my point isn't that i think it's appropriate in this situation. i'm sure that he's used to feeling free to move however he wants in an ensemble setting, and they sound great anyways. if it's bugging the conductor, that's between the two of them i guess.
Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Double Bass Does thrashing around while you play do any good?
- Thread starter fergus currie
- Start date
- Status
This thread is way overboard now. But it has accomplished one thing. More attention to the player. I don´t see any constructive discussion of moving while playing.
I will add though that watching the above video of Beethoven symphonys 5 and 7 I noticed something interesting.
When Tuneh is not playing in the group, the bass section is seated in direct visual contact with the concertmaster, when he is IN the group , the bass section is placed BEHIND the concertmaster, out of his visual field. I wonder why.
Are the Beethoven symphonies 5 and 7 so different. I don´t think so.
Here we can see that Guy doesn't always dance around. When he has something touh to play and needs to be serious he can be quite calm...
Guy Tuneh Performs Elgar Cello Concerto - YouTube
Which leads me to ask, why does he have to do this faffin' about in Mozart?
The following is the real clincher for me.
Guy D. Tuneh - Double Bass Virtuoso Legend. - YouTube
FC
Guy Tuneh Performs Elgar Cello Concerto - YouTube
Which leads me to ask, why does he have to do this faffin' about in Mozart?
The following is the real clincher for me.
Guy D. Tuneh - Double Bass Virtuoso Legend. - YouTube
FC
Yes, it is distracting but at least he is not doing this (from 4:55):
Rollin' Rock - The Tielman brothers - YouTube
Rollin' Rock - The Tielman brothers - YouTube
There, that's better
Now, imagine that with Mozart
The Tielmans are a pretty interesting band. They were Indonesian immigrants in the Netherlands and were on the forefront of introducing rock and roll in Europe and are still performing today. There was a big Indonesian influence in early rock and roll in the Netherlands that also plays a role in the 60's and 70's rock from the Hague (Shocking Blue, Golden Earring).
I play with a section leader who moves around quite a bit (not nearly as much as Mr. Tuneh), but his histrionics are welcome (to me, at least) as they are deliberately demonstrative of elements such as bowings, entrances, cutoffs, dynamics, etc. There's little question of what he wants out of the section.
I think the guy would make a good conductor if he set his mind to it.
I think the guy would make a good conductor if he set his mind to it.
Whoever uploaded that video just exploded my sarcasm detector.
I personally don't care to watch the clip. It reminds me of watching an ocean liner threatening to capsize in a calm harbor while surrounded by peaceful sailboats. But it does raise an interesting question: under what circumstances is it "permissible" to move around while playing?
I'm just a poor unwashed jazzer, and I play seated, but at times when the music feels as though it is tearing at the fabric of time and energy I know I start to move in some pretty unusual ways that look pretty over the top (I've seen them on video) when taken out of context. For me, when they seem to be an honest expression of the music, I think the movement is fine. If it feels false, like an affectation, then I think it's better left alone. Can I really presume that I know which of these circumstances Mr. Tuneh finds himself in at any given time? Certainly not.
fergus currie said:
In his own words - well at least from his own biography on his own and official website - here is what's going on:
"Coming from a deep and intense personal involvement, his performances attempt to deliver strong massages to the audience and result in intense, captivating, and awe-inspiring experiences."
Go figure
can somebody please end this madness and start another discussion, like why do bassists use violin rosin for orchestral playing.?
PLEASE CAN`T WE ALL GET ALONG?
PLEASE CAN`T WE ALL GET ALONG?
Such a sad, immature showing from our little community. This thread should be shut down, please. This is even worse than the assaults on Rinat Ibragimov a bit back. It is quite easy to insult the masters from the infantile vantage of web anonymity, but this is all very unbecoming of our instrument's dignity.
Those who are so quick to criticize these legendary virtuosi- I personally challenge you to post recordings of yourselves performing remotely close to the level of Mr. Tuneh. The fact of the matter is that those who can actually legitimately play the instrument at a high level, especially as life-long professional musicians have the seasoning and humility to realize that character-bashing does nothing to further oneself, especially professionally.
Those of you who are students and are so quick to criticize those who can actually play the instrument, I also challenge you to share what you have posted here with your professors and working peers, and see what sort of admonishment follows. Go to an ISB convention and rant against renowned performers and pedagogues, and see how many new friends you make.
Shame, guys. Shame. :scowl:
Those who are so quick to criticize these legendary virtuosi- I personally challenge you to post recordings of yourselves performing remotely close to the level of Mr. Tuneh. The fact of the matter is that those who can actually legitimately play the instrument at a high level, especially as life-long professional musicians have the seasoning and humility to realize that character-bashing does nothing to further oneself, especially professionally.
Those of you who are students and are so quick to criticize those who can actually play the instrument, I also challenge you to share what you have posted here with your professors and working peers, and see what sort of admonishment follows. Go to an ISB convention and rant against renowned performers and pedagogues, and see how many new friends you make.
Shame, guys. Shame. :scowl:
This is just silly now. He is no virtuoso in my book. A showman yes .
If desired I would glady participate in a constructive critique of why I do not care for this bassists playing. Maybe some of the younguns would learn something about what is good and what is not.
Calling him names as others have is way off I agree. People need to chill out. I still think what he does is sillyness and respect his right to promote said sillyness bass circus antics.
"Sillyness bass circus antics" isn't name calling? Such absurd critiques have been issued here for a musician simply moving around. Please note- there have not been any criticisms issued regarding the actual musical performance. In case anyone here was ignorant to the fact, Mr. Tuneh is hands down one of the most respected bassists alive. The *legitimate* issues people seem to have with him are primarily in regards to his transcriptions of cello repertoire. In college there were people who criticized Gary Karr for the exact same thing. Today, those people work in cubicles, and Mr. Karr lives on as one of the most influential players in the instrument's history. Let that be a lesson to us all. While the foolish busy themselves finding fault, the legends busy themselves with the actual music.
If we are talking aesthetics and personal preference, this is one thing. However, objectivity in such matters as preference is by definition utterly impossible. Also, this thread has had minimal "reasoned, civil discussion." Mostly there has been simplistic simian poo-flinging, which once again, is NOT becoming of our instrument.
Go practice. If you think you can do a better job than Mr. Tuneh, please, by all means, go do so. We'd all love to hear you fellows do better.
If we are talking aesthetics and personal preference, this is one thing. However, objectivity in such matters as preference is by definition utterly impossible. Also, this thread has had minimal "reasoned, civil discussion." Mostly there has been simplistic simian poo-flinging, which once again, is NOT becoming of our instrument.
Go practice. If you think you can do a better job than Mr. Tuneh, please, by all means, go do so. We'd all love to hear you fellows do better.
Maybe I'm reading comments here differently but it seems to me that no one is challenging the fact the Guy Tuneh can play the hell out of the bass. The thread does seem to have devolved into a bit of a circus at this point but I think the point raised by the OP was valid.
Look this Mozart Divertimento is a piece for string ensemble, and in this situation the bass is an ensemble instrument. The look the violist gives him at the beginning of the clip says it all. Ask yourself "if I were working with a group and the cellist moved like that would I find it distracting?"
I think the bass needs people like Guy Tuneh to redefine our instrument, but come on, does anyone think that a bunch of repeated Gs were really the most attention worthy part of the music?
From Wikipedia:
Just because it's Mozart, it doesn't mean it has to be solemn.
Not that I know anything about DB, though...
Just because it's Mozart, it doesn't mean it has to be solemn.
Not that I know anything about DB, though...
I think that most classical musicians move a lot, just look at any of the previews on the Berlin Philharmoniker's website. But the bassist in question is on the borderline of pretentious, that's why it has generated so much discussion. I must say that I find the player in question a bit excessive, to the point where I'm sceptical if he really have to move like that to sound his best, but if he insist, I would not push the issue. The only part where criticism might be put, is that it is distracting the audience. However, now we're far in on subjective views.
I think it's extra sensitive in this case as he's moving so much more, with a such big instrument among in the otherwise rather calm ensemble. It's a little like the "this drummer is at the wrong gig" youtube-video.
Myself, while I tend to move my head a little in the general rythm, following the conducor's white baton in my periphial vision, I would risk dropping my bass if I moved like Tuneh.
- Status
