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Double Bass Effect of cold on amplifiers

#21
Lots of speculation on this thread. Any experience or research to report?

For instance I know from the experiences of other luthiers and bass players, much well documented on this website, that if I leave my double bass in the van in extremes of heat or cold I can get cracking and glue joint failures. So I go to great pains to avoid that exposure.

I leave speakers next to amps in the van or in storage in the cold all the time and have for a long time. I don't know of any sound companies that do otherwise. Anybody have problems they've had to fix from leaving stuff in the cold? Anyone know any sound companies that pay the costs for heated storage or do nightly loadouts due to the affects of cold on their amps or speakers?

I'm ready to stand corrected and start hauling my stuff inside if someone has some proof that I'm damaging it; but my 810 Ampeg cabinets are a bitch to haul in the house so its going to take a bit more than speculation for me to start doing that.
 
#22
Uncletoad said:
Lots of speculation on this thread. Any experience or research to report?
Click to expand...
I have a couple decades worth of experience leaving all my equipment; instruments, speakers, solid state and tube amps, speakers, out in the extremes and have never, ever, ever, ever experienced any problems of any sort due to this exposure.

Many times I have arrived set up and played within 30 minutes of arrival at temps down to -50 below with no problems whatsoever.

Do I still feel nervous at times? Maybe, but experience has not led me to believe that there is any more merit to completely acclimating equipment before usage than there is to having someone go and check every intersection before signaling that it's okay to cross an intersection.

I'm with UncleToad on this one and feel that if someone gains some peace of mind by bringing all their equipment indoors that it's a good thing for them, but not a necessity.
 
#23
Okay then, but at least if you use condenser microphones (no pun intended), either take it inside, or make sure it's warm and dry. Condensers are infamous when it comes to moisture.

The most widespread thing, at least when it comes to recording equipment and the like (apart from just the tapes), is that the condensation makes the darn things short-circuit and corrode.

As far as my experience goes, LCDs can get a little sluggish when they are cold, but when they warm up, they are fine again.

Another thing - I have never with any of my equipment (No, I'm not talking instruments), been 100 per cent consequent, but I try to do what I have said on the previous page, whenever possible. The reason being that not just short circuits can appear, but corrosion over time can (and will). I have seen Nagras, although they are indestructable (almost), that have corroded so much inside you wouldn't believe it. Fortunately, not much electronics are inside them.

Speakers, I'd only be worried if they were made of wood pulp, and with any equipment (apart from wooden music instruments), I wouldn't worry too much, unless it went from the cold to heat quite often. Once in a while isn't anything to worry about.

I'm serious, though, plastic wrap it, when you bring it in. It's not humbug, it's simply keeping the moisture from entering the machine/amp/speaker, and it's the moisture that can be a killer (as opposed to wooden instruments, where the heat and cold, the humidity etc in itself can do damage).

Akami said:
Many times I have arrived set up and played within 30 minutes of arrival at temps down to -50 below with no problems whatsoever.
Click to expand...

Really? -50? where do you live since you get that temperature (without the wind chill).


Andre
 
#24
Bloody Viking said:
Really? -50? where do you live since you get that temperature (without the wind chill).
Andre
Click to expand...
I'm in Alaska and never include wind chill into talk of temps.

Played out on Summit Lake back about 10 years ago inside an open front tent and had all our arctic gear on, but it was a lot harder on our fingers and voices than anything else!
 
#25
Cool, Akami :)

But from what I could understand from this subject it was a question of when you went inside again, and played it there.

or else, I'm misunderstanding something.

Anyways, I would love to see a picture of you guys in all that gear. I have this funny picture of it in my head :)
 
#26
Bloody Viking said:
Cool, Akami :)

But from what I could understand from this subject it was a question of when you went inside again, and played it there.

or else, I'm misunderstanding something.

Anyways, I would love to see a picture of you guys in all that gear. I have this funny picture of it in my head :)
Click to expand...
There was only one time we stayed outside during the winter, but uncountable times that I've hauled everything in from the van at -40 below and several times at -50 below with no problems encountered.

I wish someone would come up with some pics from that night too!

We had a bonfire out in front, which was supposed to help keep us warm too, but 30 feet away was too far to help at all.

It also remains the only time I've ever had so much to drink while playing that I passed out in mid song!

We'd already gone on for hours and it was probably just as well... :rollno:
 
#29
I live in a freaking cold place and I've been moving equipment around for 25 years or so. Ray Parker's story of the amp that "had issues" while warming up rings truest to me so far...

In theory all this dew point stuff is true but in practice I've never seen it be any kind of an issue for working musicians.

If your stuff gets really cold ("real cold" to me is anything below -20 degrees centigrade) watch out for your plastic parts. Knobs, handles, edge guards, etc. A lot of that stuff can get brittle at those temps and will break on you.
 
#30
Occasionally, I'll leave my cabinet in the car overnight cause I just want to get out of the ******* cold(and that's REALLY cold) but always bring in my axe and pre and power amps. Does anyone know if the cold affects the cone of the speaker? The cab is covered with a blanket.
 
#31
I frequently exposed my amps and speakers to temps down to -20 F, with no problems. Usually it is a situation where I have no choice but to leave my gear in the car before or after a gig. The fluctuations were not so good for my bass, which has some finish cracking as a result.
 
#32
Damon Rondeau said:
If your stuff gets really cold ("real cold" to me is anything below -20 degrees centigrade) watch out for your plastic parts. Knobs, handles, edge guards, etc. A lot of that stuff can get brittle at those temps and will break on you.
Click to expand...
Reading your post reminds me that although I've never experienced problems with electronics, I have had plastic pieces break.
They get incredibly brittle at the winter temps we get up here!


fdeck said:
I frequently exposed my amps and speakers to temps down to -20 F, with no problems. Usually it is a situation where I have no choice but to leave my gear in the car before or after a gig. The fluctuations were not so good for my bass, which has some finish cracking as a result.
Click to expand...
Once again, I've got some finish cracks on my JEM, but none on my refinished instruments. :hmm:
 
#33
I brought an amp home from out of the cold UPS depot yesterday and waited 30 seconds, after turning on the power, to play anything through it. Tube pre-amps, so I figured some warm-up time would be a good idea.
It sounded horribly distorted, even with the gain low, so I returned it to Guitar Center.
Today it's back on their site for sale, so I'm wondering if it just needed to warm up, but I'm more considering that they just put it out on the floor w/o giving a crap how it sounded.
 
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#39
Seems to me that if an amp is left out in the cold, then the normal instructions re waiting 30 seconds wouldn't apply. Still, it seems unlikely that the amp being cold would be the cause of horribly distorted sound. On the other hand, frozen electrolytic capacitors can't be expected to perform at spec. I think good practice is to operate an amp-- especially a tube-based amp-- only when it's within the range of reasonably normal expected temperatures. I'm thinking roughly 40° to 110° or so. That's a wide range, for sure. I wouldn't turn on any amp that had been near freezing until it had a chance to warm up a bit. Just seems to make good sense.
 

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