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Eden Forum Disappears
- Thread starter Rip Van Dan
- Start date
Sounds to me like there is a problem. But lets go through it will quick to see if you're doing all the right things. You do want those lights to be amber for 8 ohm cabs. Plug in the cabs and then if you have a passive bass plug it into the passive input and if it's an active bass (played as an active bass) put it in the active input. Then with Enhance off, compressor bypassed, and all EQ set at noon (flat), you want to set the gain. Turn the gain up until you get that gain clip-light to flash while playing your lowest and loudest notes. Once you've got the gain set so that it dances when your playing, you've got a good signal going to the power section.
Now turn up the master. ***NOTE*** Marshall radically changed the way the master works. It works much more like the master on their guitar amps and not at all like the WT amps. You will probably need to get it up to about 9 o'clock before it even makes much of a sound at all. With your WT800C, this would already be as loud as you'd probably use it at an indoor venue and you probably don't want to be anywhere close to the amp if you get it turned up half way (noon). With the WTP it's not making much sound. Continue turning it up past the half-way point and you should start to hear a reasonable amount of sound. Continue turning it up and you should get gig volumes without the master clipping light coming on. When you see the master clip light coming on and you haven't boosted the bass EQ or used the bass boost button, you will need to drop the master until that light stays off. If it flashes very much it will go into protect mode and turn you right off.
I have their little class D amp which uses the same gain and master set-up, and with my passive Jazz I have to turn that gain up to about 4 o'clock to 4:30 to get that light to flash and I turn up the master to about 3 or 4 o'clock. The highest I've turned my 800-watt WT500/800 up at wide open space Festivals was 10:30 and then I got told to turn down. So those WTP gain and Master controls are night and day different than on your WT800C. So even though both your WTP600 and your WT800C will both deliver 300-watts per 8 ohm cab, the settings will be much different to get that same level of sound. The gain set is incredibly important on getting the best and hottest sound out of Eden amps.
If you've tried all this and it's still pretty quiet, take it back!
Now, you also have another option with the WT800C, presuming yours is the one with the light up Logo. You can hook both of your 8 ohm cabs up to the bridged connection by daisy chaining one of the cabs to the other. The WT800C will deliver 880-watts into an 8 ohm load and 1,100-watts into a 4 ohm load bridged.
After Marshall bought Eden and introduced their WTP900, they changed the "minimum Bridged" note next to the bridged output from 4 ohm to 8 ohm. When we contacted them to find out what they had changed and why, they said they hadn't changed anything, they just were not comfortable saying it could be bridged at 4 ohms. To me that's more than a little suspect since the "new" amp they brought out couldn't match the power that the old WT's had been putting out since 2005.
Armin (the other active moderator at the Eden Forum) got one of the WT800C amps with the "minimum bridged load 8Ω" text on it and compared it to his own WT800C and they were indeed identical. I believe this was 2012? Anyhow despite the fact that the WT800C had been used by lots of people bridged at 1,100 watts into 4 ohms for 7-years or run at 2Ω per channel in dual mono mode (Marshall calls this "stereo"), Marshall decided they weren't comfortable with that rating. So if you really want to, you can run 550-watts into each cab in bridged mode. You won't be able to use the balance knob with the WT800C at that point, but the WTP600 is a mono powerblock amp and doesn't have one either.
I think I did everything you said when using the WTP600. I can try again and take the Master up further but that does seem odd.
As for the WT800C thing, I have a WT800B and have used it bridged into an 8 ohm D410XLT and I think I ran it bridged into the 2 cabs - D210XLT & D115XL ( so a 4 ohm load ) and it worked fine. However, on agedhorse's advice ( running too much power into the D210XLT cab ) I unbridged the WT800 and ran each cab on each channel ( which at 8 ohms is about 300W ) and it works fine as well.
I took a stab at trying out those newer Eden amps and they are built nice, feel nice, have all the "bells & whistles" that you could need but I'm a bit taken back by the power section. I even noticed that when I turn the Tube Gain up it would get this "not-nice" sounding overdrive that just made me want to turn it back down.
I'm still using my other Eden set up as well - using an 1998 Eden Navigator to get that warm Eden sound and then running that into a Crown PA amp. Currently, the Crown is an XLS1500 ( 300W@8ohms / ch or a touch over 1000W bridged ). After having just 1 of the power amp boards go out in the WT800, costing $350 plus labor, I went looking for less a expensive alternative for the power section. I believe I got the Crown XLD1500 used for under $200. If it poops out, just pitch it get another one used for a similar amount. Plus, no shop time involved. I do have a spare Crown amp if the XLS1500 blows and it's a hunka-chunka of iron because it's old school Class AB with a big toroidal transformer and big heat sinks with rows of power transistors...lol! It's a Crown XLS802 and cranks out 500W@8ohms / ch. I got is used for $150. Looks like it came out of a church PA and was the backup because of the stickers on it and it was sooo clean when i took off the lid. Didn't have to blow any dust out of it.
I know, got the GAS bad! But with some of those prices, why not? Heck the other day, I was walking out of GC and some lady was trying to load up some large PA cabs ( 4 cabs with 2X15 plus tweeter/horn each ) and I stopped to help her load them and she asked me if I wanted them. Of course, I'm like " Uhh.. depends on how much." She says free and you know I jumped all over that. GC says they were bad and she was trying to sell them there and she didn't want to haul them back. Well, these are all JBLs, and after checking them, I found 2 blown HF drivers - one from each of the 2 sets. I didn't even have to buy the whole driver as you can get the diaphragms - 2 for $33.00. I clean up the gaps and popped in the new diaphrams and I got some nice sound. Hooked up my phone to a mixer, mixer to that crown XLS802 and plugged into those cabs ( just 2 at a time ) and I can get my garage rocking. Of course my wife is looking at me like, *** you gonna do with those? I said I was gonna sell them. She listened to them and said I could keep one pair but I can't bring then in the house. Ugh... I'll be keeping the JBL MP225s and I'm hoping I can move them against the wall enough that I can park my car in the garage again.
As for the WT800C thing, I have a WT800B and have used it bridged into an 8 ohm D410XLT and I think I ran it bridged into the 2 cabs - D210XLT & D115XL ( so a 4 ohm load ) and it worked fine. However, on agedhorse's advice ( running too much power into the D210XLT cab ) I unbridged the WT800 and ran each cab on each channel ( which at 8 ohms is about 300W ) and it works fine as well.
I took a stab at trying out those newer Eden amps and they are built nice, feel nice, have all the "bells & whistles" that you could need but I'm a bit taken back by the power section. I even noticed that when I turn the Tube Gain up it would get this "not-nice" sounding overdrive that just made me want to turn it back down.
I'm still using my other Eden set up as well - using an 1998 Eden Navigator to get that warm Eden sound and then running that into a Crown PA amp. Currently, the Crown is an XLS1500 ( 300W@8ohms / ch or a touch over 1000W bridged ). After having just 1 of the power amp boards go out in the WT800, costing $350 plus labor, I went looking for less a expensive alternative for the power section. I believe I got the Crown XLD1500 used for under $200. If it poops out, just pitch it get another one used for a similar amount. Plus, no shop time involved. I do have a spare Crown amp if the XLS1500 blows and it's a hunka-chunka of iron because it's old school Class AB with a big toroidal transformer and big heat sinks with rows of power transistors...lol! It's a Crown XLS802 and cranks out 500W@8ohms / ch. I got is used for $150. Looks like it came out of a church PA and was the backup because of the stickers on it and it was sooo clean when i took off the lid. Didn't have to blow any dust out of it.
I know, got the GAS bad! But with some of those prices, why not? Heck the other day, I was walking out of GC and some lady was trying to load up some large PA cabs ( 4 cabs with 2X15 plus tweeter/horn each ) and I stopped to help her load them and she asked me if I wanted them. Of course, I'm like " Uhh.. depends on how much." She says free and you know I jumped all over that. GC says they were bad and she was trying to sell them there and she didn't want to haul them back. Well, these are all JBLs, and after checking them, I found 2 blown HF drivers - one from each of the 2 sets. I didn't even have to buy the whole driver as you can get the diaphragms - 2 for $33.00. I clean up the gaps and popped in the new diaphrams and I got some nice sound. Hooked up my phone to a mixer, mixer to that crown XLS802 and plugged into those cabs ( just 2 at a time ) and I can get my garage rocking. Of course my wife is looking at me like, *** you gonna do with those? I said I was gonna sell them. She listened to them and said I could keep one pair but I can't bring then in the house. Ugh... I'll be keeping the JBL MP225s and I'm hoping I can move them against the wall enough that I can park my car in the garage again.
+1 on using the 210XLT in the dual-mono mode.
The possibility of 550-watts is way too many watts for that cab - forgot you were using that 210XLT. It's power handling is 350-watts rms. Not really a problem running a higher power amp into it as long as you don't push too much power into it, but it would be pretty easy to send too much with 550-watts available. And, with the two channels sending 300-watts each, that's a much safer choice and odds are you won't send all of that to it anyway.
Talk about a steal with those JBL PA cabs! Did you go buy a lottery ticket too?
I should have, come to think of it.
You know, that's the deal with collecting what most people would consider junk ( like some of those Eden cabs I bought ) but every once in a while you run across a gem that's worth polishing.
If we ever start playing out again, my choice to haul will either be the 2 D210XLTs or 1 D210XLT and 1 D115XL. When you get down in the lower E and B string and find the resonance of the room your in, that D115XL will make the note bloom - it comes from everywhere. You notice it most when doing songs like Comfortably Numb with those long held notes.
You know, that's the deal with collecting what most people would consider junk ( like some of those Eden cabs I bought ) but every once in a while you run across a gem that's worth polishing.
If we ever start playing out again, my choice to haul will either be the 2 D210XLTs or 1 D210XLT and 1 D115XL. When you get down in the lower E and B string and find the resonance of the room your in, that D115XL will make the note bloom - it comes from everywhere. You notice it most when doing songs like Comfortably Numb with those long held notes.
I'm using an Ibanez BTB845 ( 5 string which has great sustain, maybe because of the 35" scale length? ) and then I run a TC Electronics SpectraDrive bass preamp pedal that has a compressor. Then I usually enable a Walrus ARP-87 Delay pedal that has a slapback algorithm where I have a very short delay and a few repeats. For some reason it sounds thicker than just doing their normal delay set to a short delay and a few repeats. I don't normally use many pedals. I use the TC Electronic Tuner and the Spectradrive all the time. I have an MXR M82 Envelope Filter that I use on Funk songs ( like Kravits Fly Away ). I have a weird bass distortion set up that involves 3 pedals where I trying to copy the Tim Commerford's sound like on Audioslave's Cochise. It's a pale imitation and our singer doesn't want to do any of those type songs because it's too hard on his voice. So, normally, I don't use that. Finally, last in the chain, I got this cool tiny "pedal" called Thumpinator. I saw the bass player from ZZ Top ( Dusty Hill ) using one in a video. It's a steep slope ( 36db/oct ) High Pass Filter ( HPF ). It cuts anything below 25Hz out of my signal. It really works and cuts down those low frequency cone wobbles you get. That's pretty much my pedal board. Maybe some day I'll post pics of the stuff I talk about...
Hope you guys don’t mind but I have a question for Admin.
I have been chatting a few times with Rip Van Dam and he had said you would be the man to ask.
I have a Time Traveler 405 that has been troublesome for a while now. It will perform sometimes for about 10 minutes and then the volume slowly fades out to nothing. I may have started the ball rolling when I hooked up my 2 10 XLT with the banana plug in the cab hooked up backwards. I was running a 4 10 and a two ten daisy chained and amp seemed to over heat and the cabs bulbs were a glowing. I shut it down, hooked it up properly and it worked. Some time later, like a month after that and the amp began to loose volume slowly till it quit. Has been to a couple of techs but no one seems to be able to figure out what’s wrong.
It’s a great sounding amp with the best tone I’ve ever heard, I’ve had a few amps in my time. Was wondering if you might have some insight to this problem.
Thanks
Laurence
Canada
I have been chatting a few times with Rip Van Dam and he had said you would be the man to ask.
I have a Time Traveler 405 that has been troublesome for a while now. It will perform sometimes for about 10 minutes and then the volume slowly fades out to nothing. I may have started the ball rolling when I hooked up my 2 10 XLT with the banana plug in the cab hooked up backwards. I was running a 4 10 and a two ten daisy chained and amp seemed to over heat and the cabs bulbs were a glowing. I shut it down, hooked it up properly and it worked. Some time later, like a month after that and the amp began to loose volume slowly till it quit. Has been to a couple of techs but no one seems to be able to figure out what’s wrong.
It’s a great sounding amp with the best tone I’ve ever heard, I’ve had a few amps in my time. Was wondering if you might have some insight to this problem.
Thanks
Laurence
Canada
- Feb 12, 2006
- 60,960
- 5
- 220,624
- Disclosures
- Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
Hooking the banana plugs backwards has nothing to do with your problem.
You need a qualified service tech to diagnose what’s actually happening before it can be properly fixed.
You need a qualified service tech to diagnose what’s actually happening before it can be properly fixed.
Sorry Laurence D, that's not admin, but Armin, who is @Bassmann1968 here on TB. He's in Germany and travels a lot, so he's sometimes hard to get in touch with. Normally, if he's around, he'll get back to us quickly.
I knew his name but auto correct stepped in and changed it on me. I had bought the amp from Long & McQuade Music but don’t think they were qualified to work on it. They were dealers for Eden years back but the tech that was there is gone.
Laurence D
Where in Canada are you? Ahh. I see Sask. Too bad. I’m in Ontario and could have helped you.
I’ve taken it to two techs here in Saskatoon but they couldn’t figure it out even with a schematic. We don’t have a dealer anymore as far as I know. I appreciate your time replying to this post.
Every thing lights up as it should, compressor light shows it’s getting signal from my bass just no sound. I cleaned all the jacks with a contact cleaner but no response. It will occasionally work fine for a few minutes and then it slowly fades out to nothing.
Laurence D
You might try cleaning all of the pots as well if you havent....i had this issue on a Fender Blues Deluxe and cleaning all pots solved it.
