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Explain the Fender Bass VI
- Thread starter Jason42
- Start date
Not necessarily. It strongly depends on the strings.
My Bass VI does not sound thin at all. That's a converted Harley Benton shortscale. Strung with LaBella Flats (for the Hellcat VI) and played through a Hiwatt clone with some TL606-alike cab it can really serve and combine both worlds - that of a shortscale bass played with a pick and that of a guitar.
In addition to the strings, the amp and the cab play a really important role - You will need to use "universal" amps which do an equally good job on guitar as well on bass, and, even more important, You'll need speakers that can serve both worlds well. In practice that means EV12L / EV15L and their replacement types as the easiest options (or other speakers with "old school sound". No tweeters. I'm using Oberton 15L400 and Eminence Delta 12 for this.
I didn’t say it wasn’t cool. Just a very niche instrument.I defy you to check out the Julie Slick vids posted by @Toptube (post #59) and me (post #71) and then say that again.
Oh, I totally agree with that. In fact, the ways in which Julie uses it illustrate your point: playing solo with a looper, and playing in a band with another bassist. Those are definitely "niches." When she's in a "traditional" bass role, as when she tours with Adrian Belew, she uses a "regular" 4- or 5-string.
The common usage is that those are called octave guitars and VI's are called VI'S. Too late to change it now.
its a baritone guitar tuned like a standard guitar, an octave down....baritone guitars are usually tuned down a 5th A D G C E A.........its for this reason why both bassists and guitarists can utilize the Bass VI, and do, but they can be limiting to both depending on application
I played one for one gig ca. 1983. They kept calling my instruments "bass guitar" instead of "electric bass" so I borrowed a Bass Vi from a collector friend. Used my regular bass amp at the time, which was a Music Man HD-130 driving a Fender Bassman 2x12 (the smaller version).
Played it like a guitar- some chords, used the vibrato, some Chuck Berry style chugging, etc. It was fun and sounded cool on some stuff, and awful on others. That group did typical country bar band stuff back when country music was still rural, and some light old R'n'R (e. g. '50s, Creedebce, etc.). They never Caledonia my Precision or my StingRay a guitar again. I'm surprised I did get fired until 6 months later!
Anyway, I think it's a true bass guitar - the tuning with the 3rd between the G and B is a big part of the approach to the instrument,. The Fender Bass VI specifically with its direct lineage from the Jazzmaster and Jaguar is clearly.a guitar tuned an octave lower. BTW, I love Jazzmasters as long as they have the vibrato so the VI appeals to me. When I was the 3rd guitarist in a band I wished I'd.had one.
Played it like a guitar- some chords, used the vibrato, some Chuck Berry style chugging, etc. It was fun and sounded cool on some stuff, and awful on others. That group did typical country bar band stuff back when country music was still rural, and some light old R'n'R (e. g. '50s, Creedebce, etc.). They never Caledonia my Precision or my StingRay a guitar again. I'm surprised I did get fired until 6 months later!
Anyway, I think it's a true bass guitar - the tuning with the 3rd between the G and B is a big part of the approach to the instrument,. The Fender Bass VI specifically with its direct lineage from the Jazzmaster and Jaguar is clearly.a guitar tuned an octave lower. BTW, I love Jazzmasters as long as they have the vibrato so the VI appeals to me. When I was the 3rd guitarist in a band I wished I'd.had one.
Interesting. Whoever is playing bass, there are definite McCartney-esque octave jumps in the part (record version), that always made me think John picked up some of Paul's tricks over the years...
To bring it back to the thread topic, I can get much closer to this sound with my Squier VI (bridge pickup) than my Jazzes.
Yeah, well... it can stay there, too - far as I'm concerned. I've had one go-'round with the Fender Custom Shop some years ago, and it'll be a really cold day in a really hot place before I have anything to do with that den of lying wankers - or anything they've touched - ever again. Does look nice, though...
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I didn't find out about the Shecter until I had the Sidejack Baritone. As for the other thing? I don't know who makes that... In any case, like I said;
I suppose. Two bassists have caught my eye using a VI in a jazz/fusion context. Sveinung Hovensjo used one with the Terje Rypdal Trio. This band are interesting as they, to some degree, capture the sound of Bitches Brew-era Miles Davis in a power trio format. This clip shows them playing the track 'Icing' and then a John McLaughlin composition. Sveinung uses the bass as a lead/texture instrument at times and as a conventional bass the rest of the time. On the Terje Rypdal album 'What Comes After' he is credited with electric bass while another bass plays upright bass.
And he still has the bass, and I'm not going to argue with a Viking elder on this one:
The other bassist is Roy Babbington, who replaced Hugh Hopper in Soft Machine. His example looks gorgeous in white, with a matching headstock.
Roy cut a slighter musical figure than Hugh Hopper, but again I think there are times in live performances where he cuts loose with the fuzz pedals.
In both cases it seems like the Bass VI was used to dart between conventional bass playing and easily accessing a sort of interesting 'middle' texture between guitar and bass. In The Soft Machine clip it compliments quite a dense mix of instruments.
I suppose. Two bassists have caught my eye using a VI in a jazz/fusion context. Sveinung Hovensjo used one with the Terje Rypdal Trio. This band are interesting as they, to some degree, capture the sound of Bitches Brew-era Miles Davis in a power trio format. This clip shows them playing the track 'Icing' and then a John McLaughlin composition. Sveinung uses the bass as a lead/texture instrument at times and as a conventional bass the rest of the time. On the Terje Rypdal album 'What Comes After' he is credited with electric bass while another bass plays upright bass.
And he still has the bass, and I'm not going to argue with a Viking elder on this one:
The other bassist is Roy Babbington, who replaced Hugh Hopper in Soft Machine. His example looks gorgeous in white, with a matching headstock.
Roy cut a slighter musical figure than Hugh Hopper, but again I think there are times in live performances where he cuts loose with the fuzz pedals.
In both cases it seems like the Bass VI was used to dart between conventional bass playing and easily accessing a sort of interesting 'middle' texture between guitar and bass. In The Soft Machine clip it compliments quite a dense mix of instruments.
I need to dig into the Terje Rypdal stuff some more!
Roy Babbington is definitely my Bass VI idol - I probably would have gotten rid of mine if it weren't for him. Here's a shot I found on the internet:
The bass is so beautiful in the vid you and I posted and also in the Switzerland 1974 concert. I got to meet him earlier this year and wanted to ask him a bunch of questions but didn't get the chance. Did some digging on the internet and wrote about it in my blog:
Bassist Roy Babbington
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The Fender/Squier VI is basically a 30 inch Jazzmaster. Does that make it a bass? A baritone? Pretty much up to you really. It can do either quite well. Obviously the physical layout of the beast is pure guitar and that requires major adjustments for anyone who comes to it from the bass world. So that is as far as most bassists will ever get with it.
I own both a Squier VI which I play occasionally in a church band, when I am in the mood, and an Ibanez SRC6 which I converted to a five string and play most of the time. I tune both in fifths starting on the 31 Hz C1 and yes, they both will do that and will sound just fine. You can tune it any way you like, fourths, fifths, with or without the third between the top two strings. Mine is tuned in pure fifths so it is a true implementation of the NST, just an octave below.
I have no idea what use the whammy bar is on a bass other than hitting it occasionally to amuse the other musicians at a rehearsal! But then church music doesn't really call for one even on the lead guitar so perhaps there is a sensible use for the thing in other kinds of music. I believe that someone makes hardtail plates for them if you want to convert yours and of course it is easy enough to just pull the bar off and replace the spring with a stack of washers so that you can tighten the adjustment screw down and lock up the stock tailpiece.
You do need a lighter touch to play one fingerstyle. It is easy enough to do that however. Overall I really like mine and I would play it a lot more if the SRC6 didn't make such an excellent short scale fiver!! Those of you who have very strong attachments to the spacings and physical layout of traditional basses will never adjust to a VI, there's no point in your even trying. Those of you who are not obsessed with nut widths and string spacings might find that you can. Those of you who also play guitar or banjo or mandolin or ... won't have any issues at all. They just naturally have a much stronger appeal to guitarists who want to play bass or a deep baritone than to bassists who want to play bass. But some of us find them appealing anyway.
I own both a Squier VI which I play occasionally in a church band, when I am in the mood, and an Ibanez SRC6 which I converted to a five string and play most of the time. I tune both in fifths starting on the 31 Hz C1 and yes, they both will do that and will sound just fine. You can tune it any way you like, fourths, fifths, with or without the third between the top two strings. Mine is tuned in pure fifths so it is a true implementation of the NST, just an octave below.
I have no idea what use the whammy bar is on a bass other than hitting it occasionally to amuse the other musicians at a rehearsal! But then church music doesn't really call for one even on the lead guitar so perhaps there is a sensible use for the thing in other kinds of music. I believe that someone makes hardtail plates for them if you want to convert yours and of course it is easy enough to just pull the bar off and replace the spring with a stack of washers so that you can tighten the adjustment screw down and lock up the stock tailpiece.
You do need a lighter touch to play one fingerstyle. It is easy enough to do that however. Overall I really like mine and I would play it a lot more if the SRC6 didn't make such an excellent short scale fiver!! Those of you who have very strong attachments to the spacings and physical layout of traditional basses will never adjust to a VI, there's no point in your even trying. Those of you who are not obsessed with nut widths and string spacings might find that you can. Those of you who also play guitar or banjo or mandolin or ... won't have any issues at all. They just naturally have a much stronger appeal to guitarists who want to play bass or a deep baritone than to bassists who want to play bass. But some of us find them appealing anyway.
The Bass VI was an experiment from Fender - in the early days of bass guitars, it wasn't so obvious what the format should be. So....."Let's try this". It met with...limited success. Like the Mc Rib, if you make them available here and there, people will buy a few. If you try to make it an ongoing model, available all the time, everywhere, there's not enough demand for stores to keep them in stock all the time. So, it pops up, gets a little attention, and then, like the 17 year locusts, goes to sleep for a while.
7mm yes, but at the nut; it's 10.5mm (string centre to centre) at the bridge. Not saying it's not toight, I'd like it a smidgen wider myself, at both ends. But 7mm at the bridge would be like what, a toy guitar?
The first incarnation of Bond's project that I'm aware of was called the Graham Bond Quartet and featured John McLaughlin on guitar. You must have caught either the early days of the combo, before McLaughlin was in (I'm not sure Graham already played the Hammond live at the time though, he was mainly an alto player), or, more probably, a transition period after John was sacked (at Baker's behest), and before tenor saxophonist Dick Heckstall-Smith (an alumnus of Alexis Korner like the other three) was recruited, and the band redubbed the Graham Bond Organisation (back as a quartet, then). After two LPs, Jack was sacked (at Baker's behest - again) and the remaining three continued, bassless but with Graham playing organ pedals. Occasionally they were augmented with Mike Falana's trumpet. Then Baker left, joined Clapton who insisted on recruiting Bruce on bass (Jack had briefly subbed for John McVie in John Mayall's Bluesbreakers, and he'd also recorded with Clapton in the short-lived Powerhouse project), and Cream was born. Bond replaced Baker with Jon Hiseman. The Organisation's recordings of that era are dynamite, and sometimes feature Graham playing organ (pedals and left hand) and alto sax at the same time (as he surely did even before as you said), duetting with Heckstall-Smith. The latter was developing an "ensemble" technique of his own, similar to but independent of Rahsaan Roland Kirk's (two or even three saxes played at the same time by one player). Dick and Jon left Bond, played on the Bluesbreakers' album Bare Wires and founded Colosseum. Graham then put out solo albums and played with both Jack Bruce
EDIT: also possible, the venue where you used to see them perform live didn't pay them enough, and Bond would only perform sans Heckstall-Smith there.
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Fender VI bass
It's a precision bass but smaller with baby string.
Or some call is a Stratocaster with fat strings,
Sir Paul or one of the other guitar players John or George used it on one or two tracks during the Beatle era
It's a precision bass but smaller with baby string.
Or some call is a Stratocaster with fat strings,
Sir Paul or one of the other guitar players John or George used it on one or two tracks during the Beatle era
It can do Meshuggah-like sounds. I thought about getting one (Squier) at one point and putting a Bare Knuckles cobra single coil humbucker in it as a cheap 8 string replacement. Ibanez also made a 6 string 30" scale "bass" that could double as a low tuned guitar.
The trem isn't the best design though, the posts move...which is such a weird design by Fender.
The trem isn't the best design though, the posts move...which is such a weird design by Fender.
