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Eden Forum Disappears

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Rip Van Dan, Oct 13, 2019.


  1. WattsTower

    WattsTower

    Sep 15, 2019
    Albany, NY
    Silly Question, but how would I best go about hooking up a power amp to either the wt800 or wtp900, using them as a preamp?

    Also, as far as pedals go, what is the best way to route those? Through pre-send and return or?

    TIA
     
  2. Rip Van Dan

    Rip Van Dan DNA Endorsing Artist Supporting Member

    Feb 2, 2009
    Duvall, WA
    With the WT800, you can run an instrument cable out of effects-send to an effects-return of another amplifier. However, a cooler thing is that you can run an instrument cable out of the headphones jack into the effects-return of another amplifier and that gives you even more control than the effects send. First of all it sends out a hotter signal. This was specifically done so you could run a slave amp and not have to fiddle with both masters when you did a volume change.

    Once you have the the instrument cord from the WT800's headphone jack hooked up to the effects-return of the slave amp, and after you have made the initial adjustment to the slave amp's volume to balance the sound of it's cabs with the ones the WT800 is driving, you can control the volume of both the master amp (WT800) and the slave amp by just turning up or down the master on the WT800. That's actually a pretty cool set-up. It doesn't work with the WTX amps but most of their WT series will

    I've done this with my WT500/800 as well as my Eden Nemesis RS400 amp and it works very well.
     
    WattsTower likes this.
  3. WattsTower

    WattsTower

    Sep 15, 2019
    Albany, NY
    Thanks Dan! I'll have to give that a try once my newly obtained wt800 actually produces even 'some' sound. powers on, but no sound, even out of the headphones :)
     
  4. Rip Van Dan

    Rip Van Dan DNA Endorsing Artist Supporting Member

    Feb 2, 2009
    Duvall, WA
    A few things real quick:

    • What year is your WT800 and does it have the backlit logo on the front. We call that the porchlight and the porchlight should be on). Prior to about 2005 there was no "porchlight".

    • Do all the EQ lights come on besides the on/off switch?

    • First thing you want to do is make sure the gain knob is pushed in, not pulled out. If you pull it out, it mutes the amp.

    • if all lights are on and your instrument cord is completely seated (had one cord that didn't want to seat completely once), turn the gain knob up to about 4 or 5 o'clock (almost all the way to max) and hit an open string or any note. The gain "se-level" light located by the 9th hash mark of the gain knob should light up or at least flash if the signal is getting into the preamp.

    • If the lights are on and the gain set-level light flashes or stays on that means a signal is getting to the EQ section.

    • If that gain "set-level" light is working, then take an instrument cord and plug it in the back from the effects-send to the effects return. There are two of them. One sends a pre-effects signal and the other sends the post-effects. If the first one doesn't work, try the second one. If your amp then works, you need to clean all the 1/4" jacks on the back of the amp - may as well do the input on the front while you're at it. The signal path runs through virtually all of the jacks on the back, and if one is corroded it can cause complete or intermittent silence, crackles, or buzz.

    Use the red label DeOxit 5 contact cleaner to clean them. Usually it is a jack that you don't use that will get corroded enough to interrupt the signal because there's no plug moving in and out to knock of any of the corrosion. To clean an Eden amp, set the nozzle on the DeOxit to L for "Light". Spray a short spray into the jack itself (OK to do this on Eden amps, don't do it on a Mesa amp!) and then spray the tip and shaft of a 1/4" plug. Work the plug in and out about 10 to 15 times refreshing the spray on the plug as you move to each jack. Do this on an annual basis and you will preclude any signal path problems due to corrosion.

    On amps other than Eden, check with manufacturer before spraying directly into the jack. There may be components directly behind it that can be damaged by spraying contact cleaner directly into the jack. But the short spray with the nozzle on L is fine for an Eden amp.

    If you need an owner's manual, I need to find out which WT800 you actually have and then I can e-mail you a pdf copy of it. There's a very specific method to use to get the best sound out of an Eden amp, and that's delineated in the manual.
     
  5. Does this apply to all Eden amps? I never did get my 405 working, might try this to see if it works. I have ordered a DNA 800 direct from David to replace my 405. I decided to replace it rather than trying to fix it. Two techs have tried and failed. Didn’t want to spend anymore
     
  6. Rip Van Dan

    Rip Van Dan DNA Endorsing Artist Supporting Member

    Feb 2, 2009
    Duvall, WA
    Hi @Laurence D. I was trying to answer this with the forum went up in smoke and sparks and water.

    That method of testing will work on all the Eden WT, WTX, WTB, and Nemesis series amps that David designed. I presume it works on the WTP amps, which came from the Marshall designers, but I don't know for a fact that it does. If Armin (@Bassmann1968) pops in here, he will probably know because he has one (has almost all the Eden amps actually) and was our electronics guru on the Eden Forum.

    Basically if the gain set light comes on with the gain set high enough to trigger it, you know the signal is getting to the preamp. If hooking the effects-send up to the effects-return works, then you know the preamp is working. Usually that means there's a bad or corroded connection somewhere in the signal path. Cleaning the 1/4" jacks usually fixes it, but sometimes there's a further problem with it. Cleaning the jacks on an annual basis will avoid a lot of intermittent and hard to track down problems, so at the Eden forum we always recommended cleaning all the jacks before taking it to a tech.

    Also be aware that some manufacturer's do not want you to put a spritz of contact cleaner into the jack because they have components behind the jack that might not respond well to that cleaning solution. So be sure to check the manufacturer's manual for direction in a non-Eden amp. If that's the case, you can still spray in on the plug and work the plug in and out of the jack 10 to 15 times on each jack, or take a long-handled Q-tip, spray it on the cotton end, and use that to clean the jack inside. Most electronics stores will have those specifically for cleaning contacts.
     
  7. Thanks for the info. I don’t think my two tech guys tried that. We’ll find out. Mean while, I’m waiting for my DNA to arrive. I desided rather than spending more money on the 405 I might just as well put it toward a new one.
     
  8. edencab

    edencab

    Aug 14, 2013
    Toronto, On
    well that is awful...I remember talking with Armin about my cab and the time I bought the Eden E300 (I think)...good guy and good forum...hadn't been there for a while though, but still.....:thumbsdown::(
     
    Bassmann1968 likes this.
  9. Bassist30

    Bassist30 Supporting Member

    Mar 19, 2004
    NEW YORK
    Lost my WT 800 when it flew out the back of my Truck. Missed it so bad that I recently bought a WT 550 in fantastic shape. Made in 1999.
     
    Bassmann1968 and DavidEdenAria like this.
  10. Rip Van Dan

    Rip Van Dan DNA Endorsing Artist Supporting Member

    Feb 2, 2009
    Duvall, WA
    I think that's a wise choice, although I would suggest cleaning all the jacks on your WT405 just to see if it works. If it does, then you'll have a back-up in case you ever need it, or at least a sell-able amp if you want to get rid of it.
     
    Bassist30 and Bassmann1968 like this.
  11. This is sad news. I guess it's not as sad as seeing a great brand with innovative ideas get bought by a big conglomerate, get retooled for a different market, and then fade into irrelevance. I never let my Traveler 400+ go and it's still a fine amp I enjoy weekly.
     
    shoot-r and Bassmann1968 like this.
  12. Rip Van Dan

    Rip Van Dan DNA Endorsing Artist Supporting Member

    Feb 2, 2009
    Duvall, WA
    You know @MuthaFunk your WT400+ is widely regarded by "Edenites" as the best sounding amp that David made at Eden. Every once in a while one would show up on the Eden Forum Classifieds and it never stayed around more than a couple of days. And then we would have a spate of messages from folks who are sorry they missed it because they sold theirs and always regretted doing so. And if I recall correctly, the "+" version was signed by David too.
     
    Bassmann1968 likes this.
  13. I whole heartedly agree with my fellow “Edenites”!!

    I’ve had a lot of Eden gear over the years, this has been a reference for me since I bought it new in ‘98.

    B1EC91BE-2A34-420C-BC51-E2C5E5DB78FE.jpeg 65E5CBEB-87F8-4CEE-89B5-25E857587F14.jpeg
    View attachment 4234390
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2021
    Bassmann1968 and Rip Van Dan like this.
  14. There's a Highwayman WT500 from 1998 for sale on ebay in "near mint' condition. The only things are: 1) It is in Slovenia 2) It is about $765 usd plus shipping (which is about $55), so $820.

    I know around here they go for around $400 used, but in this condition, it raised an eyebrow. Sending it 5000+ miles (I'm in the PNW), might not the best thing, though. Still, got me interested.
     
    Rip Van Dan likes this.
  15. I picked up a can of the cleaner you recommended and used it but didn’t help. It worked for about ten minutes and then the volume began decreasing to nothing. Same thing it’s been doing for the last year or more. Every thing lights up as it should. The compressor is working so I know the amp is getting signal.
    I did my 800C to keep it clean.
    It was worth a try! Thanks for the help!
     
    Rip Van Dan likes this.
  16. Rip Van Dan

    Rip Van Dan DNA Endorsing Artist Supporting Member

    Feb 2, 2009
    Duvall, WA
    I hate to say it, but I think you can probably find a WT800C for around that amount or less now. The WT500 that I have was made in 1999 and was upgraded to 800-watts bridged from 500-watts bridged because it belonged to David Nordschow and he was using it on his test bench for designing the Eden cabs. In its normal state it will put out 250-watts per channel into 4 ohms and 500-watts into 8 ohms. Bridged it would work fine for a single 8 ohm cab.

    The WT800C (the one with the light-up logo from 2006 and later) puts out 440-watts rms per channel into 4Ω and 500-watts into 2Ω. It bridges at either 800-watts rms into 8Ω or 1,100-watts into 4Ω. So it's a much more versatile and powerful amp by comparison. Also, coming from Slovenia, you really have no recourse if it doesn't turn out to be what you expect it to be.

    The other thing you have to be careful of is what current that is set up for. Do they use 220v or 110v? Here's info from the manual about running it with the correct current. Basically if it comes with a fuse holder marked "FUSE" then you have to have it converted to US current. Most of those WT500's have the ability to run at either 110v or 220v. You change it by flipping the fuse holder upside down from wherever it's set. It should read 115 VOLTS on top (right side up) for US current. If it reads "230 VOLTS", then you will need to flip it around (pull it out, turn it over, and put it back in - done). You want to make sure you have it mounted so the 115 VOLTS is right side up for US current. Below is the info from the manual about it:

    upload_2021-4-22_12-55-7.png
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2021
    Mosthigh likes this.
  17. Thanks for the input. There's also a D210XLT4 cab for sale, also in near mint condition, at a music store in Toronto, for $600 cad ($480 usd). Seeing as it has the "David Eden" logo, it is an older one. The same one is listed on Reverb for $1185 cad ($948 usd). Odd, but Reverb, like ebay, seems to be a 'aim high, get what you can' marketplace.
     
    Rip Van Dan likes this.
  18. Rip Van Dan

    Rip Van Dan DNA Endorsing Artist Supporting Member

    Feb 2, 2009
    Duvall, WA
    That D210XST 4Ω cab is a very sweet cab. It has the lowest lows (30Hz) of any Eden cabs. $600cad is a pretty good price on it. If you can get the serial number off the back we can figure out when it was made if that helps you out. The "David series" cabs didn't become the "D-series" cabs until 2010 after David left and started DNA. If it has speakon connectors on it, it's no older than 2005 at the oldest as I can see the banana connectors on the back of the cabs in the 2004 catalog.
     
  19. old_thumper

    old_thumper

    Feb 6, 2020
    Kansas
    For what it's worth, if the newer cabs ( that have the speakon connectors ) also have the painted black cast frame, then they are most likely the Made by Eminence for Eden speakers. They may sound fine...BUT if they are ever blown, they are not rebuildable ( Eminence only stocks recone kits for their Pro series ). The bare aluminum frames are the Made by Eden speakers and you can purchase recone kits for them. I ran into this the hard way by purchasing a used Eden D210XLT where the people said everything was good. The speakers were the Made by Eminence for Eden speakers and no one has recone kits for them. I ended up putting Eminence Delta 10B speakers in there but they don't sound as good as the Eden speakers. I ended up purchasing another "older" D210XLT that people said was in good working condition. Turns out those speakers still made some noise but were severely creased. At least I could recone them, which I did. The recone kits are about $55 per speaker and if you have someone do it, the labor is about $50 to $75 per speaker depending on who you choose.
     
    Rip Van Dan likes this.
  20. old_thumper

    old_thumper

    Feb 6, 2020
    Kansas
    I recently picked up a used Eden WTP600. I already use an Eden WT800. I had the WT800 in stereo, running 2 channels which should give me [email protected] ohms/channel, right? I have a D210XLT and a D115XL hooked up, one for each channel. In that configuration, I have a great sound with solid full bottom clean down to B and plenty of everything else.
    I hook up the WTP600. I select the cab mode where the 2 outputs are lit yellow ( 8 ohm cab on each output ). I use the active input, no comp, no tube, no enhance, eq has everything set to 12. The output is weak to say the least. no real bottom end and not much volume. I switch to the passive input. No difference. I crank the input gain to 2 to 3 o'clock to where the clip light comes on. I crank the master to 2 to 3 o'clock and I have barely usable volume for practice by myself when playing mp3s through a small sound system but just isn't gonna cut it for practice with the band, let alone gigs.

    Unless someone has an obvious no cost answer, this sucker is going back to the store.
     
  21. Primary

    Primary TB Assistant

    Here are some related products that TB members are talking about. Clicking on a product will take you to TB’s partner, Primary, where you can find links to TB discussions about these products.

     
    May 18, 2021

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