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Double Bass Evah Pirazzi strings megathread part I

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#641
fingers said:
I've read several interviews by several pros that think the acoustic and amplified sound of your bass should be treated as different things.
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You don't really have a choice; they are different things. I have found that the best plan is to learn how to work with the amplified sound to create the best possible sound to enable you to forget about the sound and put your attention on the music itself. It is all-to-common for us to get caught up in worrying about the wrong things. There are lots of great recordings where the sound of the bass itself might be less than ideal but the music transcends that. There are lots of examples of just the opposite. I am sure that Scott LaFaro wasn't thinking about how great his sound was on the Village Vanguard recordings... If you can think of your acoustic and amplified sounds as being separate (but hopefully related), getting a pleasant and workable amped sound should not be that hard, provided you can get a good acoustic sound and you have at least a decent amplification system.
 
#642
O.K., I agree with all of that. I agree in general that I need to get out of my head with all of this stuff and get back to playing music.

But, I will say that is an important component of music. And no disrespect to the greats, I don't always love everyone's sound, even if I love or respect or admire their playing. Especially things recorded in the '70s for example, when strings and pickups were not really developed very well and plugging straight into the board might have been more popular. There are straight ahead records with some great players on it, that may as well have been recorded with a Fender P-Bass from a sonic stand point.

I do care about that.

But, your points are well made. When I'm in the "decent sound" range and I can hear myself well enough over the drummer to get the feedback I need to interact with my bass and the band, then I should quiet the noise (I didn't say voices) in my head down and play.

-tk
 
#643
I hear you Troy. I used to have a mic, a pickup, a blender, a preamp, and an amp as my signal chain.

I think I told this story before but...
One night, after a few glasses of wine, I went a little nuts and took the mic off my bass and all that extra stuff out of my bag. I did a gig the next day with pickup, amp. It was one of the best days of my bass playing life. After a little eqing the tone I got was more than usable and there was very little to tweak. Freedom. Setup took 5 min. Tear down the same.

I have to fight the GAS urge all the time but I just try to remember how a felt that night.

Derail over.
 
#645
I just got the extended EP E and initially I'm very pleased. It definitely has a more aggressive tone than the belcantos have, but I kind of like that on the E. The string bows very well and is loud as crud. I don't think I'll be replacing my belcantos with them, but I think it will work very well as an E string.
 
#646
I was using Obligatos for the last 1 1/2 years and I must say the EPs are an enormous improvement. MUCH louder acoustically which is really great. The Obligatos always seemed too soft. The EPs have a much more solid fundamental than the OBLIs. I'm using a Wilson p/u through my GK 800RB (until my EA Micro300 arrives) into a wizzy 110. The amplified sound seems fine so far, a bit darker than the OBLIs. The Wilson may be helping. Had an Underwood on previously and it just didn't work for me at all. I learned about the EPs on this forum and am very grateful for all of your shared experience and wisdom!
 
#647
Okay.

The point I was getting to in my original post is TO EACH HIS OWN. Period, dudes.

I listed different bassists with different strings and different setups because they all sound fabulous and they all find different paths to get there. You need to find your own, and believe it or not, amplification is a part of it for most of us.

I toured the country with two different artists--both amazing. They hired me for almost 4 years to sound like ME--Paul Thompson--and that's what I tried to deliver. Most nights I could do that, but some nights (whether it was the room or amp or whatever) I couldn't, and those guys could tell. It wasn't like "your mids are harsh" or "your sound is bright", but they knew something wasn't right occasionally. What I'm saying is, you use all of these tools to sound like YOU--strings, amp, EVERYTHING. If it's between your hands and the listeners' ears, then you've GOT TO DEAL WITH IT.

I also had to laugh when I read your post about the irrelevance of the amplified sound. Ron Carter won't even RECORD without a pickup, let alone try and play a gig without an amp. I seriously doubt if George Mraz is cursing the amp everytime he plays a gig. You learn to get your sound out of an amp. It's part of your equipment. Years ago, I saw Ray Drummond do a clinic here. He commented that bass players need to know more about sound and amplification. He then proceeded to tell the soundman what frequencies to cut and boost in the house. I think that we, as bassists, tend to be really naive when it comes to knowing about these things. As Ron Carter puts it, "you have to have a real laboratory mentality about it." Alot of us, including some really good bass players, get a decent amp and buy the pickup that everybody else is using and that's that. Maybe we even go onto talkbass.com and decide to buy the strings that everybody else seems to be loving or the cabinet that's got 250 replies in its post. It costs money and takes time, but you've got to find what works for you. Believe me, when you get onstage at the Blue Note on a Friday night, and somebody HEAVY is tapping off a tempo in front of you, you want to make sure that you sound like YOU. The amp, the strings, the bass, they all only HELP.
 
#648
pdbass said:
I also had to laugh when I read your post about the irrelevance of the amplified sound. Ron Carter won't even RECORD without a pickup, let alone try and play a gig without an amp. I seriously doubt if George Mraz is cursing the amp everytime he plays a gig. You learn to get your sound out of an amp. It's part of your equipment. Years ago, I saw Ray Drummond do a clinic here. He commented that bass players need to know more about sound and amplification. He then proceeded to tell the soundman what frequencies to cut and boost in the house. I think that we, as bassists, tend to be really naive when it comes to knowing about these things. As Ron Carter puts it, "you have to have a real laboratory mentality about it." Alot of us, including some really good bass players, get a decent amp and buy the pickup that everybody else is using and that's that. Maybe we even go onto talkbass.com and decide to buy the strings that everybody else seems to be loving or the cabinet that's got 250 replies in its post. It costs money and takes time, but you've got to find what works for you. Believe me, when you get onstage at the Blue Note on a Friday night, and somebody HEAVY is tapping off a tempo in front of you, you want to make sure that you sound like YOU. The amp, the strings, the bass, they all only HELP.
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Where did you hear that Ron Carter records with a pickup? I heard the exact opposite (but if you heard it from the man himself that's clearly what's up).

Other than that I completely agree with what you said. That quote from Ron Carter is interesting, as is what you wrote afterward. It's also why I've spent the past year+ playing almost exclusively ampless. Part of the process (along with learning and researching about amps and pickups) is learning and developing your own sound. I personally believe that an amp can be a hindrance for developing your own sound, but that's an other thread.

This is all IMHO, and not directed at anybody in particular,

Peace
Ben
 
#650
Ben Rolston said:
Anybody have any experience with a realist with Evah's?
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All my previous posts were about EP's on my carved 1920's German shop bass w/ a Realist -> Focus 2R III -> Wizzy M-line 12

OR:

Same bass w/ Realist -> LR Baggs Paracoustic DI -> Polytone Sonic Circuit (a newer Mini-Brute w/15)
 
#651
First of all, let me apologize to everyone else in this community. I'm a bassist and also a teacher and I feel like I seriously need to step in when I see someone being mislead or misinformed. I'm speaking not from rhetoric but from experience.

Too much time has been wasted on this discussion of pickup/not pickup, not to mention it taking up space in this thread.

Granted, alot of people seem irritated with the way thier Evahs sound amplified, some people (myself included) do not. End of story.

I suggest you start another thread to wax poetic about your feelings on playing amplified/acoustically so that I may not see these opinions in this Evah Pirazzi string thread.

BTW, there's a Ron Carter Bass Player cover story from '04 where he specifically states that most of the time he records with a pickup. I can also give you his phone number and you can ask him yourself.

As for asking classical players about pickups, give me a break. I never mentioned a classical player, and most jazz players--not all, but most--Dave Holland, Buster Williams, Bob Cranshaw, Miroslav Vitous, Eddie Gomez, Peter Washington, Ron McClure, Chris Wood, Andy Gonzalez, Steve Rodby, Henry Grimes, even Christian McBride, now--have got to depend on using some sort of amplification at some point in time. If you are heard acoustically, good for you! Don't go telling everybody else that's the way to go, though. Guys have to find there own path, and if you talk to anyone that played bass before pickups, MOST of them are glad to be heard now.

Sorry for the rant. . . . I'm just damn passionate about the bass. . . and I've been there, done that, got the damn t-shirt.
 
#652
I seem to remember reading that Ron Carter was sometimes called 'The Phantom' early in his career because he was hard to hear.
btw, the first thing I learned about gigging was the importance of being heard on a gig. I'm glad we now have our choice of tools to help in that endeavor. :D
 
#657
I've been using EPs since August. I play a 100 year old big English Bass and have used the EPs in orchestra, solo and jazz settings.
Like most Pirastro strings I've tried, I loved them for 3 months - then they die. The strings (all 4!) are false and sound "thuddy."
I may try another set, but most likely will go back to Thomastik.
 
#658
leftydunn said:
I've been using EPs since August. I play a 100 year old big English Bass and have used the EPs in orchestra, solo and jazz settings.
Like most Pirastro strings I've tried, I loved them for 3 months - then they die. The strings (all 4!) are false and sound "thuddy."
I may try another set, but most likely will go back to Thomastik.
Click to expand...

Well right about now is when they start sounding best for Bowing I would assume.
 
#659
leftydunn said:
I've been using EPs since August. I play a 100 year old big English Bass and have used the EPs in orchestra, solo and jazz settings.
Like most Pirastro strings I've tried, I loved them for 3 months - then they die. The strings (all 4!) are false and sound "thuddy."
I may try another set, but most likely will go back to Thomastik.
Click to expand...

That's you playing on your MySpace? Wow, not bad for playing backwards..lol

Actually, you sound great even upside down!

Your comments on 'sounds like' you mention amongst others, 'Samuel Gilkes'. I am wondering what that reference is exactly as I have never seen a Father Gilkes Bass (confirmed, labeled and branded) other than the one I own. I have heard of many attributed to him but being he lived a short live and made mostly Violins and Cellos it is not likely he made many Double Basses at all. Mine was actually a large Cello in shape like some of the Foster's were.
 
#660
Mine have done that a little bit as well. I wouldn't call them false or thuddy, though. They're just kind of burnished. And yeah, the arco is really nice right now.

I'll probably put Spiros on for some "gymnastic" ;) jazz recordings coming up this year. As a matter of fact, I'd better get 'em on there soon.
 
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