't sound great in the mix as it pretty much disappeared along with my bass lines.

As far as treble, I usually end up leaning on a treble knob because I want more bite. And yes, I would find it disappointing if it didn't bring back as much bite as I was looking for.

I've been more and more addicted to bite recently as I started playing one of my basses with rounds much more often than before.
 
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#16
The new Stockman pedal from Darkglass should be awesome. And I can definitely recommend the Oxford as Tech21's meanest, clankiest pedal. (I wish it was "Darkglass bright", but it has something aggressive going on in the low and high mids that I love - very Jesus-Lizard and Billy Gould-ish)

(The VT has a lot of treble, but it's not nearly as agressive or grunty)

But, this is supposed to be about pedals without bite....sorry
 
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#17
Mosfed said:
mids are funny that way. There is a general consensus in the effects forum that scooped = bad and yet so many bass players out there seek that sound and love it. I am not totally sure where I stand except for the fact that I recognize the importance of mids in cutting through the mix. One of my favorite EHX muffs that i have owned was a Bubble Font muff that was pretty scooped. But as a result it sounded absolutely crushing and had the best low end of any muff I have heard. Unfortunately, that muff didn't sound great in the mix as it pretty much disappeared along with my bass lines.

As far as treble, I usually end up leaning on a treble knob because I want more bite. And yes, I would find it disappointing if it didn't bring back as much bite as I was looking for.

I've been more and more addicted to bite recently as I started playing one of my basses with rounds much more often than before.
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I feel the same way. A lot of the scooped vs boosted mids has so much to do with our guitar players. I feel like many of the guys I have played with aren't willing to alter their sound much to accentuate scooped mids with dirt pedals. The band has to be willing to move with you.
 
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#20
rratajski said:
I feel the same way. A lot of the scooped vs boosted mids has so much to do with our guitar players. I feel like many of the guys I have played with aren't willing to alter their sound much to accentuate scooped mids with dirt pedals. The band has to be willing to move with you.
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Very true. It's amazing really how many people still don't realize that the frequency spectrum exists and needs to be thought of and respected if a band is to sound good.
 
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