Geezer on Bill Ward...and Bill Responds

Discussion in 'Miscellaneous [BG]' started by FourNotFive, Jan 22, 2016.

  1. FourNotFive

    FourNotFive

    Dec 30, 2011
    Ohio
    This really bums me out:

    GEEZER BUTLER On BILL WARD's Absence From BLACK SABBATH Tour: 'His Health Has To Come First Before Anything'

    In the interview Geezer cites Bill Ward's health and it's impact on his ability to play his parts and keep up with the rigors of touring as the reason he has not been involved in the most recent Sabbath reunion.

    Bill responded via Twitter: "Not the truth Geezer, simply not the truth."

    Ward was on record the last time around stating that he was not offered a "signable contract".

    I have a feeling that there is truth on both sides. The nature of Bill's playing and the demands of a major tour make it believable that he may not be up to the task (especially if the heart issues are factual), but it is also very plausible that they tried to shaft him on his contract.

    Whatever the reality may be it is a shame that Geezer had to publicly call out Bill's inability to play and then gush praises on his replacement. I'm also fairly certain that Ozzy didn't have to prove his vocal chops. He is not exactly firing on all cylinders.

    I am going to see them in a few weeks and I was conflicted when I purchased the tickets last week. Now even more so. I am generally not into the whole reunion thing, but I have always been a huge Sabbath (and Geezer) fan and I have never seen them live. I guess recent events have made some regrets surface. I turned down opportunities to see Bowie in the 80s because he was "past his prime" and ticket prices were "outrageous" at the time. Now that he has passed I would gladly take a time machine back to pay $50 to see him with Alomar / Rojas / etc...

    As a wise man once said, "It's better to regret something that you have done than to regret something that you haven't done." I will try enjoy the show for what it is, but I am not sure if I will regret going more than not going.

    Why can't bands age more like Rush (with dignity and unison) and less like Van Halen (with greed and backstabbing)?
     
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  2. fhm555

    fhm555 So FOS my eyes are brown

    Feb 16, 2011
    Money and/or ego.

    It really is that simple.

    I've seen more than a few old timers who had no business whatever on stage trying to prove they still can.

    IMO THE defining characteristic of rock and roll is youthful angst, without that it's just another bar band pretending to be relevent.

    You get your shot and then you move on.

    Don't get ne wrong, plenty of young rockers mature well and become serious writers, singers, players, but i cringe when i see a bunch of 60~70 year olds phoning in "Start Me Up", or "iron Man" when i know at least 3 local bar bands full of young hungry cats who could slay either tune.
     
  3. blue4

    blue4

    Feb 3, 2013
    St. Louis area
    I don't understand how members of his own band can not understand that Bill Ward's style is special, and a huge part of why that band became special. Even if his health is bad, Ozzy hasn't been able to pull off his parts for at least a decade but allowances are made for him. A person never really has friends in the music business, I guess.
     
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  4. meatwad

    meatwad

    Apr 9, 2008
    Smallville, USA
    I saw the original four in '99, and have thanked the stars a million times for it! Too bad they can't get their stuff together these days, I wouldn't mind seeing them once more.
     
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  5. Killed_by_Death

    Killed_by_Death Snaggletooth Inactive

    I blame Sharon for all of it.
     
  6. 48thStreetCustom

    48thStreetCustom

    Nov 30, 2005
    Colorado
    I'm a Ward fan, sure. But if you're going to replace him, the dude from Rage is a pretty awesome choice. The guy plays heavy as **** and he knows how to push behind giant guitar riffs. The guy is great.
     
  7. fretter

    fretter

    May 24, 2012
    PA
    I thought Ward sounded great on the Reunion cd. When I saw them live, it was a real mammoth sound. The Reunion show was recorded 18 years ago, however (!). The last album, 13, had a groove to it, that Sabbath hasn't displayed since the mid-70s. I think Ward has lost that jazzy groove he once had. I might be in the minority, but I'm glad they brought in a different drummer, from a groove oriented band. I saw them twice in the early 2000s, and that's how I want to remember them.
     
  8. Datsgor

    Datsgor Supporting Member

    Jul 29, 2000
    Go see them. I saw them a couple years ago and the rhythm section is tight and heavy as h**l. The drummer did great justice to Wards parts. The sound production was good and Ozzy was, well.....he was what we all know he sounds like now. But, go see Tony and Geezer before you can't. It's freaking Tony Iommi and Geezer Butler and live is just a whole level up.
     
    FourNotFive likes this.
  9. Killed_by_Death

    Killed_by_Death Snaggletooth Inactive

    We can't use "hell" on here?
     
  10. FourNotFive

    FourNotFive

    Dec 30, 2011
    Ohio
    I'm sure they guy they got can play (not the guy from Rage on tour), but I agree that Bill is special and was a big part of their sound. As Datsgor said it is pretty much down to seeing Tony and Geezer while I can.
     
  11. FourNotFive

    FourNotFive

    Dec 30, 2011
    Ohio
    Guess we can. Whch reminds me that I should have gone to see Heaven and Hell a few years back too...but at least I did see Dio in the 80s.
     
  12. Basshappi

    Basshappi

    Feb 12, 2007
    Tucson,AZ
    So do I.
     
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  13. rufus.K

    rufus.K

    Oct 18, 2015
    SoCal
    I saw them in the early 90s with Dio and Vinnie Appice. Just awesome.
    The whole signal contract thing cones down to a personal dispute, royalty entittlement, and public apologies that just aren't gonna happen.
    Geezer was trying to be diplomatic with that statement, but Ward wants his side heard.
     
  14. buldog5151bass

    buldog5151bass Kibble, milkbones, and P Basses. And redheads.

    Oct 22, 2003
    Connecticut
    Ward isn't the frontman. Likely 2/3 of the people buying tickets couldn't tell the difference. Ozzy didn't have great vocal chops a generation ago, but people will go to see him. It's as simple as that.
     
  15. She has screwed a lot of folks over throughout the years. Bummer we allow her to prance around on TV while his bands never got paid. You know they had the money and just wanted to be vindictive and greedy.
     
  16. Killed_by_Death

    Killed_by_Death Snaggletooth Inactive

    Zakk Wylde doesn't seem to be upset about it. He still calls her Mom. I think he said something along the lines of, "That's just the music business!".
     
  17. Killed_by_Death

    Killed_by_Death Snaggletooth Inactive

    Misfit Wookiee and MarkoYYZ like this.
  18. biguglyman

    biguglyman

    Jul 27, 2017
    Pownal, ME
    Saw them back in the [email protected] or 1977. Great show. Spectrum in Philadelphia with Ted Nugent. Promoter decided they needed an opening act so they brought in Mothers Finest. Great white funk band from that era. Unfortunately the Nugent crowd wasn't having any of it and started throwing their JD bottles about halfway through the third or fourth song. They walked off in disgust. Unfortunate as they were very good...just not right for the crowd.
     
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  19. -Asdfgh-

    -Asdfgh-

    Apr 13, 2010
    UK
    Jumping in late, but the penalties for not honouring gig commitments can be quite onerous, and often promoters push these to the band, and this can often be because a promoter cannot take the financial hit that its contracts with venues represent. If you have a band member that may not be able to do a full tour then the other band members may seek to isolate themselves from the financial implications, which might lead to that member being advised not to sign the contract due to level if risk they are themselves exposed to.
     
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  20. Aberdumbie

    Aberdumbie

    Jan 22, 2016
    South Carolina
    I saw them in the 70’s too. Boston opened for them. That was a lopsided ticket..... BUT.... I wanted to let you know Mothers Finest is still original. Still rocking their arses off and can be seen regularly in the southeast. They are certainly aging gracefully as a group. And their bass player, Wyzard is as solid and awesome as any out there. He is why I love em.
     
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