Flats -darkest to brightest list

[markjazzbassist]

i can never really tell what the flats are doing, because i end up comparing them to my super dark voiced rw board 83 L2000 with long in the tooth dunlop nickel rounds

kinda experimenting with the new gold package dunlop flats the last week or so
not as stiff as the rotos on my vintage nordstrand loaded bullet bass
more even than the alleva coppolo flats by la bella on my sb-2, which can have a booming E if not addressed with the eq

not sure how dark the dunlops are going to get yet, but they seem to be a nice match with the g&l lynx for getting a very even and warm piano like tone and preserving what's left of the original frets remaining

never tried the alleva coppolo flats, how do they sound? similar to others? tensions?

 

[mpdd]

never tried the alleva coppolo flats, how do they sound? similar to others? tensions?

they sound like they are from another era if you use them with old school basses and they are really easy to play
the e string booty boom is kinda cool, because you can dial it in and out with your eq
i use them on an really hi output passive g&l sb-2 to get a dark, clear, and cutting tone that is warm and punchy without sounding too retro or historical
jimmy insists that they were designed to sound like recordings from the 50s and 60s, but i wouldn't know, because i use them on a more contemporary hi fi almost active sounding bass

 

[Johnny Mac]

Question for the balanced-tension folks: if you wanted to do balanced tension on a six-string bass with flatwounds, what strings would you go with? (Tuned a step down as well, in case it matters).

I'm looking at options and the only one I can find with gauges that would seem to work is TI - maybe the Ernie Ball's, but the .32 C might be a bit too tight. I've been told it's possible with Chromes but you need to use a guitar Chrome for the high string, which means the tuning key needs to be close enough to the fretboard for it to work (does anyone have a length measurement on that?).

I'd spring for the TI's (especially if the midrange is as advertised), but I'm going to be downtuning and I don't like this talk of low tension, especially when they'll be going on a 34" scale bass.

 

[markjazzbassist]

Revisions

DARK
Pyramid - Fast Decay, lots of bass and mids, light top end. very "old school" sounding. medium tension. They'll thump (come out the box broken in).
GHS precision - very well balanced, decent bass mids and treble, Low/medium tension, just again a balanced string. They'll thump (take 3 months break in to sound good).
Ernie Ball - well balanced and similar to GHS but high tension. They'll thump (break in is quick)
Labella - good bass and treble, scooped mids. low/medium tension. They'll thump (break in is quick)
Optima RB - good bass and treble, slightly scooped mids, low/medium tension. maxima reproduction supposedly. They'll thump.
DR - Similar to GHS overall that they are well balanced, but add more top end. Sound like a flatwound Lo-Rider. They'll thump.
Chromes - Good Bass, scooped mids, accented treble. high tension. They'll thump (after 1 year of playing though)
Rotosound - light bass, decent mids, accented treble. medium tension. More flat grind than thump.
TI - light bass, heavy mids, accented top, woody nuanced sound (the further up the neck the sweeter it sounds). Low Tension. The decay/envelope on these doesn't sound like a flat to me, the low E doesn't die/decay, it stays strong like a roundwound. No thump, very punchy instead.
BRIGHT

 

[Pantone 333]

You too? I totally had the same reaction. I always use this sound as an example of what Labellas sound like to me:



Good for some things, not a string I want to use for everything.

Me as well. I found the Labellas too bright.

 

[shoulderpet]

Revisions

DARK
Pyramid - Fast Decay, lots of bass and mids, light top end. very "old school" sounding. medium tension. They'll thump (come out the box broken in).
GHS precision - very well balanced, decent bass mids and treble, Low/medium tension, just again a balanced string. They'll thump (take 3 months break in to sound good).
Ernie Ball - well balanced and similar to GHS but high tension. They'll thump (break in is quick)
Labella - good bass and treble, scooped mids. low/medium tension. They'll thump (break in is quick)
Optima RB - good bass and treble, slightly scooped mids, low/medium tension. maxima reproduction supposedly. They'll thump.
DR - Similar to GHS overall that they are well balanced, but add more top end. Sound like a flatwound Lo-Rider. They'll thump.
Chromes - Good Bass, scooped mids, accented treble. high tension. They'll thump (after 1 year of playing though)
Rotosound - light bass, decent mids, accented treble. medium tension. More flat grind than thump.
TI - light bass, heavy mids, accented top, woody nuanced sound (the further up the neck the sweeter it sounds). Low Tension. The decay/envelope on these doesn't sound like a flat to me, the low E doesn't die/decay, it stays strong like a roundwound. No thump, very punchy instead.
BRIGHT

Interesting you say that the Rotos are medium tension, most accounts of them seem to suggest they are bridge cables, have avoided them for that reason , I have Ernie Balls 100-45 on my bass at the moment and they seem medium ish tension wise but I tried the 105-50 set for a while and they were definitely much stiffer feeling (too much so)

 

[markjazzbassist]

Interesting you say that the Rotos are medium tension, most accounts of them seem to suggest they are bridge cables, have avoided them for that reason , I have Ernie Balls 100-45 on my bass at the moment and they seem medium ish tension wise but I tried the 105-50 set for a while and they were definitely much stiffer feeling (too much so)

i'm talking about comparing strings same size to same size. chromes and ernie balls 45-100 are medium tension, but go for that 50-105 and bridge cables.

 

[fourlow]

Revisions

DARK
Pyramid - Fast Decay, lots of bass and mids, light top end. very "old school" sounding. medium tension. They'll thump (come out the box broken in).
GHS precision - very well balanced, decent bass mids and treble, Low/medium tension, just again a balanced string. They'll thump (take 3 months break in to sound good).
Ernie Ball - well balanced and similar to GHS but high tension. They'll thump (break in is quick)
Labella - good bass and treble, scooped mids. low/medium tension. They'll thump (break in is quick)
Optima RB - good bass and treble, slightly scooped mids, low/medium tension. maxima reproduction supposedly. They'll thump.
DR - Similar to GHS overall that they are well balanced, but add more top end. Sound like a flatwound Lo-Rider. They'll thump.
Chromes - Good Bass, scooped mids, accented treble. high tension. They'll thump (after 1 year of playing though)
Rotosound - light bass, decent mids, accented treble. medium tension. More flat grind than thump.
TI - light bass, heavy mids, accented top, woody nuanced sound (the further up the neck the sweeter it sounds). Low Tension. The decay/envelope on these doesn't sound like a flat to me, the low E doesn't die/decay, it stays strong like a roundwound. No thump, very punchy instead.
BRIGHT

some of the best descriptions I have heard, pure gold in this post!

I have flats on almost all of my basses, I dig the feel and vibe and the way they make me play. I also find that the bass they are on is really key to getting the best from the strings in combo with the instrument... some just fit each other better than others... so below I attempted to list the stings I have experience with from Dark to Bright and the basses they live on that have jived the best. Also probably worth mentioning is that all of the below basses are passive. Grain of salt as this is, of course quite subjective and as they say.... YMMV!

DARK
Labella 760FS - P-bass -THUMP
Labella 760FX - Single coil P-bass -THUMP with a bit more highs and a more even playing feel.
Fender 9050SL - Single coil P-bass -THUMP with More Midrange. high-ish tension.
Chromes ECB81 - Fretless P-bass type/ebony board (Dimarzio Model P's) Lots of highs and lows, take forever to calm down. high-ish tension. I always roll the tone down with these strings.
TI Jazz Flats - Rickenbacker 4003 - woody, organic, balanced, midrangy, not super bass-y or boomy, highs are there if you want them. lowest tension.... I have to back off on my normal attack but it is totally worth it.
Cobalts 2813 - Fretless/ebony board (humbucker)
Cobalts 2815 - Jazz Bass (Dimarzio Model J's)
LIGHT

Cobalts are easily far and away the brightest flat I have used and I love them, they can wear many hats and can be almost round-like minus the finger noise. Very even tension, clean tones, balanced low/high/mid but very forward sounding. I feel like I could rock these in any setting any style. I really like these. In the future I will be trying a set on the Ric for sure, I think that would be a really good match.

If I had to choose only 3 it would easily be the Fenders, 760FX's and the 2815 Cobalts to cover a range of sounds on any bass I own.

2 cents for the masses....

 

[MaHei]

Question for the balanced-tension folks: if you wanted to do balanced tension on a six-string bass with flatwounds, what strings would you go with? (Tuned a step down as well, in case it matters).

I'm looking at options and the only one I can find with gauges that would seem to work is TI - maybe the Ernie Ball's, but the .32 C might be a bit too tight. I've been told it's possible with Chromes but you need to use a guitar Chrome for the high string, which means the tuning key needs to be close enough to the fretboard for it to work (does anyone have a length measurement on that?).

To extend a five-string set of balanced Chromes, a single TI high C works very well, if you can live with different coloured silks.

 

[markjazzbassist]

To extend a five-string set of balanced Chromes, a single TI high C works very well, if you can live with different coloured silks.

GHS precision flats

.28 .40 .55 .75 .100, .126

34.5-39 on tension, similar to TI.

 

[HaphAsSard]

I've been told it's possible with Chromes but you need to use a guitar Chrome for the high string, which means the tuning key needs to be close enough to the fretboard for it to work (does anyone have a length measurement on that?).

IME guitar Chromes are wound to 38". In other words, unless the bass has 6 in-line tuners (do they even make them that way?), or is a 35er plus obligatory string-through loading, I'm pretty sure it will fit.

 

[Johnny Mac]

GHS precision flats

.28 .40 .55 .75 .100, .126

34.5-39 on tension, similar to TI.

I'm going to be downtuning so I might need something with higher tension than this.

But, in looking at those, I think a 32 C from Ernie Ball might not be too unbalanced.

IME guitar Chromes are wound to 38". In other words, unless the bass has 6 in-line tuners (do they even make them that way?), or is a 35er plus obligatory string-through loading, I'm pretty sure it will fit.

The bass being built is a 34" scale and won't be inline. Already told him to go with EB's but this is good info for the future.

Thanks to both of you for your help!

 

[markjazzbassist]

I'm going to be downtuning so I might need something with higher tension than this.

But, in looking at those, I think a 32 C from Ernie Ball might not be too unbalanced.


The bass being built is a 34" scale and won't be inline. Already told him to go with EB's but this is good info for the future.

Thanks to both of you for your help!

i downtune with that set (in 4 string) and have downtuned with TI no problems. Just play with a lighter touch and use dynamics.

 

[madjazzbass]

Wow! All of this can be a bit confusing for someone with zero experience with flats; all I wanna know is which set stays the most consistant from new to old and that are not too stiff and ?rigid. and I am aware that they all will sound different after they're broken in. If this sounds a bit ridiculous, then ... oh well, sorry

 

[shoulderpet]

Wow! All of this can be a bit confusing for someone with zero experience with flats; all I wanna know is which set stays the most consistant from new to old and that are not too stiff and ?rigid. and I am aware that they all will sound different after they're broken in. If this sounds a bit ridiculous, then ... oh well, sorry

Most flats come in a variety of gauges so you should be able to find a set that is not too stiff even with strings like chromes that are renowned for being stiff (they come in a 95-40 gauge)

 

[e-flat]

Wow! All of this can be a bit confusing for someone with zero experience with flats; all I wanna know is which set stays the most consistant from new to old and that are not too stiff and ?rigid. and I am aware that they all will sound different after they're broken in. If this sounds a bit ridiculous, then ... oh well, sorry

In my experience:
Most consistent (tonally and tension) from new to old: GHS Precision 3025 (.045-.095)
They start off sounding warm and feeling pliable without being too "rubbery". They generally stay that way & just get better. Most other flats I've had go through more of a transition over time, but the GHS light set is pretty consistent right out of the gate IMO.

 

[madjazzbass]

In my experience:
Most consistent (tonally and tension) from new to old: GHS Precision 3025 (.045-.095)
They start off sounding warm and feeling pliable without being too "rubbery". They generally stay that way & just get better. Most other flats I've had go through more of a transition over time, but the GHS light set is pretty consistent right out of the gate IMO.

Thanks, I'll give 'em a try; Hey, gotta start somewhere right?

 

[e-flat]

Thanks, I'll give 'em a try; Hey, gotta start somewhere right?

GHS P Flats are a great place to start for traditional flats.
If you want bright & growly, the Ernie Ball Cobalt Slinky (40-95) set sound amazing on Jazz basses. They lose a touch of brightness in the first couple weeks but are still clearer and more present than just about any other flats. I have a set on my Jazz and they are tough to beat!

 

[ljazz]

I don't see much in this thread about Sadowsky Flats......

The Black Labels are a lot like LaBellas, but with no thump, less decay, and a touch more mids, especially high mids. Smooth upper mids without getting clacky like Chromes do. I love these on a jazz bass. There is a touch of mid scoop that sounds nice with both pups up, or slightly favoring the neck pup. Medium tension and flexibility.

Blue labels are a very mid-centric flat, like TIJF's. Maybe a touch snappier in the high mids, but a bit less woody in the mid-mids. Definitely more low mids. The lite gauge are low tension, and fairly flexible for a hex cored flat. These sing in the mids, but are more manageable than TIJF's.

Anyone who wants the flat feel, but are think they'll be missing something tonally should give the Sadowsky Flats a try.

On the scale, I'd put the Blues firmly in the middle, with the Blacks a bit brighter.

 

[shoulderpet]

I think the best bet for anyone wanting to try flats but having concerns about the tension is to get a set in 95-40 gauge and try them, at this gauge i am very doubtful that anyone will have issues with high tension, tonally if you don't like the set you have chosen then at least you will have a frame of reference to go by when pinpointing what you don't like about the set and choosing a set you do like