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Do you think finish thickness affects tone?
- Thread starter Engle
- Start date
In my experience nitro finished instruments tend to be more expensive (better materials, construction, engineering etc.) and I can't help but wonder if perception of those differences affects the "tone" ?
Yes.
I had a parts bass (Moses Graphite neck, Bartolini MM pickup, passive electronics) and the bass just sounded dead...plugged-in or acoustically.
It was like hearing a bass with worn-out roundwound strings; no depth, no sustain, no liveliness.
I bought it because the parts were top notch & I figured all it would need was new strings and a setup.
But I tried 3-4 different sets of progressively-brighter strings, and none of them made a difference.
The finish was an ugly baby blue, but the neck and all the hardware was black, so I though the bass would look cool in a natural finish.
I started sanding the finish off..and kept sanding, and sanding, until I got rid of the blue, then the thick primer coat, then the sealer coat...and finally down to the actual wood of the instrument.
The difference was night and day - the bass sounded completely different, and much better.
I had a parts bass (Moses Graphite neck, Bartolini MM pickup, passive electronics) and the bass just sounded dead...plugged-in or acoustically.
It was like hearing a bass with worn-out roundwound strings; no depth, no sustain, no liveliness.
I bought it because the parts were top notch & I figured all it would need was new strings and a setup.
But I tried 3-4 different sets of progressively-brighter strings, and none of them made a difference.
The finish was an ugly baby blue, but the neck and all the hardware was black, so I though the bass would look cool in a natural finish.
I started sanding the finish off..and kept sanding, and sanding, until I got rid of the blue, then the thick primer coat, then the sealer coat...and finally down to the actual wood of the instrument.
The difference was night and day - the bass sounded completely different, and much better.
Keep in mind that many of the mass produced instruments are first coated with a layer of sealer. The old Fenders were practically dipped in it. That thin nitro finish everyone raves about on old electric guitars is sprayed over a layer of plastic that's probably the same thickness as the new poly paint. You can wear through the nitro relatively easily but the sealer is still there - this isn't an 'open pore' finish.
Not to say that the finish won't change things, because it absolutely can. But at the end of the day, all that matters is if you like how it looks, feels and sounds. Each finish method has its own set of pros and cons.
Not to say that the finish won't change things, because it absolutely can. But at the end of the day, all that matters is if you like how it looks, feels and sounds. Each finish method has its own set of pros and cons.
I am not sure how one would realistically test this to confirm it either way. I think you would need to take a bass with a finish, play it and measure the tone print, then remove the finish or re-finish the same bass, and play it and re-measure the tone print.
Comparing two basses of the same make and model with different finishes would be inconslusive IMO if only because their are other variables (density of the wood used, acceptable differences in pick up winding, batch of strings, etc.
Unless the difference between these finishes is absolutely and indisputably clear (e.g., ALL Nitro finished basses have a boosted 2k freq), I am not sure how one would ever really confirm this.
I also think there is a psychological impact at play...the same way some people think a darker wood on the fingerboard creates a darker tone.
Comparing two basses of the same make and model with different finishes would be inconslusive IMO if only because their are other variables (density of the wood used, acceptable differences in pick up winding, batch of strings, etc.
Unless the difference between these finishes is absolutely and indisputably clear (e.g., ALL Nitro finished basses have a boosted 2k freq), I am not sure how one would ever really confirm this.
I also think there is a psychological impact at play...the same way some people think a darker wood on the fingerboard creates a darker tone.
Further to my last post, this is an interesting real world test of this. Thanks for sharing!
I've often thought that grass needs to shut the F up
Splitting hairs in a thread topic that is about splitting hairs?
Bamboo ain't no hair. But they do split it and glue the pieces of it together to make flooring.Splitting hairs in a thread topic that is about splitting hairs?
You know what you know. You don’t know what you don’t.
Some folks think all running shoes are the same. They aren’t but since they are experienced by each individual we accept their choice. They know if they perform better experience no pain or better support or importantly can tell you it’s time to replace them when they have perfectly good sole.
A musician who hears and feels the difference decides what makes the performance more satisfying. Sure the bass makes sound but if they have a choice why not choose what works better over what just works?
Some folks think all running shoes are the same. They aren’t but since they are experienced by each individual we accept their choice. They know if they perform better experience no pain or better support or importantly can tell you it’s time to replace them when they have perfectly good sole.
A musician who hears and feels the difference decides what makes the performance more satisfying. Sure the bass makes sound but if they have a choice why not choose what works better over what just works?
When I learned through careful comparisons that bridge mass does effect tone (to me), I started to never assume there isn't a subtle difference in switching out components. Likely the difference is subtle if anything though, to the point of not being worth much effort or money for the tone alone.
It affects appearance and durability, but that's about it.Over in the Thunderbird club, I commented that part of what makes an Epiphone thicker than a similar Gibson is the thick finish on Epiphones (at least the modern ones).
That thick poly finish is durable and probably a lot faster to produce than a Gibson nitro finish.
I don't believe the finish thickness makes any difference to the output sound of an electric bass, but
I've been wrong before...
Do you think it makes a difference? If so, can you produce evidence?
Of course, the unspoken second premise is that most musicians hear with their eyes.
I think most of the what people report as a difference can be attributed to other factors changing when the instrument is reassembled.
I would further stipulate that it be a through-neck bass. Disassembling necks/bodies to refinish just adds too many hard-to-control variables.
