Genz-Benz Streamliner Part 5

[Tunaman]

Great info to know!

Yeah its funny to think the crowd will hear Shuttlemax & not Streamliner pre-EQ, but most of my gigs are pre-EQ per soundman request. These are crappy gigs so I'm sure the pros have more say with their soundman.

 

[Jazzdogg]

There are two good contrasts between your comment and Ed's I think. I don't want to feed speculation myself either, and ultimately I do believe one should try something, use their ears, and gauge reality for themselves as Ed suggests. While I believe in that completely, I also think that information itself is never a bad thing as long as the counterpoints are included, and if someone takes well-rounded info and misuses it, then it is at their own peril. The two ideas will server as a reminder for me for now.

For my part, I've readily admitted that the information I gave is amateurish at best, and could be used to mislead folks unintentionally into forming opinions that aren't valid. I've strongly urged everyone to look at the graphs, then put them aside in favor of their ears. My real intent in the graphs are for folks who already have these heads, so that they can see what making some EQ adjustments might do to help them get where they want to be. Anyone who already has a Streamliner understands it's "feel" I would hope, so the graphs are just another way to view what they are already hearing.

KUDOS! I find your posting of graphs and accompanying text helpful and informative, and your disclosures forthright and well suited to the task at hand.

I am opposed to withholding information from credible sources on the basis that some may not understand it.

 

[faulknersj]

It makes it easy to manage for the sound man. I have always been told by soundmen that they love the DI on GB heads.

 

[KsPiNeSh]

Yeah its funny to think the crowd will hear Shuttlemax & not Streamliner pre-EQ, but most of my gigs are pre-EQ per soundman request. These are crappy gigs so I'm sure the pros have more say with their soundman.

So...just go post-EQ. Are they going to know the difference? I don't do any drastic EQing, but my soundmen never complain

 

[12bass]

My point and concern is that the more broad the vertical axis becomes, the more the response "curves" begin to look like "lines," and even very different sounding heads start to look very similar (thereby making such response plots much less useful, and potentially misleading, IMHO).

Even more misleading is making the axis range so restricted that very small differences look huge.

IMO, Eublet choose a reasonable scale, given what he intended to show. I don't think his plots are misleading, nor do I think that a smaller vertical scale which shows more "bumps" would be misleading, at least if the reader understands what they are reading (i.e. they look at the size of the units used in the plot). I agree with Tom that if you choose a large enough vertical scale, all amps look flatter than they are in reality, and that this would provide some sort of aesthetic advantage for those who think that flat response is good... but low resolution of actual visual data for comparison.

Are such plots an accurate representation of the sound of a given amp? Somewhat.... as they show static frequency response, yet fail to show other factors like various distortions, phase, and dynamic response. So, while useful, such information is still incomplete. Still, I'd rather have amplifier response plots for comparison, even if they aren't perfect.

 

[Scott McArron]

So...just go post-EQ. Are they going to know the difference? I don't do any drastic EQing, but my soundmen never complain

Ditto. When I mention Pre- or Post-EQ, they usually make a funny look and then shrug their shoulders. And these are big clubs and casinos.

 

[Tunaman]

So...just go post-EQ. Are they going to know the difference? I don't do any drastic EQing, but my soundmen never complain

Its great to have the option of SS pre-EQ or Tube post EQ! I love it!

 

[zippydog]

So far...way good!

Only a few hours with it in the house so far. Some time with Berg HT112ER, more time under headphones (pre out). Tomorrow, I'll try it with HS210 and a live gig Sunday. Damn, this is one special amp! Really fun to twiddle with EQ - while I can get a wide range of tones, its awfully hard to dial in a bad one.

 

[faulknersj]

Congrats zippydog!

 

[Tunaman]

NOISY BUZZ & 60 hz HUM UPDATE!

It came back! For some reason my Sterling HH is VERY sensitive to the laptop I use to play my music with. Now I've been doing this for months with my PHA-1 with no noise but with the Genz its loud as hell.

I got up & walked away from the laptop & amp, turned the bass away & the noise disappeared. I come back & it returns. I also noticed if I cut the bass to 9 & put my treble at noon I have less noise.
So YES there is a lot of noise with the SL but its dependent on the electronics around. Get your cell & laptop away, try to distance from the amp a bit.

 

[Eublet]

Direct Out Review... about time

Shootout vs the Eden Navigator PRE-EQ !!

Verdict: Sounds the same! DUH! The SL900 is a little quieter noise wise & a little hotter ALTHOUGH with the Eden the direct output volume is in play unlike the SL.

Tone: Only 1/6 of the "tubes" are in play (1/2 of 1 of the 3 tubes) is Pre-EQ
That makes the tone very solid state like & almost identical to the Eden which I believe is the same 1/2 of 1 tube pre-EQ... regardless the tone from the DI is VERY different than what would come out of your cab with the EQ at noon.

If fact, it would take EXTREME EQ changes to get a matching cab and DI tone. We're talking bass below 9, mids at 2.5K & boosted & treble up (Of course the rest would depend on your cabs) but this is where you would start. Just remember what you hear on stage is going to be very different than whats going out the direct... with the Streamliner EQ near Flat The Direct out is MUCH more of a "Shuttlemax" tone than a Streamliner tone. I'd imagine the Shuttlemax flat would represent the direct out tone of the Streamliner.

Does that bother me? No... Its great to have but the Shuttlemax PreEQ or Streamliner PostEQ tones. I know where I want my bass EQ to be to sound good to the P.A & then I do my backline to taste. If I need the warmth (My basses don't naturally have) I can go post EQ. Of course my post EQ tone with the Streamliner will be much more warm than the Eden just as it is through the cabs.

Great direct out, quiet is key

I'm a bit confused by your post. Are you saying you're surprised that the pre-EQ is so flat and pristine? This is what I would expect and want, versus the Post-EQ signal which will travel through the preamp section. Can you clarify a bit?

Thanks,

 

[Vic]

NOISY BUZZ & 60 hz HUM UPDATE!

It came back! For some reason my Sterling HH is VERY sensitive to the laptop I use to play my music with. Now I've been doing this for months with my PHA-1 with no noise but with the Genz its loud as hell.

I got up & walked away from the laptop & amp, turned the bass away & the noise disappeared. I come back & it returns. I also noticed if I cut the bass to 9 & put my treble at noon I have less noise.
So YES there is a lot of noise with the SL but its dependent on the electronics around. Get your cell & laptop away, try to distance from the amp a bit.

Also, try unplugging your laptop power supply from the wall. I've found that a LOT of RFI often comes from those crappy little power supplies.

 

[Tunaman]

Also, try unplugging your laptop power supply from the wall. I've found that a LOT of RFI often comes from those crappy little power supplies.

Vic, great call... the power supply block was the loudest thing of all, thanks bro. I got it way out of the way & its better

Eublet: I just wanted to do a DI compare, learn my DI, see what level I put out etc. Pre-EQ is supposed to be clear as many have suggested. I wanted to check and see what settings my bass should be at for the best signal to the house.

Its just really amazing how different pre-EQ tone is from this amp. My other amps flat were really close to the signal the house was getting then I'd EQ to taste, the Streamliner colors your tone so much you pretty much have NO idea what the house is getting unless you know your bass or shut down your cab & just listen to the PA...

 

[Red Planet]

Also, try unplugging your laptop power supply from the wall. I've found that a LOT of RFI often comes from those crappy little power supplies.

Yes that is what it is. It's not the amp. I've experienced this before with many different types of gear and a laptop. It is the crappy power supply for the laptop.

 

[Eublet]

: I just wanted to do a DI compare, learn my DI, see what level I put out etc. Pre-EQ is supposed to be clear as many have suggested. I wanted to check and see what settings my bass should be at for the best signal to the house.

Its just really amazing how different pre-EQ tone is from this amp. My other amps flat were really close to the signal the house was getting then I'd EQ to taste, the Streamliner colors your tone so much you pretty much have NO idea what the house is getting unless you know your bass or shut down your cab & just listen to the PA...

I'm still not following you. The Pre DI on the Streamliner is flat and pristine, much like any DI, or are you talking about Post EQ?

 

[zippydog]

What Jason said...

 

[Tunaman]

I'm still not following you. The Pre DI on the Streamliner is flat and pristine, much like any DI, or are you talking about Post EQ?

Pre-EQ flat & pristine is VERY VERY different than what comes out of your cab, unlike many other SS amps I've used, GK 1001RB, Sansamp RBI, Eden Nav, LMIII etc. I could always use my backline to have an idea of what the house was getting, not so with the Streamliner, its apples & oranges pre EQ direct out vs backline tone.

 

[svtb15]

And it is post tube stage too ,, even in the PRE EQ setting .. so in essence, you have a tube DI.. real nice and sounds great/.

I'm still not following you. The Pre DI on the Streamliner is flat and pristine, much like any DI, or are you talking about Post EQ?

 

[Tunaman]

The more I play this amp the more I like it... I love the way it adds meat to my fast pick playing.
My EQ
Gain 10
Volume 2
Bass 10
Treble 12

Mids change em all the time, love the control of 600 or 2.5K, just perfect amount of hifi with round tube right where you need it.
You can change your sound but not lose the tube tone. I find in other amps I have to boost my mids a bit to get a round sound & whatever I get I get, with the Streamliner you have so much variety of tube warmth.

 

[hasbeen]

Pre-EQ flat & pristine is VERY VERY different than what comes out of your cab, unlike many other SS amps I've used, GK 1001RB, Sansamp RBI, Eden Nav, LMIII etc. I could always use my backline to have an idea of what the house was getting, not so with the Streamliner, its apples & oranges pre EQ direct out vs backline tone.

I think what they're saying, and they're correct, is that a professional level D.I. should leave your signal "pristine".....in olther words, it should NOT shound like what is coming out of your amp cabinet.

Most soundmen want as unadalturated a signal as possible. This is one reason why many soundmen give our DI's great reviews. If though, you want it to sound like the front of your speakers, go "post eq".