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Fender-years to avoid?

I would also like to comment that two of THE BEST basses that I own are a pair of absolutely lovely mid-80's MIJ-made Fender J-Bass Specials. I truly think Fender (Japan) was outdoing Fender (America) back in the mid-80's.
IMO,tone-wise there is "just a smidgeon" left to be desired. I think the electronics and body wood (basswood) contributed to that factor.
No biggie though,I left the mint cond.,non-gigging one stock. DiMarzio's & Bad-Ass bridge on the "beat-to-hell",gigging bass.
As far as playability? Two of my better basses. Hell,come to think of it,ALL my basses sound & play kick-ass......:D
 
Ummm, CBS sold Fender in early '85.

I like my '79 P bass as much as my '97 jazz. The seventies models IMHO were the last of the good ones before CBS Fender started making more instruments out of the country. Many of us seen this as a cheaper made product for higher profit sales, thus tarnishing Fender's reputation. When CBS sold Fender in the mid nineties, the new management decided to redesign the P-Bass and Jazz not radically but with improved refinements. My '97 American standard Jazz bass is testament to Fender's commitment to it's heritage. Sure it isn't a '62 version, but I love the playability and tone and feel of the bass and to me it is reminiscent of a '65 Jazz bass I almost owned.

I'm not crazy about the extended line of Fender's like the deluxe, artist's series, relic's etc. and I Don't care to see the lower end models made in other countries, but Fender has the right to produce their products as they see the need by giving consumers a wide variety to choose from. On the flip side, this is what makes American made instruments retain and increase in value.
 
I like my '79 P bass as much as my '97 jazz. The seventies models IMHO were the last of the good ones before CBS Fender started making more instruments out of the country. Many of us seen this as a cheaper made product for higher profit sales, thus tarnishing Fender's reputation. When CBS sold Fender in the mid nineties, the new management decided to redesign the P-Bass and Jazz not radically but with improved refinements. My '97 American standard Jazz bass is testament to Fender's commitment to it's heritage. Sure it isn't a '62 version, but I love the playability and tone and feel of the bass and to me it is reminiscent of a '65 Jazz bass I almost owned.

I'm not crazy about the extended line of Fender's like the deluxe, artist's series, relic's etc. and I Don't care to see the lower end models made in other countries, but Fender has the right to produce their products as they see the need by giving consumers a wide variety to choose from. On the flip side, this is what makes American made instruments retain and increase in value.

Well, your history is off. CBS sold Fender to FMIC in 1985. The company that bought Fender was a consortium of then-current Fender executives headed by Bill Schultz, several prominent musicians (Tommy Tedesco, the studio guitarist was one), and financial backers. The point is that Bill Schultz et. al. were the ones CBS hired around 1979 to turn the company around. They were the ones responsible for the Vintage Series, designing real bass amps instead of stripped down guitar amps, etc.

And Fender started using Japanese made instruments in the early '80s to meet price competition from very very well made instruments by Ibanez (Fuji-Gen-Gaki made both the Ibanez and the original MIJ Squiers), Yamaha, etc. The early Squiers were very well made instruments at an attractive price point that US made instruments couldn't reach for the most part.

When CBS sold Fender to FMIC in '85, the sale did NOT include any real estate. It was only a sale of the rights, patents, copyrights, WIP (works in progress), and some machinery. So, for the first couple of years of FMIC's existence, they had to rely on off-shore manufacturing as they built a new factory and started building instruments. The focus in the late '80s was getting Fender guitars going because they would sell a LOT more guitars than basses.

The plethora of models is due to the company's desire to cover all ranges. In the past Fender would have ceded the beginner market to other companies (while the Musicmaster was decent, it was expensive compared to some other options at the time). Now they want to have their name, logo, and designs available to all levels. Plus they don't see why Schecter, Lakland, Sadowsky, Ibanez, etc. should give the customers what they want while FMIC sits still. If people want an good reproduction of a 1975 Jazz bass, and others want a 5-string Precision, and others want a Jazz bass with a beefier bridge and active electronics, why can't they get it with a Fender name?

And I stand by my assertion that the mid to late '70s were NOT the best. While the did indeed make a lot of great instruments then, the ratio of Great to medicore was too far into the mediocre side. That's the very reason Ibanez, Yamaha, etc. were so succesful. They were building instruments that were as good or better assembled than the "industry leader". It wasn't just price, but the instruments CBS/Fender was turning out before 1981 were too often merely average, but priced as the best.

Again, if you're looking for an instrument to play, then judge each one as an individual instrument and ignore who made it where or when. If you're looking to invest for some relatively dubious "collector" value, then again (given the fraud in the market) judge each one individually.

John
 
Again, if you're looking for an instrument to play, then judge each one as an individual instrument and ignore who made it where or when. If you're looking to invest for some relatively dubious "collector" value, then again (given the fraud in the market) judge each one individually.

John

To the poster who said 2000-2008 era wasn't real good, I have 2002 Precision that I think is a fine bass. I bought it new and the fit, finish, tone & playability are very good. I have no regrets and enjoy the feel, vibe & sound of this bass everytime I get a few minutes to play it. it's mymain bas and kills on the gig every time.

I found it after running a rack of MIA Precisions at 2 different GC's. Believe me, in 2002, that's a lot of Precisions...both USA & foreign made. When I plugged in & played this one I have now, it stood out exceptionally.
 
I have played Fenders from most eras... OK, I haven't played many pre-CBS basses, but the one I have and the few others I've tried were amazing!

Sure, there were hit and misses in every decade, and the 70's seems to have a bad reputation. But two of my vey best Fender basses are a 72 Jazz and 79 P. I had quite a few other late 70's that weren't so good, though, so the 70's were not 'all good', IMO/E.

I don't have a lot of experience with 80's basses, but it also seemed like a bad period for Fender as the Japanese made Fenders and Squiers appears to be just as good or even better in some peoples opinion. As I said, I don't have any US Fender from the 80's, but I have had a few JV Squiers (82-83), which were great! (I actually have a MIA 83 Jazz coming in, so soon I will know more about this)

My first 'real' bass was a 75 RI MIJ from 1996, and that was also a great bass. I have never owned a MIA 90's Fender.

00-07... I have no idea. These years were my 'Celinder Only' period :-)

08 seems to be a tuning point fo Fender in many TB'ers opinion, so I actually got a 08 Jazz to check them out. Nice bass, but nothing special IMO. It doesn't match any of my 60's or 70's Fenders.
 
I had a 2001 american jazz, it wasn't even worth half the money I paid for it. I ended up changing all the parts for aftermarket parts. What a difference, now I love the thing.

I expect a 2010 mexican jazz would have more soul than my 2001 american.
In fact, I kinda want a mexican P bass.
 
People just make me lol over this S-1 switch deal. I have one, and I've never gotten anything but the highest compliments about the bass - looks, playability...oh an uh, without the switch engaged it's just a normal Precision pickup doing it's thing.

Like that little switch somehow makes other components like the neck, finish, or setup bad. What a joke. I'll put my S-1 equiped Fender up against any other era Fender. It is a wonderful instrument.
 
Just avoid the ones that you don't like.

I've had literally hundreds over the years. Honestly, one of the worst that I ever had was my first Fender--a 1965 Jazz that I bought new (had to trade in my Harmony H22). It soured me on J-basses for a long time. I've come back to the J-basses now, though. One of my best playing (& sounding) is a '77 that I picked up a couple of years ago. It is very lightweight compared to others that I have played from that era. (By far, the heaviest bass of any type that I have ever held was also from that era--if it turned out to be 20 lbs, I would not have been surprised).

If it feels good and plays well in all positions on the neck, then I say go for it. As far as sound--that's a matter for your own ears, but it's hard to beat a nice, passive, J or P bass circuit.
 
Fender make good basses but at some points in time, their instruments were agreeably-worse. As an example, the 2003-2007 "S-1" models are quite frankly poop.

What other years were generally bad for Fender basses?

I see flame's on the horizon... :rolleyes:

I would avoid what many call the "Worst of the CBS years" - 1974 to about 1980.

That doesn't mean that some of the instruments made in that period aren't good - but it does mean that many were AWFUL. Quality control at Fender was bad, corners were being cut and, because of some odd trends of the time, instruments were often heavy as hell.

The real thing here is PLAY BEFORE YOU PAY. If you actually sit and dispassionately play a 1977 J bass and still like it, then great - it will be too expensive, but if you got the cash, buy it. But don't even think of buying without test driving. Fender was WILDLY inconsistent at that time.

:hiding:

Here comes the flames (Folks are *so* defensive of their gear!)
:rolleyes:
 
I have to agree with sevenyearsdown. I have an '07 Jazz that is just excellent, S-1 or not. To me it's a solid, reliable, great-sounding "working-mans" instrument. It's not a Fodera, sure, but it's one of the best Fenders I've owned since 1966.

sterling4
 
2 questions what the deal with the s-1 switch?
and corona ca factory is that a ower quality facitlty as opposed to another us factory and is there one?

dude

A. The S-1 switch was a series/parallel switch built into the volume pot of the Precision and Jazz Bass. The idea of a series/parallel switch is pretty useful (in my opinion) on the Precision coils of a P/J bass, but much less useful on a stock P. Could be hip on a Jazz, but I'm not much of a Jazz bass player. The problem in my estimation was not that it had a series/parallel switch (you don't have to use it), but that the particular mechanical switching they used was prone to problems. It was a push-push switch built into the face of the volume knob. It required both a special proprietary pot AND a special knob. And the five I played in local stores all had mechanical problems (possibly based on the plethora of rubbing compound Fender seems to think is alright to leave in control cavities).

B. Corona is the factory FMIC built after they bought Fender from CBS in 1985. Before 1985, all US Fender solid bodies were built in Fullterton, California. After '85 they were built in Corona. In many objective respects, Corona has had higher quality than Fullerton, but again, you gotta look at specific instruments. The Fullerton-era Vintage Series (commonly called "reissues", but there was a short-lived MIJ series called the "Reissue Series"*​) are held in pretty high esteem compared to other Vintage series instruments. While the Corona VS is more correct to the specific years (e.g. the 12th fret dots are the correct spacing while the early VS made in Corona have a wider spacing at the 12th fret), the fit and finish, fret work, sound, and feel of Fullerton era VS is pretty consistently higher. Note that at the time, Fender did NOT have a custom shop, and a lot of the time and effort that's now expended on Custom Shop instruments was lavished on the Vintage Series in Fullerton. However, in my opinion, this comparison of Fullerton to Corona only applies to the VS, not a blanket comparison across the line.

*​The MIJ "Reissue Series" were simply the "Standard Series" of the time with minor cosmetic changes to LOOK like early instruments. They had poly finishes, cheaper tuning machines, vintage-style hardware. But they also had bar-magnet pickups, really cheap and crappy switches and pots, and had no body nor neck contours that were similar to the originals. They were an early and pretty poorly executed version of what became the later and much much better "Classic Series". The Reissue Series were only in the catalog for about a year around 1990.

John
 
I have a 85 P and the Geddy Lee signature (the first series) and they are amazing. Im not just saying tha because of the Fender legacy and all the good (and bad) things about them. I like the way they look, feel, and sound. I tried out a few basses that I was planning on buying but, they just didnt feel right. As a multi-genre musicican, Ive came to the conclution that Fenders can suit everything. \m/
 
This is a huge area of disagreement, always has been, and always will be. I'm one of the ones who find the market value of mid '70s Fender products to be far in excess of what most of the instruments seem to have as intrinsic value. John

Agreed.

I auditioned a "Vintage" 1977 Fender Precision at a local shop, last week.

Guy is asking over $1,400.00 for it. The neck (despite quite a bowm in it), actually plays beautifully. The body and electronics on the other hand, were trashed and terrible. Yet this guy wanted what he wanted for it. He didn't get it from me, that's for sure.