Genz Streamliner 600/900 tone control primer

[silky smoove]

Are the stock tunes really that bad?

Not at all. I just had a bad one that was causing a problem with the circuit. If the tube hadn't gone bad, I wouldn't have replaced it.

 

[LoveThatBass]

Apologies for a slight digression but still related to the discussion.

Is it true that when installing new tubes you have to make sure to get zero fingerprints on them? Somebody told me the oil from your fingers would collect heat and cause the glass to crack or shorten the tube life or awaken Godzilla or something.

I am not sure that has ever happened in my many years of handling vacuum tubes, however it is true with Halogen lamps as they get extremely hot.

 

[macribas]

Question: my Streamliner appears to be working fine, just not as loud as it used to be (or as I remember it to be). I find myself having to crank the gain knob up to get decent stage volumes. Is it maybe a tube issue? I don't hear any distorted or weird tones. Thanks!

 

[Texan]

Question: my Streamliner appears to be working fine, just not as loud as it used to be (or as I remember it to be). I find myself having to crank the gain knob up to get decent stage volumes. Is it maybe a tube issue? I don't hear any distorted or weird tones. Thanks!

Check the v1 tube. Mine did the same thing and i noticed the tube was not glowing how it should. I reseated the tube and everything went back to normal.

 

[CL400Peavey]

Question: my Streamliner appears to be working fine, just not as loud as it used to be (or as I remember it to be). I find myself having to crank the gain knob up to get decent stage volumes. Is it maybe a tube issue? I don't hear any distorted or weird tones. Thanks!

There is a gain knob, a gain volume knob, and a master volume knob. Are all the knobs set the same as they were?

 

[macribas]

Check the v1 tube. Mine did the same thing and i noticed the tube was not glowing how it should. I reseated the tube and everything went back to normal.

Thanks Clay, will look into that. Where can I find the stock tubes? With Genz only? What about similar replacements?

There is a gain knob, a gain volume knob, and a master volume knob. Are all the knobs set the same as they were?

Well, yeah, I play with the knobs quite a bit, depending on the gig, the cab, the bass and the set list. On this case, my reference for "loudness" is when I have the master and the volume full on, and the gain set at 9 o'clock. That can be loud enough for most gigs. Recently I found myself having to bring the gain up to 3 o'clock to get me to that volume. That with the same cab and bass I was used to gig before.

 

[Texan]

Thanks Clay, will look into that. Where can I find the stock tubes? With Genz only? What about similar replacements?

Well, yeah, I play with the knobs quite a bit, depending on the gig, the cab, the bass and the set list. On this case, my reference for "loudness" is when I have the master and the volume full on, and the gain set at 9 o'clock. That can be loud enough for most gigs. Recently I found myself having to bring the gain up to 3 o'clock to get me to that volume. That with the same cab and bass I was used to gig before.

Marcel,
The v1 is an ecc83s JJ tube which you can get from Eurotubes. Any 12ax7 will work, but if you like the stock sound make sure you get a high gain tube.

 

[agedhorse]

Marcel,
The v1 is an ecc83s JJ tube which you can get from Eurotubes. Any 12ax7 will work, but if you like the stock sound make sure you get a high gain tube.

Note that the stock tube isn't selected for high gain, it's selected for low noise and microphonics. We found the JJ ECC83 to be a good choice overall for V1.

 

[Texan]

Note that the stock tube isn't selected for high gain, it's selected for low noise and microphonics. We found the JJ ECC83 to be a good choice overall for V1.

Good to know.

 

[macribas]

Note that the stock tube isn't selected for high gain, it's selected for low noise and microphonics. We found the JJ ECC83 to be a good choice overall for V1.

Cool, thanks for the info.
Coming from a near complete ignorance on tubes, and at the risk of asking old questions...
I popped the top up on my Streamliner and because of the blue LEDs could not really tell the glow of all the tubes themselves.
Do all tubes need to noticeably glow at all times? Or does the glow change depending on the gain you set?
Assuming V1 is the gain tube, V2 is the bass/treble and V3 is the mid tube, when I look at the amp, they are in that order? V1 to the left, V2 in the middle and V3 to the right?
Thanks!

 

[woolysock]

It can be hard to see the tubes glow and it's not really significant. But they do need to be thoroughly seated.
You are correct, left to right: V1 is the gain tube, V2 is the bass/treble and V3 is the mid tube.
Cheers!

 

[Texan]

It can be hard to see the tubes glow and it's not really significant. But they do need to be thoroughly seated.
You are correct, left to right: V1 is the gain tube, V2 is the bass/treble and V3 is the mid tube.
Cheers!

This brings up an interesting question. Before reseating my tube in V1, you could not see the heaters glow at all. After reseating the tube, the same tube, tje heaters are glowing nicely. Would a bad tube or a bad socket cause this?

 

[woolysock]

I'll defer to the tube gurus on this but would imagine if not properly seated your tube would not get sufficient power to work properly.

You might find this thread useful: http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f15/genz-benz-streamliner-tube-rolling-796088/

 

[agedhorse]

This brings up an interesting question. Before reseating my tube in V1, you could not see the heaters glow at all. After reseating the tube, the same tube, tje heaters are glowing nicely. Would a bad tube or a bad socket cause this?

Possibly.

Sometimes it's hard to see the heaters glow because of the construction of the specific tube, how the heater filament bundle is placed inside the cathode.

 

[Rockin Mike]

Question: my Streamliner appears to be working fine, just not as loud as it used to be (or as I remember it to be). I find myself having to crank the gain knob up to get decent stage volumes. Is it maybe a tube issue? I don't hear any distorted or weird tones. Thanks!

Did you change your EQ at the bass, the amp, or anywhere in the chain? Increasing low frequencies will raise the signal strength, which will drive the next section harder.

I.e. raising the lows on your bass will make its signal hotter going into the amp, raising the lows on the amp (which happens before the power section) will increase the gain going into the power section.

That's my understanding, anyone please correct me if this is wrong.

 

[bassman2]

This is why it gets confusing when you look at all the "favourite settings" listed by various guys over on the main Streamliner thread. With all that interactivity, there's more than one way to skin a cat. For example, a big bump or cut in the lower mids, can be more or less wiped out by the setting of the bass control. Bumping the Gain knob to 3 o'clock rolls off some treble, and the treble response varies depending on how hard you're pushing V1 as well, just to further complicate matters.

I didn't find anything that would pass for "surgically flat", but there are some settings that get pretty close. For example, with the mids at 2.5K, try 9.4-2.1-10 bass/mid/treble, gain button out, Gain at noon and Volume at about 1 o'clock.

This has a nice low-end extension (only -1.4dB @ 30Hz), broad peaks of about 2dB @ 130Hz and again between 3 and 4KHz, and a smooth rolloff to about -2dB at 20KHz.

+/- 2dB from 30 to 20,000 Hz would be pretty good for the preamp in any MI amp. Even if it takes some knob-twisting to get there with the Streamliner, IME that level of performance is quite unusual in a bass head, whether we're talking tube, hybrid or SS...

Hey Steve....thought you might like this from the Genz site on the Streamliner......I got a bit of a chuckle after reading all the posts and being the owner of a Streamliner.....

Our simple “streamlined” objective was to build an amp that allows the player to focus more on their playing style and less on adjusting the knobs on their amplifier.

 

[macribas]

Did you change your EQ at the bass, the amp, or anywhere in the chain?

No, I am using the same settings as I used to, it just isn't loud as it used to be. I will try replacing the V1 tube when I have a chance.

 

[Marty Forrer]

Hey Steve....thought you might like this from the Genz site on the Streamliner......I got a bit of a chuckle after reading all the posts and being the owner of a Streamliner.....

Our simple “streamlined” objective was to build an amp that allows the player to focus more on their playing style and less on adjusting the knobs on their amplifier.

I seldom touch the knobs on my Streamliner. I set everything at 12 o'clock with the gain in, then just rolled the bass back a little to get a little clarity. I have done a bunch of gigs now with double bass as well as slab, and seldom touch the knobs.
So for me, their objective has been achieved. In fact this is the first in a very long line of amps that I have owned that actually DOES achieve this objective. Congratulations GenzBenz.
BTW: I get more compliments on my sound now than I ever have before I bought the Streamliner.

 

[Jacob J]

Note that the stock tube isn't selected for high gain, it's selected for low noise and microphonics. We found the JJ ECC83 to be a good choice overall for V1.

Actually, JJ is a company founded and having its seat in my country, which is Slovakia (not Slovenia, that's different country). They are near the city I was born in. It is pretty much the only original thing/product we are exporting to the world and is well known (at least among the musicians) and respected. And it's good to have a part of my homeland in my Streamliner

 

[bassman2]

I seldom touch the knobs on my Streamliner. I set everything at 12 o'clock with the gain in, then just rolled the bass back a little to get a little clarity. I have done a bunch of gigs now with double bass as well as slab, and seldom touch the knobs.
So for me, their objective has been achieved. In fact this is the first in a very long line of amps that I have owned that actually DOES achieve this objective. Congratulations GenzBenz.
BTW: I get more compliments on my sound now than I ever have before I bought the Streamliner.

Well.....glad it works for you....I find the Streamliner's bottom tends to be wooly....probably why most of the guys here have the bass dialed dialed back...I pretty much fall in line using the same settings as the majority of the Streamliner users here....and I use a Genz neox212.... a cab with a good mid focus seems to fit the bill for this head in my opinion....once again....great thread Steve....hope you're enjoying your new GK