1. Please take 30 seconds to register your free account to remove most ads, post topics, make friends, earn reward points at our store, and more!  

Eden Forum Disappears

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Rip Van Dan, Oct 13, 2019.


  1. DavidEdenAria

    DavidEdenAria

    Dec 13, 2013
    On a Hill
    Very accurate description of the GK 800RB (which i own and described a bit)....I run it full range at 300 watts and leave the 100 watt amp unused though i may very well try it with some kind of 8 ohm speaker.

    Mostly i run the 800RB at 4 ohms...it is a legendary amp and is powerful like the Eden Metro and not far off tonewise comparing the Metro to the 800RB, except when pushed the 800RB is indeed dirtier, the "hitting the rails" sound which if one does a search, there is loads on the net about this amp.

    Honestly i have not played many GK amps but have heard plenty in clubs and on stages....the 800RB is legendary, it is very small and not heavy for a 300 watt amp designed in the 80's....when pushed it does its thing! i cant imagine using a less powerful amp than 300 really punchy watts with my 65 Epiphone Newport and its neck only 'mudbucker'...the Metro is more powerful but i rarely push either hard....I actually do use some dirt and fuzz at lower volumes ONLY lol! I wont risk blowing anything!
     
    Corbusier and Rip Van Dan like this.
  2. MR.ATK

    MR.ATK

    Jan 6, 2006
    Hello everyone, I recently acquired a used 2x10 xst 8 ohm.. my question is two fold, Is there any preferred years for the cabs? Also, what is the 30th anniv model? I came across a 2x10 XLT 30th anniv model any upgrades to it? Thx
     
  3. I have a WT-400 and have used it since 2003. It's been through the ringer and never failed me on the gig. But now lately, it is acting up. 2 years ago I actually had it serviced for the first time. The pots were acting up. The local tube amp "guru" worked on it, replacing the tube. I'm a little skeptical of his work.

    My practice time is limited with it right now and don't get to use it as much to completely diagnosis it. I realize that there are a lot of factors that may cause things to go haywire in your signal, so I have some work to do to diagnosis it. I believe I got good cables in place and my bass pre-amps have fresh batteries, but I will go back and double check that stuff.

    Right now, It seems like the volume fluctuates. Sometimes, it is solidly loud and other times it is audible, but weak. It seems to fluctuate randomly while I practice over a 1 hour period. Towards the end of a session, the low register gets weaker and sometimes distorts/breaks-up. The higher register comes out clear. I feel the urge to boost the Master to compensate, but that shouldn't be necessary. Over all I feel the amp has been running more noisy then when I was using it a lot years ago. I set my gain below the clip light flashes, and run the Master pretty quiet for personal practice. I keep the EQ mostly flat, maybe cutting out some of the high end. I have tried different basses and all behave weird. Sometimes my Thumb will have a more pronounced distorted signal. Not sure if that is because of it's active setup.

    Any thoughts on what it could be? What are the symptoms of a bad tube in a WT-400? Are there still official Eden Service Centers out there? Specifically in Colorado? I was thinking about officially retiring this Amp, but it seems silly because it is all I ever wanted in my sound and for it to sit broken would be sad.

    Thanks for the help!
     
  4. Bassmann1968

    Bassmann1968

    Feb 17, 2009
    Germany
    Hi,
    I always start with a good cleaning of all the 1/4" jacks.
    Especially the often unused FX send/return ones on the back.
    Rock on!
    Armin
     
    Rip Van Dan and Corporate Boy like this.
  5. Rip Van Dan

    Rip Van Dan DNA Endorsing Artist Supporting Member

    Feb 2, 2009
    Duvall, WA
    Like Armin said, start with cleaning all the 1/4" jacks (DeOxit 5 red label can and set the nozzle spray adjustment to L for "light" works great). Reason he said to pay particular attention to the Effects loop jacks is because they are rarely used by a lot of bassists, so there's not 1/4" plug moving in and out of that jack to knock off any bits of corrosion. The signal path on your WT400 passes through all those jacks and it just takes one to screw everything else up. Best to clean them all on an annual basis.

    Regarding the tube he replaced. The OEM tube is a Ruby 12ax7, but any good 12AX7 will do. I've only replaced mine once in the last 10-years and I did it as a bit of preventive maintenance, not because there was a problem (I kept the old tube as a back-up!). The tube is actually in the impedance matching section of the amp and it operates within very specific parameters, so it's not really stressed. Odds are they will go microphonic if they go bad.

    Rolling tubes (trying various brands) makes virtually no difference in sound as long as it's good quality (low-noise) because it is not overdriven. The new tube certainly didn't hurt, but it also obviously wasn't the problem. You'd be surprised what a good cleaning can clear up if you haven't been doing that. Let's hope that's all it is.

    Otherwise you want to get it to an Eden authorized repair station where they know how to work on those amps. I'd suggest sending them an e-mail at: "[email protected]" Be sure to put "Eden Amp Repair" in the subject line so you actually get over to the Eden section. Give them name, address, and phone and ask where an authorized repair station is near you. They used to have a map showing repair stations but it was way outdated. The few they listed in the Seattle area no longer handled Eden repairs. I wrote to them and they gave me the contact info for the two places in Seattle area that were authorized and I confirmed that with a phone call to the repair stations.
     
  6. MR.ATK

    MR.ATK

    Jan 6, 2006

    no one?
     
  7. Rip Van Dan

    Rip Van Dan DNA Endorsing Artist Supporting Member

    Feb 2, 2009
    Duvall, WA
    no real upgrades per se just 30-years of making some of the world's best bass gear. However, if you already have the D210XST, that D210XLT would be a great addition to it. You get the best of both worlds when you run and XST cab with an XLT cab. The D210XST cab has the lowest and tightest low end that Eden makes (30Hz low frequency) and the XLT cab has the built-in low mid hump that sounds so good and gives it nice definition and presence in the mix. Together they are like a slice of heaven. So much so that about 10-years ago they changed their 810 cab from being an 810XLT to being an 810XT because they combined 4 XLT 10" speakers with 4 XST 10" speakers. They had noticed that their D810XLT sales had dropped off and a number of folks were combining a D410XLT with a D410XST instead. So the formalized that combination into one 810 cab. It's really a great sound. If you can get a good price on the D210XLT....snag it!
     
    Treb and Bassmann1968 like this.
  8. old_thumper

    old_thumper

    Feb 6, 2020
    Kansas
    Thanks, agedhorse for a most thorough explanation of what it is that I look at numbers wise vs what is important. I think the Eminence BP102s have a bit more xmax and a lower resonance frequency than the Delta 10Bs but sound wise they lack mids and clarity. i can always pair up that D210XLT cab that has the Deltas with an Eden D115XL for better lows , right? I also have a 2nd D210XLT that I am having the original Eden EC1060XLs reconed so that should be a best match speaker for the cab and I can run the 2 D210XLTs together.

    I've never been one to crank the amp because someone said the speakers are 'rated" for it. I watch the cone travel and listen. I do typically run the WT800 Eden in bridged when running on a 410 or the pairings I mentioned above. But then I only set the gain at noon and and the main at 9 or 10 with EQ flat ( I may push the preamp a bit with an external bass pre pedal
     
  9. agedhorse

    agedhorse Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 12, 2006
    Davis, CA (USA)
    Development Engineer-Mesa, Product Support-Genz Benz
    Maybe, it depends...
     
  10. Searay

    Searay

    May 20, 2012
    The tube does not appear to make any difference tonally to me. I replaced the original with a couple of other known good tubes and it really did not matter. The horn in the 4x10 blew a couple of times, but other than that just some 24 year old scratch pots.
     
  11. Bassmann1968

    Bassmann1968

    Feb 17, 2009
    Germany
    It's because the tube sits in the impedance section of the preamp not the gain stage.
     
  12. Searay

    Searay

    May 20, 2012
    Thanks Armin, I was unaware of it's function. I/we appreciate your wisdom.
     
    Bassmann1968 likes this.
  13. old_thumper

    old_thumper

    Feb 6, 2020
    Kansas
    I'm thinking that they call that stage a Cathode follower or something like that. No gain but trying to get that warm tubey sound. I suppose that's why I can run a bass pedal preamp to push that a bit and not really overdrive the actual gain stage much. It may enhance the tube harmonics or something for the Eden amps.

    I believe SWR had something similar for their bass amps.

    My gut feel is that the cathode follower in the Eden is what I hear tone wise and why I enjoy the amps so much...Smooth, buttery, rich.
     
    Rip Van Dan likes this.
  14. Rip Van Dan

    Rip Van Dan DNA Endorsing Artist Supporting Member

    Feb 2, 2009
    Duvall, WA
    I have both types, Eden amps with the tube and those without the tube. My Eden Nemesis RS400 has a 100% FET preamp and it definitely sounds more sterile than my Eden WT500/800 with the hybrid preamp. Yes that 12ax7 tube in the impedance section is what gives it that warmth. I also have a newer Eden Class D amp the TN-226. It has the same warmth as my hybrid but it uses a "golden ear chip" to emulate that as well as do a couple of other things. If you see an Eden amp with the "hybrid" moniker on it, you can expect that warm sound. Their latest class D amps also have that warm sound.
     
  15. agedhorse

    agedhorse Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 12, 2006
    Davis, CA (USA)
    Development Engineer-Mesa, Product Support-Genz Benz
    Perhaps that's just a bit on the harsh side eh?
     
  16. NoiseNinja

    NoiseNinja Experimental-psychedelic-ambient-noise-drone

    Feb 23, 2011
    Denmark
    I deleted that post as I was afraid it might be interpreted as political and earn me another ban, when really it was just stating the sad truth of reality.

    To OP:

    Sorry to hear so.

    Sadly that's pretty much how most big business co-operations chose to run their companies.

    In the end unfortunately all that matters to them is how much money they can earn, regardless of anything else.

    That you doing a favor to them, essentially doing customer service work, for all these years for free meaning absolutely nothing to them is just despicably shameless.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2021
  17. old_thumper

    old_thumper

    Feb 6, 2020
    Kansas

    Agedhorse,

    Looking for a few more recommendations now based on your wisdom.

    Going on the mechanical limitations of a speaker in a given cab as the "better" way to do things, I am going to unbridge my Eden WT800 and run 2 300 channels into a 2 cab mix - a D210XLT ( the one with the Eminence Delta 10Bs, for now until I get the Eden speakers reconed for it) and a D115XL. Eden ratings are 350W for the D210XLT. The D115XL is rated 400W. As I understand, you are saying that I should use 40 to 50% rated power as a max? So, 300W per cab should be reasonably close?

    In the same vein, I have a Eden D410XLT rated at 700W and a Eden D410XST rated at 1000W. These both have the correct Eden drivers for the cabs and should be matched to the cab. What are your suggested power limits for these cabs?

    I do appreciate your input and guidance. I don't have anything that Mesa Boogie but those are amazing guitar amps. I've only read about the Mesa tube bass head and have never seen one in person. All beautiful pieces of engineering. I'd even like to hear some stories of Mesa Boogie and what you have been involved with there. When I was younger, I attempted to pursue a EE degree but found I didn't really enjoy Calculus THAT much and later swtiched majors to Computer Science. Through the years I as was an electronics tech for about 15 years, so your explanations don't go entirely over my head and it has all been useful and educational.

    Thanks again.
     
  18. old_thumper

    old_thumper

    Feb 6, 2020
    Kansas
    Maybe this is a reach but since you have the Rocco Prestia king of all cabs, do you play any TOP? I mean like can you do What Is Hip? It would be a killer treat if you could post of vid if you can. I'd be watching it over and over, slack jawed in awe.
     
  19. Bassmann1968

    Bassmann1968

    Feb 17, 2009
    Germany
    With my Big Band we played Attitude Dance and What is hip?.
    Unfortunately I don't have videos.
    I will ask my girl friend if she recorded any TOP at a gig.
     
    dabis likes this.
  20. agedhorse

    agedhorse Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 12, 2006
    Davis, CA (USA)
    Development Engineer-Mesa, Product Support-Genz Benz
    Generally, it’s safe without further data to assume that the rated power is based on thermal limits over a 2 hour time span. This would generally apply to the Delta series, but each driver (within the context of the specific cabinet) has their own boundaries.
     
  21. Primary

    Primary TB Assistant

    Here are some related products that TB members are talking about. Clicking on a product will take you to TB’s partner, Primary, where you can find links to TB discussions about these products.

     
    May 8, 2021

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.