Dogal Carbon Steel Flats

[KenD]

Dogal advertises these flats as: "Thanks to the carbon alloy, the sound quality is very similar to the one of the round wound strings but with all the advantages of the smooth winding concerning clarity and sound purity."

Has anyone tried them and can verify that?

 

[bholder]

curious. subbing.

 

[HaphAsSard]

Dogal advertises these flats as: "Thanks to the carbon alloy, the sound quality is very similar to the one of the round wound strings but with all the advantages of the smooth winding concerning clarity and sound purity."

Has anyone tried them and can verify that?

A number of TB users in the following threads are still active:

Dogal Jaco Flatwound Review (Pics Added)​

​

Dogal Jaco Flat Carbon Steel Electric Bass 4-String JC106C 45-105, 34" (JC106C)​

Dogal Flats vs. Thomastik​

 

[KenD]

A number of TB users in the following threads are still active:

Dogal Jaco Flatwound Review (Pics Added)​

​

Dogal Jaco Flat Carbon Steel Electric Bass 4-String JC106C 45-105, 34" (JC106C)​

Dogal Flats vs. Thomastik​

I saw those but only one person (@Barton Lee) addressed my question directly and he qualified his response. I was curious if there was a more broad based opinion.

I don't want to be changing strings frequently (and can't afford to anyway) so how they sound when first installed doesn't much matter if they lose those initial qualities relatively quickly.

 

[GIBrat51]

Dogal advertises these flats as: "Thanks to the carbon alloy, the sound quality is very similar to the one of the round wound strings but with all the advantages of the smooth winding concerning clarity and sound purity."

Has anyone tried them and can verify that?

Well...
Yes... and, no.
Yes, I do use them. I have a set of the JC106A's (the light gauge set) on my '74 Rick 4001. They're on that bass because it has the incipient neck problem that some older 4001's develop, and it needs strings with very low tension. Which Dogal says those strings have. And, as far as I can tell? They're right. Aside from that?
"Similar to the one of the round wound strings"? Honestly... I couldn't really say. They certainly don't sound like any NEW rounds I've ever heard; and TBH, they don't sound like any near-dead rounds I've ever heard, either. Since I loathe round wound strings - with very few exceptions - I tend to snatch them off any bass I buy - as soon after I buy it, as possible. I do like GHS Bass Boomers, and I've used EB Hybrid Slinkys long enough for them to break in - but, the Dogal Jaco Flats don't sound at all like those rounds. Especially the Boomers...
What do they sound like? To my ears, they sound quite a bit like the Optima 4440 RB Flats that my Rick 4003 wears. Like the RB's, they have; Decent low end; strong low mids and mids; and a very useful high end, too. Just with a lot less tension. Which is primarily why I like them. But, they aren't floppy or anything; certainly not nearly as flexible feeling as the TI Jazz Flats on my Alembic. They feel like most light gauge flats do. Which, considering their actual low tension, is... pretty amazing. However...
I do have one small problem with them. The actual tension is so low, that they can't load the worn gears in the 4001's 50 y/o "wavy" Grover tuning machines enough to keep them locked together. I have to completely re-tune it - every time I pick it up. I need either 1) new tuners, or 2) higher tension strings. And, with the 4001's neck problem? It ain't gonna be higher tension strings...
Bottom line? They are very nice flat wound strings, and, IMO, well worth the money. However... if they do sound like some kind of round wounds? I couldn't tell you what those rounds are. Maybe they're referring to their own Jaco CarbonSteel Rounds...?

 

[e-flat]

Dogal advertises these flats as: "Thanks to the carbon alloy, the sound quality is very similar to the one of the round wound strings but with all the advantages of the smooth winding concerning clarity and sound purity."

Has anyone tried them and can verify that?

I think the hyperbole of the advertising is a little misleading. The Dogal Carbon (aka Jaco) flats are a beautiful string and pretty clear and focused compared to some other flats, but they don’t sound like rounds.

 

[KenD]

Well...
Yes... and, no.
Yes, I do use them. I have a set of the JC106A's (the light gauge set) on my '74 Rick 4001. They're on that bass because it has the incipient neck problem that some older 4001's develop, and it needs strings with very low tension. Which Dogal says those strings have. And, as far as I can tell? They're right. Aside from that?
"Similar to the one of the round wound strings"? Honestly... I couldn't really say. They certainly don't sound like any NEW rounds I've ever heard; and TBH, they don't sound like any near-dead rounds I've ever heard, either. Since I loathe round wound strings - with very few exceptions - I tend to snatch them off any bass I buy - as soon after I buy it, as possible. I do like GHS Bass Boomers, and I've used EB Hybrid Slinkys long enough for them to break in - but, the Dogal Jaco Flats don't sound at all like those rounds. Especially the Boomers...
What do they sound like? To my ears, they sound quite a bit like the Optima 4440 RB Flats that my Rick 4003 wears. Like the RB's, they have; Decent low end; strong low mids and mids; and a very useful high end, too. Just with a lot less tension. Which is primarily why I like them. But, they aren't floppy or anything; certainly not nearly as flexible feeling as the TI Jazz Flats on my Alembic. They feel like most light gauge flats do. Which, considering their actual low tension, is... pretty amazing. However...
I do have one small problem with them. The actual tension is so low, that they can't load the worn gears in the 4001's 50 y/o "wavy" Grover tuning machines enough to keep them locked together. I have to completely re-tune it - every time I pick it up. I need either 1) new tuners, or 2) higher tension strings. And, with the 4001's neck problem? It ain't gonna be higher tension strings...
Bottom line? They are very nice flat wound strings, and, IMO, well worth the money. However... if they do sound like some kind of round wounds? I couldn't tell you what those rounds are. Maybe they're referring to their own Jaco CarbonSteel Rounds...?

Thanks for the detailed response! Almost certainly there is some hyperbole involved (what the old English law cases called "puffery") and, yes, they probably are comparing their Carbon Steel flats to their own rounds.

As is usually the case with strings, one can't know for sure until they are installed and played for awhile. I have a drawer full of "experimental" tryouts

 

[KenD]

Where I am going with my initial question: looking for strings for my six string, which I think of in the way that Anthony Jackson has described. That is, not taking the place of a double bass in a musical arrangement but rather as the contrabass member of the guitar family - still in the bass clef but with more melodic lines and some chordal involvement.

Typically that would lead one to consider round wounds. I am attracted to their tone for this bass and although I don't mind their feel under my fingers I cannot abide the string and fret noise. Thus I am looking for flats or pressure wounds that could be a suitable alternative.

 

[GIBrat51]

Thanks for the detailed response! Almost certainly there is some hyperbole involved (what the old English law cases called "puffery") and, yes, they probably are comparing their Carbon Steel flats to their own rounds.

As is usually the case with strings, one can't know for sure until they are installed and played for awhile. I have a drawer full of "experimental" tryouts

Well...
Dogal has been in the string business for quite a long time, so they have a reputation to think of. And, even the Italians frown on false advertising (more or less). The verbiage on the box says "5 kg of tension to bring to pitch". Which, in my world, translates to "total tension per set? 44 lbs." The reason I think they probably aren't telling a fib? Normally, IME with new flats on a bass guitar (and I've installed a lot of them in the last 50+ years), from the point where the strings have just enough tension on them to lift them off the frets, to the point where they're up to pitch, takes anywhere from 5 to 7 turns of the tuner key. The Dogal Jaco Flats? A hair more than 2 1/2 turns on the old Grovers... Which would seem to indicate that; yes, Dogal is telling the truth, and that they are very low tension strings. If you try them (and they are pretty pricey), you might like them. Then again, you might not...

 

[HaphAsSard]

And, even the Italians frown on false advertising (more or less). The verbiage on the box says "5 kg of tension to bring to pitch". Which, in my world, translates to "total tension per set? 44 lbs."

I am Italian and, as I mentioned on other occasions, I frown at this. In terms of neck relief, it would be the equivalent of mounting only one string on the bass.

One of these days, if I manage to convince one of my guitarist friends to become an official Dogal endorser (he was offered by the company, but when it comes to playing guitar he is self-effacement personified), I'll use him as a contact to get a definitive answer on their mysterious 5kg claim.

 

[DJ Bebop]

What is Thundercat using for strings?
I remember reading he was using some brand of flats or a mix of flats on his 6-string.

Nevermind, found it!

Strings​

To achieve maximum chordal control and dexterity over the bass’s fingerboard, Thundercat uses a unique combination of both nylon wound and flat wound strings. Endorsed by La Bella, he switches between Deep Talkin’ Bass Flats (.029, .049, .069, .089, .109, .128) and 750G-CB Gold White Nylon Tapewounds (.043, .050, .065, .085, .105, .135 for live performances, and often uses medium-light Dean Markley SR2000 strings (.027, .047, .067, .087, .107, .127) for studio work.

Gear Rundown: Thundercat

The fact that Thundercat isn’t an outright household name is almost criminal. Read through our gear rundown of the iconic bassist.

mixdownmag.com.au

 

[bassboysam]

I can attest to the Dogal's low pulling weight. there is very little tension against the tuners on the J bass I have them on. I was shocked when I was tuning them, i was expecting to have to make several more turns.

 

[KenD]

What is Thundercat using for strings?
I remember reading he was using some brand of flats or a mix of flats on his 6-string.

Nevermind, found it!

Strings​

To achieve maximum chordal control and dexterity over the bass’s fingerboard, Thundercat uses a unique combination of both nylon wound and flat wound strings. Endorsed by La Bella, he switches between Deep Talkin’ Bass Flats (.029, .049, .069, .089, .109, .128) and 750G-CB Gold White Nylon Tapewounds (.043, .050, .065, .085, .105, .135 for live performances, and often uses medium-light Dean Markley SR2000 strings (.027, .047, .067, .087, .107, .127) for studio work.

Gear Rundown: Thundercat

The fact that Thundercat isn’t an outright household name is almost criminal. Read through our gear rundown of the iconic bassist.

mixdownmag.com.au

I hadn't considered the Dean Markleys but I will do some looking around about them. Their write up on their website uses lots of interesting words

 

[Pyrrho Epoche]

Dogal advertises these flats as: "Thanks to the carbon alloy, the sound quality is very similar to the one of the round wound strings but with all the advantages of the smooth winding concerning clarity and sound purity."

Has anyone tried them and can verify that?

I use both the carbonsteel rounds and flats. They are both flexible, but I would not say light tension. I feel them as just below medium. The flats take a few months to lose their snappiness. They still retain their warmth, with just a perfect amount of upright tone snappiness. I play with a fretless jazz bass and play gypsy jazz with a fat sharp jazz pick and they are perfect. I love the carbon rounds also and they have great sustain also because of the round cores and medium tension. They go dead for me after about 20-30 hours. They are really metallic and zingy out of the gate. I really love to play them but the price went to $50/4 string set....so, I just switched to SIT Stainless and I like them so far, but they are not as zingy as the Dogal round carbonsteels----the SIT are more like DR highbeams.

Honestly, the carbonsteel flats are like driving a Bentley---they are so easy and warm to play stuff like; manouche and bossa---it is the only flat I will ever use, unless they are discontinued.

I have tried Dunlop flats and Roto flats and they are like driving a Mazda or Honda, compared to a Bentley(Dogal flats) or Porsche(Dogal rounds).

Hope that helps.

Dan

 

[KenD]

I use both the carbonsteel rounds and flats. They are both flexible, but I would not say light tension. I feel them as just below medium. The flats take a few months to lose their snappiness. They still retain their warmth, with just a perfect amount of upright tone snappiness. I play with a fretless jazz bass and play gypsy jazz with a fat sharp jazz pick and they are perfect. I love the carbon rounds also and they have great sustain also because of the round cores and medium tension. They go dead for me after about 20-30 hours. They are really metallic and zingy out of the gate. I really love to play them but the price went to $50/4 string set....so, I just switched to SIT Stainless and I like them so far, but they are not as zingy as the Dogal round carbonsteels----the SIT are more like DR highbeams.

Honestly, the carbonsteel flats are like driving a Bentley---they are so easy and warm to play stuff like; manouche and bossa---it is the only flat I will ever use, unless they are discontinued.

I have tried Dunlop flats and Roto flats and they are like driving a Mazda or Honda, compared to a Bentley(Dogal flats) or Porsche(Dogal rounds).

Hope that helps.

Dan

Sadly, I sold my Porsche Carrera 2 a few years ago so I will have to settle for the Bentley (which I have never driven

Thanks for the excellent first hand info. Your feedback makes the price of the Dogal flats not such a leap of faith into the financial abyss. I also looked at the SIT compression wound Silencers as perhaps a middle ground. A failed experiment with them would be easier to take because they are about 1/4 the cost of the Dogals for a six string set

 

[Pyrrho Epoche]

Sadly, I sold my Porsche Carrera 2 a few years ago so I will have to settle for the Bentley (which I have never driven

Thanks for the excellent first hand info. Your feedback makes the price of the Dogal flats not such a leap of faith into the financial abyss. I also looked at the SIT compression wound Silencers as perhaps a middle ground. A failed experiment with them would be easier to take because they are about 1/4 the cost of the Dogals for a six string set

I have an Audi Supercharged A6 as my DD, but get to drive alot of guys new cars at my cigar shop.

I play upright also, and the Dogal flats are the closest string that I have tested vs the Evah Pirazzi weichs. The weichs have a bit more tension, but both are very snappy and warm after they break in.