Unsurprising to admit, but I prefer to rake. The main reason for this is tone. But the other reason is that SA picking is uncomfortable. This is hard to explain: we are talking about free stroke plucking as opposed to rest strokes, correct? in order to do that, I find my hand curves more, pushing my hand further away along with my thumb, which i anchor. This makes muting exceptionally difficult and bends the wrist more. This is not as comfortable as how I play using raking.
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Fingers getting caught
- Thread starter wishface
- Start date
I am talking about rest strokes. This is coming from a place to the side of bass guitar, but I learned classical guitar before and during and cross over some of the techniques. Your problem reminds me of issues I had playing descending scales. The solution was to practice right hand alternating.
If I was playing a pattern that ended with the index plucking the G string and moved to the D string, I pluck it with the middle finger.
1) The index finger plucks the G string and rests against the D string. When I pluck the string it is with the tip of my finger near the nail. My plucking motion is a combination of pushing down as much as it is pulling the string. When it rests it rests halfway along the pad in a different place than where I pluck from.
2) As my index finger goes into the resting position, my middle finger gets in position to pluck similar to the the index finger in step 1.
3) The middle finger plucks as the index finger relaxes off the string. I don't think I pull it away. I just stop flexing to pluck and it relaxes off the string so the middle finger can pluck.
The problem with raking quickly becomes the fact that where the rest strokes lands on the next string it is not in the normal plucking position so the hand tightens to get through it.
The solution would have to either be to adjust where the rest strokes lands on the next string so that it is ready to pluck or to alternate fingers. I think that ramps and playing over the pickup are trying to achieve the first. The problem I have with it at this point is that plucking across like that instead of downward loses some of the apoyando tone.
Alternating does feel awkward when you first try it. I wish I could go back to when I raked and film me playing scales before and after switching to alternating. I could play fluidly ascending, but descending would sound like a pause everyone I switched strings. After a month, it was gone. Before that no matter how hard I tried, I couldn't get fluid speed up and down.
A lot of guitar exercises exist for it, but the main one I started doing was practicing the Segovia scales.
It was just an idea anyway. Thanks for humoring me.
You need to slow down as much as it takes to play in clean and no stuck fingers. Do you know what your bpm speed is to play it good?
Sure, no problem.
But if you're using rest strokes, wouldn't it be easier to rake? It follows directly from resting the finger on the adjacent string. To have to lift the finger off and use the alternate seems less efficient, on paper at least.
Are there advantages to that I'm not seeing?
Raking eliminates many of the intricacies and nuances of the alternating approach, be that apoyando or tirando.
Sonority, or tone, is a function of plucking angle, finger speed, pressure and other variables. In an alternating technique, each of these can be controlled or applied discretely for each note.
Now consider the rake. To play at a given tempo, a single finger has to get from one string to the next in a single movement over a fixed time that will be a simple fraction of the tempo. To arrive at the next note on time it needs to be moving at a given speed. To do that you change the pressure and angle of attack. But these all affect tone, articulation, dynamics, etc. So now the tempo, not the desired quality of the note, is dictating tone. If just playing as fast as you can with no concern for the note quality is the aim, then rake away, but...
Rest strokes = apoyando. But the same remains true for free strokes.
Let's see. You asked if raking is more efficient than alternating with rest strokes, given your reasoning that in the rest stroke the finger is already resting on the string you want to play next. My point is that resting on the string is not the starting point for the next note. Your reasoning is flawed.
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That is exactly what I was also saying. Raking seems like the efficient way to play until you realize the resting position is not the ideal stroke position. Raking ends up more like a hybrid rest stroke/strum.
Also, there is just no way playing with one finger is more efficient than playing with two. If I pluck the G string with my index finger then pluck the D string with my index finger; The fact that my index finger touched the D string doesn't make it ready to play. Even if you want to play the index finger on both, you have to reposition your finger in between.
Lots of people rake. I was pointing this out because I played like that and would get hung up on descending patterns as I switched strings and this worked for me.
I don't think this discussion is served by a tangent into raking vs alternate. Both methods are valid and come down to preference as there are players on both sides (and both) who are capable and respeceted for their technique
That is not my intent. Like Billy Sheehan says when he explains his technique: if you are playing the notes that you want to how you want to and the audience gets it, then keep doing that.
You said your fingers were getting caught. I had this problem until I started alternate plucking instead of raking when playing fast descending licks. I made the suggestion since it helped me, but I'm not hurt if you don't use it.
If I had to guess whether or not alternating might help, it would be that when you play an ascending scale it sounds perfect, but when you play the descending version it sounds uneven tempo.
Everyone is slightly different so what works for you may not be the same as worked for me.
...because it is technically and musically sound.
I don't see it as a tangent, but key to helping you solve the problems apparent in the video you posted.
You asked about the relative merits of each, which is a very reasonable question. You have received a lot of good advice and information from people with a lot more practical experience, knowledge and training than you have, in some cases to a standard that people would pay good money for. It might be worth spending a little time reading and absorbing those responses - you might just find something useful...
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I was just watching your video again in slow motion. The only other thing that I see is when you switch strings, your hand moves perpendicular to the strings back and forth in a straight line. You might consider giving the movement a little of an arc using where your arm rests on the body like a pivot instead of sliding back and forth.
Just one more suggestion before I take a back seat. Try playing the exercise with only one semi-quaver per pitch instead of 2. Same tempo, but ascend and descend in one measure of 3/4 instead of 2.
Sure, i'm not against either technique. I just didn't want to get into a discussion that's as old as time. Some people rake, like Billy, some don't.
But like I've said before, this isn't an issue i've had until switching instruments, and I've always raked.
I doubt it. Just to re-calibrate those of us trying to help, why not post a video of the same exercise played flawlessly on the other instrument, just so we know that it's the new bass and not your technique that's the problem?
