Genzler Amplification Club

[Promit]

I've been trying some fun new (used) things out recently. For my taste it's one of the bass arrays over the NC-212, but I haven't quite figured out which one yet. The 210 and 112 together are very loud, but I think I don't actually like the blend of the two cabs. I can hear the difference in responses and it bothers me. I'm really looking for the most neutral/flat voiced cabinet around and I haven't quite figured that out between the two.

 

[edwinhurwitz]

I'm really looking for the most neutral/flat voiced cabinet around and I haven't quite figured that out between the two.

I haven't tried the new cabs, but my guess would be the Bass Array cabs, especially if you get them up to ear level. I find that otherwise, the upper mids and highs don't get to your ears if they are too low.

 

[Promit]

I haven't tried the new cabs, but my guess would be the Bass Array cabs, especially if you get them up to ear level. I find that otherwise, the upper mids and highs don't get to your ears if they are too low.

Sorry - I meant between the BA 112 and 210, I haven't quite figured out which is the more neutral voicing. I find it tough to hear these things when the ear adapts.

 

[agedhorse]

You don't know me sir but fortunately I am a nerd and take no offense.

Seriously - thank you all for the replies.

Sorry, that was an unfortunate auto-correct incident…

 

[edwinhurwitz]

Sorry - I meant between the BA 112 and 210, I haven't quite figured out which is the more neutral voicing. I find it tough to hear these things when the ear adapts.

I think the idea for these cabs is that they all have a similar voicing. I generally use a pair of the 12s, but I have added a 15 sometimes and it's pretty similar. I went into these cabinets because I wanted cabs that would accurately represent what my DIs are sending to the FOH and I can't afford or lift Meyer cabs.

 

[Promit]

Well I went back with a fresh set of ears, and also tested both cabs as guitar FRFR where my ears are much more sensitive and well trained. For me, in the series 1, it's the BA12-3 all the way. Just an amazing thing. Out of the box it's a bit polite on treble compared to other things I've used, but I found it responds extremely well to EQ. Now I've gotta find the Series 2 to try.

 

[Basselink]

Sorry, that was an unfortunate auto-correct incident…

No apologies needed - I knew it was a typo/auto correct - I love that it just happened to be one that gave the reply a very funny twist. Thanks for the quick reply to the original question.

 

[jjk2007]

Well I went back with a fresh set of ears, and also tested both cabs as guitar FRFR where my ears are much more sensitive and well trained. For me, in the series 1, it's the BA12-3 all the way. Just an amazing thing. Out of the box it's a bit polite on treble compared to other things I've used, but I found it responds extremely well to EQ. Now I've gotta find the Series 2 to try.

Your treble description is how I've always felt about my BA410…especially coming from many years of using horn loaded 4X10's. The treble is smooth and musical but with some knob twisting I can get the 'snap/glassy' sound of a horn loaded cab minus the hiss. It's rare I go for that sound these days and sometimes I find myself even cutting a pinch of treble when playing live.

 

[MaxSpinrun]

Ditto. I feel the same about my BA 15-3. Mids and highs are smooth, not harsh as some tweeters can be. I would imagine series 2 would be even better.

 

[edwinhurwitz]

Ditto. I feel the same about my BA 15-3. Mids and highs are smooth, not harsh as some tweeters can be. I would imagine series 2 would be even better.

My BA 15 is a series 2 and it is a bit better, but in my experience, getting the mid/tweeters up at ear level makes the biggest difference. The dispersion is not the same as traditional tweeters, it is much more limited vertically. After having these speakers for years, I finally figured this out! With a BA 15 or BA 4x10 on the floor, it's going to sound more polite and less like what is actually coming out of the speaker. I consider this a feature, not a bug.

 

[pauliebass]

So after considering returning the 112 V-T combo, I am going to keep it. I'm still in the return window until Friday. I bought this a day before the new cabs were announced. It sounds so damn good. It has a deep bass response that my Berg HT112 doesn't have. Those old cabs are the OG boutique 112s. Pretty well noted for needing 2 of them for deeper response. I had 2, but sold one to a student like 15 years ago. This Berg cab came out of retirement when my wife took my BA combo for cello (I don't want to drag my 212 to these gigs), and I've already moved it to my office at school for teaching since getting this new combo.

This "older" combo is still insanely light at 27lbs. Carrying it up 30 steps (as suggested earlier) would be a non issue for me. I love the taller form factor as well. I also prefer the silver grill. I get that a new cab line should have a different style, but I like the more classic look. If I didn't own the BA combo, I probably would have went for the newer cabinet to have a small and crazy light combo, but I certainly have that with the BA. I love hearing the 350 with this V-T. Such a different vibe! The amazing contour knob has even more versatility with this 12. I feel like these knobs on other companies heads are useless and an indispensable tool on the Genzler heads. It nails the different sounds I go for, and the rest of the eq is for correcting room/stage problems. I just love it, and I use more of the range of this knob with the 12. With the BA10, I use the old school curve way more, but so far the modern curve sounds fantastic with this cab. Plenty of booty with an octaver. The modern curve with the BA can get a little extreme for that cab. My super happy place is the vintage contour with a p bass with flats. Smile inducing and both cabs sound fantastic with this contour. I go on and on about this to anyone that will listen. So after hearing the respectable low end extension on this cab, I seriously doubt the newer cabinet is as deep. When Jeff says "less scooped" I hear "less deep bass." I'm sure the new ones come close or else he wouldn't replace the line. In most applications, I'm sure it will serve the same overall purpose, but physics is physics. The design goal for the new cab was to get it to sub 20lbs, not necessarily to sound "better" in its bass response. At best the new cab approaches the old one, but there's no way it has more bass. I'm not trying to downplay the new cab which are sure to be a hit. I'm just explaining my decision. I going to stick with this sound because it's amazing and the perfect complement to someone that also has the BA. Also, Dave Messina has already built the bag for it. I just need to get over to Louisville to pick it up. I'm sure any of you double bass players know his work. Best custom bass bags in the business.

Anyway, thanks for all the great options over the years, Jeff. That new 212 is going to be such a hit. That's an insane weight to get it to. I'm pretty set on my 212 but will consider this in the future, for sure.

 

[RColie]

So after considering returning the 112 V-T combo, I am going to keep it. I'm still in the return window until Friday. I bought this a day before the new cabs were announced. It sounds so damn good. It has a deep bass response that my Berg HT112 doesn't have. Those old cabs are the OG boutique 112s. Pretty well noted for needing 2 of them for deeper response. I had 2, but sold one to a student like 15 years ago. This Berg cab came out of retirement when my wife took my BA combo for cello (I don't want to drag my 212 to these gigs), and I've already moved it to my office at school for teaching since getting this new combo.

This "older" combo is still insanely light at 27lbs. Carrying it up 30 steps (as suggested earlier) would be a non issue for me. I love the taller form factor as well. I also prefer the silver grill. I get that a new cab line should have a different style, but I like the more classic look. If I didn't own the BA combo, I probably would have went for the newer cabinet to have a small and crazy light combo, but I certainly have that with the BA. I love hearing the 350 with this V-T. Such a different vibe! The amazing contour knob has even more versatility with this 12. I feel like these knobs on other companies heads are useless and an indispensable tool on the Genzler heads. It nails the different sounds I go for, and the rest of the eq is for correcting room/stage problems. I just love it, and I use more of the range of this knob with the 12. With the BA10, I use the old school curve way more, but so far the modern curve sounds fantastic with this cab. Plenty of booty with an octaver. The modern curve with the BA can get a little extreme for that cab. My super happy place is the vintage contour with a p bass with flats. Smile inducing and both cabs sound fantastic with this contour. I go on and on about this to anyone that will listen. So after hearing the respectable low end extension on this cab, I seriously doubt the newer cabinet is as deep. When Jeff says "less scooped" I hear "less deep bass." I'm sure the new ones come close or else he wouldn't replace the line. In most applications, I'm sure it will serve the same overall purpose, but physics is physics. The design goal for the new cab was to get it to sub 20lbs, not necessarily to sound "better" in its bass response. At best the new cab approaches the old one, but there's no way it has more bass. I'm not trying to downplay the new cab which are sure to be a hit. I'm just explaining my decision. I going to stick with this sound because it's amazing and the perfect complement to someone that also has the BA. Also, Dave Messina has already built the bag for it. I just need to get over to Louisville to pick it up. I'm sure any of you double bass players know his work. Best custom bass bags in the business.

Anyway, thanks for all the great options over the years, Jeff. That new 212 is going to be such a hit. That's an insane weight to get it to. I'm pretty set on my 212 but will consider this in the future, for sure.

I've used the MG350 MG12T-V combo a lot. This cabinet has very strong, clear bass for sure. In recent years my rehearsal spaces have been down steep narrow stairs and the lighter and slightly shorter dimensions of the 112ULV will make a difference in the carry. I trust that Jeff has designed the ULV cab to come very close or equal to the 12T-V, so I'm going to make the switch. Either way is a winner!

 

[Michael Vee]

I located the previous Magellan 12T-V cabinet dimensions on the GA site. As Jeff said, the ULV cab is a bit smaller. Both dimensions are in HWD order.

Original Magellan 12T-V: 19.625" x 14.5" x 16"

New Magellan ULV-12T: 18.125" x 14.25" x 14"

Basically an inch and a half shorter and two inches less depth.

Being a BA110 combo owner, I like the idea of having the ULV-12T with an amp cradle installed. Then the MG350 could be switched between the BA110 cab and the ULV-12T cab for different sound for different kinds of gigs, without having to deal with removing and reinstalling 12 screws each time. I may do this; I may not. I'm running out of room for gear!

 

[SteveC]

I don't do enough gigs at this point with am amp to justify the change. My MG350 MG12T-V is awesome and pretty easy to move around.

 

[MattLplaysBass]

I don't think Genzler's business model is just to get people to upgrade their 1x12 cabs every 5-10 years They were coming out with a new/revamped line and newer lightweight materials are available...

The bigger cabs are much more of a difference in weight (new vs old), but it's good to see them being competitive with other new lightweight cabs (for all of us internet spec shoppers...)

 

[Holdsg]

Genzler's business model is to make exceptional gear that meets bass player needs, period. If they do that consistently (which they have now for many years) they will sell everything they make.

 

[Jeff Genzler]

I don't think Genzler's business model is just to get people to upgrade their 1x12 cabs every 5-10 years They were coming out with a new/revamped line and newer lightweight materials are available...

The bigger cabs are much more of a difference in weight (new vs old), but it's good to see them being competitive with other new lightweight cabs (for all of us internet spec shoppers...)

Thanks for all of the comments as you discuss and digest the new MG-ULV cabs and what they offer --- in comparison to our previous products.
No I would not expect a player that is happy with their current GENZLER cabs, to all of a sudden feel they need to switch. The one cab in question (MG-12T-V) is a great cabinet, solid LF depth, extremely lightweight, but yet overall did not seperate itself from many other cabs within a few lbs of it's weight.
With the MG-ULV series, our goal was to offer the best sounding cabs within the newer "ultra-light" segment --- and in my mind, that starts with a 12" cabinet offering, under 20 lbs. We feel we have delivered that, in an all wood, multi-layer plywood cabinet, USA made ---- where the other options are composite cabinets of different types and materials. We wanted to bring the warmth of this "real wood" option to the table for those players that just "need" to consider weight and portability, as much as the tone and performance. This is were our "beta testers" felt that we delivered beyond our previous offerings.
Of course there are some physics that are hard to get past BUT with our experience and detailed cabinet porting, we feel that the new MG-ULV series wins the performance vs weight ratio, in a professional product that easily handles the rigors of a powerful 5 string instrument. In Nate Navarro's demo, he does a great job showing how each cabinet can handle his various, powerful instruments. Different players will drive these cabinets in different ways, but I'm sure the value, quality and performance will come through when it matters the most ---- on stage, with night-after-night durability.

 

[N. Kentucky Bass]

Normally I prefer to play bass in my home studio with a speaker cabinet, especially since sound-treating the room. The robust tube presence of my new Kinetix 800 has brought new joy into playing the bass. On a whim, I decided to try playing through the amp's earphone jack. What a treat! My Sony MDR-7506 headphones revealed a deeper, more intricate presence of the notes than perceived in open air. I felt like I was touching the tube-infused note envelopes with my fingertips and shaping them on demand. Tone/EQ details controlled by minute adjustments to various amp controls were easy to hear in the phones. I give an A+ to the Genzler team on yet another great feature of this amp. I wish I had discovered the Kinetix 800 sooner!

 

[Jeff Genzler]

Normally I prefer to play bass in my home studio with a speaker cabinet, especially since sound-treating the room. The robust tube presence of my new Kinetix 800 has brought new joy into playing the bass. On a whim, I decided to try playing through the amp's earphone jack. What a treat! My Sony MDR-7506 headphones revealed a deeper, more intricate presence of the notes than perceived in open air. I felt like I was touching the tube-infused note envelopes with my fingertips and shaping them on demand. Tone/EQ details controlled by minute adjustments to various amp controls were easy to hear in the phones. I give an A+ to the Genzler team on yet another great feature of this amp. I wish I had discovered the Kinetix 800 sooner!

Thank you for the kind comments. Glad you're enjoying the Kinetix.

 

[Michael Vee]

Jeff, are you using different drivers with the ULVs than were in the previous Magellan cabs?