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Genzler Amplification Club

#1,482
In regards to the 2x12 drivers, I have to say that I love them. I don't find that cabinet to be too quiet. I think it's rated at 100 dB in sensitivity. With my cranked up tube amps, it's perfect. The tone is absolutely killer with no spikes in the tone at all.
 
#1,483
Bassworship1 said:
I have another BA210-3 Array coming in today to add to my rig. I loved the 112-3's so much but I'm starting to really appreciate the power and extra cutting power the 210-3's provide in a full band mix. I've had a few recordings with my rig lately and the tone they produce is simply intoxicating. Best bass tone I've ever had. View attachment 1128876
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How did you mic it for the recording? One or two mics?
 
#1,484
bebass said:
How did you mic it for the recording? One or two mics?
Click to expand...

When I play in churches that are larger and needs more than my Cabinets I use the DI on the Genzler 800. Which is better than and DI I've purchased or use in the past with the exception of the REDDI I used to have. I've never mic'd the cabinets but the tone on stage is amazing and I'm sure it would be great to do so. I done some side by side testing of the Genzler 800 Di to a new Rubert Neeves RNDI and to me and the sound engineer he said the 800 DI was much better. So I sent the RNDI back and just use my Genzler.
 
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#1,485
Bassworship1 said:
When I play in churches that are larger and needs more than my Cabinets I use the DI on the Genzler 800. Which is better than and DI I've purchased or use in the past with the exception of the REDDI I used to have. I've never mic'd the cabinets but the tone on stage is amazing and I'm sure it would be great to do so. I done some side by side testing of the Genzler 800 Di to a new Rubert Neeves RNDI and to me and the sound engineer he said the 800 DI was much better. So I sent the RNDI back and just use my Genzler.
Click to expand...
Ah, yes. I am an old Pro Sound guy and also concur with your assessment of the Genzler DI and have used it personally with absolute satisfaction. I misunderstood your post and thought you were referring to the cabs and recording.

I have to mic my cabs Sunday as we are doing a recording session and I ALWAYS do both mic and direct. Think I will try 2 mics - and if time permits one mic not quite as close. Mr. @Jeff Genzler , any comments?
I will use a Heil PR40 mic and possibly another.
 
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#1,486
I also would be interesting in hearing how people are mic'ing their array cabinets. With more traditional cabinets, I usually use something like a Shure SM7B or EV RE20 on the cabinet for recording to mix with a DI signal, but I haven't yet tried a mic with the array cabinets. I would be curious to learn what mic choices and placement have worked for those who have tried it.
 
#1,487
Erik Turkman said:
I also would be interesting in hearing how people are mic'ing their array cabinets. With more traditional cabinets, I usually use something like a Shure SM7B or EV RE20 on the cabinet for recording to mix with a DI signal, but I haven't yet tried a mic with the array cabinets. I would be curious to learn what mic choices and placement have worked for those who have tried it.
Click to expand...
I remember Jeff had said something about this quite some time ago and I am sure he will respond with info. I have grown to absolutely love the PR40 and like it better than other choices but am sure a good sound can be obtained with other mics. I think using a non-close-up micing technique may work. Also possibly pointing mic a bit closer to array may work. And, I think 2 mics may be optimal, one close up on 12 and the other close up on array. But this is conjecture. I did try micing in a small room - just a quick sound to check out bass response in a PA. But I think it will be different in the large venue we are recording in, and I will experiment Sunday
 
#1,488
I had the same or similar experience with eth Neve DI...
Classic Neve is great .. I think they may just be using his name these days to sell product. The GB900 DI sounded more to what i like.. and I LOVE Neve too. The Rupert DI was not what i usually associate with Neve stuff


Bassworship1 said:
When I play in churches that are larger and needs more than my Cabinets I use the DI on the Genzler 800. Which is better than and DI I've purchased or use in the past with the exception of the REDDI I used to have. I've never mic'd the cabinets but the tone on stage is amazing and I'm sure it would be great to do so. I done some side by side testing of the Genzler 800 Di to a new Rubert Neeves RNDI and to me and the sound engineer he said the 800 DI was much better. So I sent the RNDI back and just use my Genzler.
Click to expand...
 
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#1,489
bebass said:
Ah, yes. I am an old Pro Sound guy and also concur with your assessment of the Genzler DI and have used it personally with absolute satisfaction. I misunderstood your post and thought you were referring to the cabs and recording.

I have to mic my cabs Sunday as we are doing a recording session and I ALWAYS do both mic and direct. Think I will try 2 mics - and if time permits one mic not quite as close. Mr. @Jeff Genzler , any comments?
I will use a Heil PR40 mic and possibly another.
Click to expand...

Good discussion.
I would use a mic like the PR 40 approx 8 - 12" from the front of the cabinet, at approx a 45 degree angle from the CENTER of the array. That places the mic slightly off axis from the array and also captures the outer radiation from the 12". I think this is a good starting point and then adjust to your personal taste --- perhaps closer to center if desired to see if that offers more array definition while keeping plenty of coverage from the woofer.
Using a mic and a blend from the DI would be a great option to capture the direct signal of the bass into the INPUT circuitry of the amp (including how the load pick ups load in the front end of the amp) AND the response of the mechanical drivers and the organic response that they offer.
 
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#1,490
bebass said:
I remember Jeff had said something about this quite some time ago and I am sure he will respond with info. I have grown to absolutely love the PR40 and like it better than other choices but am sure a good sound can be obtained with other mics. I think using a non-close-up micing technique may work. Also possibly pointing mic a bit closer to array may work. And, I think 2 mics may be optimal, one close up on 12 and the other close up on array. But this is conjecture. I did try micing in a small room - just a quick sound to check out bass response in a PA. But I think it will be different in the large venue we are recording in, and I will experiment Sunday
Click to expand...

Jeff Genzler said:
Good discussion.
I would use a mic like the PR 40 approx 8 - 12" from the front of the cabinet, at approx a 45 degree angle from the CENTER of the array. That places the mic slightly off axis from the array and also captures the outer radiation from the 12". I think this is a good starting point and then adjust to your personal taste --- perhaps closer to center if desired to see if that offers more array definition while keeping plenty of coverage from the woofer.
Using a mic and a blend from the DI would be a great option to capture the direct signal of the bass into the INPUT circuitry of the amp (including how the load pick ups load in the front end of the amp) AND the response of the mechanical drivers and the organic response that they offer.
Click to expand...

Thanks for this input. I haven't used the PR40 as yet, but I have used the PR30 plenty of times on guitar cabinet.
 
#1,491
Jeff Genzler said:
Good discussion.
I would use a mic like the PR 40 approx 8 - 12" from the front of the cabinet, at approx a 45 degree angle from the CENTER of the array. That places the mic slightly off axis from the array and also captures the outer radiation from the 12". I think this is a good starting point and then adjust to your personal taste --- perhaps closer to center if desired to see if that offers more array definition while keeping plenty of coverage from the woofer.
Using a mic and a blend from the DI would be a great option to capture the direct signal of the bass into the INPUT circuitry of the amp (including how the load pick ups load in the front end of the amp) AND the response of the mechanical drivers and the organic response that they offer.
Click to expand...
Thanks Jeff. Pretty much what I was thinking. If I had two mics and was doing this myself I might would try that also. I like the PR40 SO much. I am mostly going to be too busy with the rest of the band and am going to have to let him do what he does - he is a nationally touring pro sound guy. I never take just mic or just DI as I learned a long time ago that I really love being able to have both for the mixdown or even when doing just FOH. But I can't be the pro sound guy and the bass player at the same time so I have to bite my tongue if I don't like what he does, ha ha.
 
#1,495
Thebighertz said:
Interest in buying my Shuttle 9.2 for a reasonable price?
Click to expand...

Nah, I've actually been rocking an MG800 for awhile now :)

Bass_Rig_2016.jpg
 
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#1,496
Discount Saint said:
Nah, I've actually been rocking an MG800 for awhile now :)

View attachment 1130881
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So you do lift your stack up off the floor a bit. Are there any disadvantages to lifting the stack up? Worse bass response etc? Maybe @Jeff Genzler would comment. I currently have my single off the ground about 2 feet. Will I be ok stacking up from there with the second one or should I be a bit closer to the floor?
 
#1,497
Tdub77 said:
So you do lift your stack up off the floor a bit. Are there any disadvantages to lifting the stack up? Worse bass response etc? Maybe @Jeff Genzler would comment. I currently have my single off the ground about 2 feet. Will I be ok stacking up from there with the second one or should I be a bit closer to the floor?
Click to expand...

When your speakers are sitting directly on the floor they can do what is called "coupling", which means that your floor essentially becomes a speaker. A big, crappy sounding speaker. Using a lift (I have actually recently switched to milk crates as the flight case hardware rattles like crazy) to decouple from the floor makes sure that all of your sound is coming out of the device designed to play that sound rather than getting muddled up in bad overtones from the floor.
 
#1,498
Discount Saint said:
When your speakers are sitting directly on the floor they can do what is called "coupling", which means that your floor essentially becomes a speaker. A big, crappy sounding speaker. Using a lift (I have actually recently switched to milk crates as the flight case hardware rattles like crazy) to decouple from the floor makes sure that all of your sound is coming out of the device designed to play that sound rather than getting muddled up in bad overtones from the floor.
Click to expand...

Additionally, it gets the speakers closer to my head, which helps me hear myself better :)
 
#1,499
Discount Saint said:
When your speakers are sitting directly on the floor they can do what is called "coupling", which means that your floor essentially becomes a speaker. A big, crappy sounding speaker. Using a lift (I have actually recently switched to milk crates as the flight case hardware rattles like crazy) to decouple from the floor makes sure that all of your sound is coming out of the device designed to play that sound rather than getting muddled up in bad overtones from the floor.
Click to expand...
Right I know about de-coupling speakers from the Hi-Fi world. I guess I was wondering if there were any unintended downsides to this. Oddities caused by the point source nature not having any close boundary etc. We don't have many array speakers in hi-fi
 
#1,500
Tdub77 said:
So you do lift your stack up off the floor a bit. Are there any disadvantages to lifting the stack up? Worse bass response etc? Maybe @Jeff Genzler would comment. I currently have my single off the ground about 2 feet. Will I be ok stacking up from there with the second one or should I be a bit closer to the floor?
Click to expand...
Ok, back in my day I rarely would consider placing a cab up off the floor. Of course this would completely depend upon the stage structure.
Now that you have 2 cabs I think a 12" riser would be plenty. If your able to get a few feet in front of the cabs that should be a great sweet spot.
 
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