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Genz Uber 115?

#82
Meh. I hate to be a downer but my initial excitement is totally gone now. 12 and two 8s sounds like a case of the 50lbs and outperformed by a 3012LF and 6n410 with a mid-heavy crossover. :(

I hope I'm wrong.
 
#88
rpsands said:
Meh. I hate to be a downer but my initial excitement is totally gone now. 12 and two 8s sounds like a case of the 50lbs and outperformed by a 3012LF and 6n410 with a mid-heavy crossover. :(

I hope I'm wrong.
Click to expand...

you may or may not like it. ....its a different animal. There's a lot more to designing a cab though than picking certain speakers based on spec.....and then designing a cab around it. We usually end up customizing the speakers anyway for certain nuances.

Certainly, we want the design to meet certain efficiency specs. but from there, it's a lot of tuning by ear.

Weight?- Ya know......at this point, I don't even know.
 
#89
Mike Shevlin said:
That's 'Genzese' for August/September~
Click to expand...

:D


Usually my hold-up isn't the product...it is getting our sales team in the loop and the necessary marketing support materials together.

It's really just four of us....me, Jeff, Andy and Scott. Designing the product and building it is one thing- doing all the rest of the support, like the fact that the site is down and I didn't know it :hmm:, is another.
 
#90
In the late 90s I had a Carvin cab w/ one 15, two 8s and a tweeter. It sounded great, but w/the built in RL600 amp it weighed 100 pounds. I'm all for exploring new designs. But weight has become a crucial part of the equation for me and I've learned you don't have to sacrifice quality for a lighter load. Good luck w/the design Hasbeen. It's great that your team is looking for ways to push the envelope.
 
#91
#92
Jaco who? said:
According to what you said in the 4x12 thread, you are.
Click to expand...

What does speaker size not determining tone have to do with performance and weight?

I'm making some assumptions here, but if the 12 is the low frequency section of the design, it is likely the cabinet will not be capable of any more bottom end than a 3012LF cabinet (nearly impossible to get more <100hz content out of a 12" speaker with current technology).

If that's the case, the 8s will either give the cabinet a mid-forward tone profile or they will be superfluous if you don't want a mid-forward profile (e.g. too many drivers to achieve the volume you need).

So what I'm saying is it sounds likely that the tone profile will not work for me (since I want low end balanced with mids out of my cabinet) - or if I EQ it to work for me, it'd be using more drivers than I need, so weigh more than I need it to.
 
#93
rpsands said:
What does speaker size not determining tone have to do with performance and weight?

I'm making some assumptions here, but if the 12 is the low frequency section of the design, it is likely the cabinet will not be capable of any more bottom end than a 3012LF cabinet (nearly impossible to get more <100hz content out of a 12" speaker with current technology).

If that's the case, the 8s will either give the cabinet a mid-forward tone profile or they will be superfluous if you don't want a mid-forward profile (e.g. too many drivers to achieve the volume you need).

So what I'm saying is it sounds likely that the tone profile will not work for me (since I want low end balanced with mids out of my cabinet) - or if I EQ it to work for me, it'd be using more drivers than I need, so weigh more than I need it to.
Click to expand...

Sooo, first, you talk of performance (which I largely equate with tone) and weight, then you say you think the "tone profile" will not work for you, even though you haven't heard it yet, but you still offer the unsolicited advice that speaker size does not affect tone to pretty much any thread pertaining to a particular configuration of cab. Sorry to be such a stickler, but if you insist on bit***** and moaning, at least do so with consistency.

I know speaker size doesn't affect tone (or performance) either, but I don't lose any sleep knowing there are others that think it does.
 
#94
Just to keep it fair..and with all due respect... perhaps wait to hear it before saying you don't like it..
It may be right up your alley... makes no sense saying you hate it, as much as saying you love it, without ever seeing it...
just my .02


rpsands said:
What does speaker size not determining tone have to do with performance and weight?

I'm making some assumptions here, but if the 12 is the low frequency section of the design, it is likely the cabinet will not be capable of any more bottom end than a 3012LF cabinet (nearly impossible to get more <100hz content out of a 12" speaker with current technology).

If that's the case, the 8s will either give the cabinet a mid-forward tone profile or they will be superfluous if you don't want a mid-forward profile (e.g. too many drivers to achieve the volume you need).

So what I'm saying is it sounds likely that the tone profile will not work for me (since I want low end balanced with mids out of my cabinet) - or if I EQ it to work for me, it'd be using more drivers than I need, so weigh more than I need it to.
Click to expand...
 
#95
Performance is not necessarily "tone." In fact it rarely is with bass speakers. How much low end (<100-200hz) you can get out of a speaker usually doesn't determine how good the midrange tone is (it can have something to do with it, because often you give up midrange sensitivity for low end sensitivity).

Because you equate tone with performance doesn't mean everyone does. Please don't force your preconceived notions on my words :)

Discussing the tone profile: the common Eminence 12" LF and 8" midrange drivers are a known quantity pretty much. With the current designs, even a single eminence 8" midrange will be more than enough midrange volume to achieve parity with a 3012LF or similar low frequency driver.

So knowing that, combined with what Hasbeen and Agedhorse have said about the tone profile requiring multiple 8" midranges, I can say it is almost a sure thing that the tone profile will be more midrange and less bass. Why? Because you just don't need two 8" mids for a 12" LF driver unless you are doing something freaky special.

Sensitivity is one place where you can make some slight generalizations based on driver size and bandwidth. Sensitivity is not "tone" - frequency response and distortion characteristics are tone.
 
#96
svtb15 said:
Just to keep it fair..and with all due respect... perhaps wait to hear it before saying you don't like it..
It may be right up your alley... makes no sense saying you hate it, as much as saying you love it, without ever seeing it...
just my .02
Click to expand...

With all due respect the designer has already said that the tone profile he is designing for requires two 8" midranges for a single 12" driver. I think that's enough for me to conclude that it will be louder in the mids than bass.

I know without a shadow of a doubt that I have no use for any other cabinets with more mids than bass. Therefore, it's not something I will consider.

I'm not saying it's a bad cabinet or wouldn't work for someone else just fine, but it's not something I'm interested in. Not sure why I have to wait to hear it - I write off cabinets without hearing them all the time based on all kinds of info. And I'm sure you do too :)
 
#99
I think you need to give the cabinet a chance before judging it. Don't get obsessed with specs, which tends to happen far too often. Listen first, then judge.

I trust the viewpoint of a well known manufacturer over anyone, then I test, then I decide. Ive had a few 'problems' taking advice from speaker gurus, and ended up with something that was just plain dull and sterile. Ive been there, done it, never again.

The only REAL judges here are your own ears. I dont own Genz products but I hear that their cabinets are very nice. I wont judge until I try as we all have different tone goals.

You will find that 90% of bassists WONT CARE about what the more detailed specifications say, they will just concentrate on enjoying it and playing the bass itself.
 
#100
Musicman20 said:
I think you need to give the cabinet a chance before judging it. Don't get obsessed with specs, which tends to happen far too often. Listen first, then judge.

I trust the viewpoint of a well known manufacturer over anyone, then I test, then I decide. Ive had a few 'problems' taking advice from speaker gurus, and ended up with something that was just plain dull and sterile. Ive been there, done it, never again.

The only REAL judges here are your own ears. I dont own Genz products but I hear that their cabinets are very nice. I wont judge until I try as we all have different tone goals.

You will find that 90% of bassists WONT CARE about what the more detailed specifications say, they will just concentrate on enjoying it and playing the bass itself.
Click to expand...

I agree wholeheartedly.

However if you'd read this thread http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=663302 (Sensitivity or frequency response for cabs)
you'd know that rpsands and many like him judge ALL equipment based on their specs, and never find the need to listen to anything to make an informed decision :rollno:
 

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