Judging by the thousands of people who regularly come to our gigs, such as last night, I'd say our audience's comfort level is just fine.
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Gig w/Ampeg Backline
- Thread starter DWBass
- Start date
Allow me to briefly interrupt this skirmish to make this observation, superfluous as it might be:
My favorite monitors ever were the ones at CBGB; there were two, hanging from the ceiling, reaching just above ear height, and pointing inward. (They were sidefills.) Maybe they did this to make more room on the stage... I don't know. Anyway, you could REALLY hear yourself.
Now back to our main entertainment...
My favorite monitors ever were the ones at CBGB; there were two, hanging from the ceiling, reaching just above ear height, and pointing inward. (They were sidefills.) Maybe they did this to make more room on the stage... I don't know. Anyway, you could REALLY hear yourself.
Now back to our main entertainment...
Strange that you would not dig your cab cross-firing on stage. You can turn up more without messing up the front of house mix, you eliminate (pretty well) any sort of beaming in the upper midrange on stage, especially with a cab like fridge (i.e., the bass will sound WAY better to the rest of the guys across the stage), and it will eliminate a bit of the 'bleed through' from the vocal mic's, which helps the front of house guy do his job.
I actually dig that sort of thing on stage, as do most of the guys I play with, especially in the rare smaller venue where we have full front of house and stage volume needs to be lower than many of us like it.
You actually can't turn up more because someone in the band always complains. Plus I like it when the amp bleeds through my vocal mic a little. Mixes with no bleed always sound a bit sterile and lifeless to me.
Well the old saying goes" If you can hear yourself really well then chances are you are too loud"
Not trying to get involved in what was pretty close to becoming a pissing match here, but I've never heard that saying. Unless I'm misunderstanding something.
I've played plenty of gigs (large and small, outdoor, indoor) where sound was either great and you could hear yourself plain as day, or it was terrible and at times you couldn't hear a thing. And if it was great, it was never attributed to too much stage volume...
My favorite venue to play. Loved the sound on stage. God I miss that place. I remember that Fender 810 pro they had for their backline and how awesome it sounded with my SWR head.
Geez people.....
Re: sidewash...depending on how elaborate the sound system is, the drum mics may very well have gates on them set higher/quicker than the vocal mics. With this your sidefill bass cab sitting some distance away isn't going to bleed in them much.
I'm not a stage volume/mic bleed nazi. I like a little bleed, keeps things sounding "lively". Some folks like a fat bass sound on stage, others like things as quiet as possible.
The answer to a lot of this, like many other things is "it depends". What the right answer is changes with the situation. People saying they will fire the soundman for asking them to turn their rig sideways, or soundmen badmouthing bands for wanting to play at some level above that of a church mouse is just dumb.
Re: sidewash...depending on how elaborate the sound system is, the drum mics may very well have gates on them set higher/quicker than the vocal mics. With this your sidefill bass cab sitting some distance away isn't going to bleed in them much.
I'm not a stage volume/mic bleed nazi. I like a little bleed, keeps things sounding "lively". Some folks like a fat bass sound on stage, others like things as quiet as possible.
The answer to a lot of this, like many other things is "it depends". What the right answer is changes with the situation. People saying they will fire the soundman for asking them to turn their rig sideways, or soundmen badmouthing bands for wanting to play at some level above that of a church mouse is just dumb.
Long and short of it is that the frequencies from bass guitar that are typically problematic in the house have long enough wavelengths that sidewashing the bass amp won't mitigate any issues they cause anyway.
I'm one of the least technical guys you'll meet, but from my experience I think the theory behind this is that bass frequencies "gather" or "focus" at a point quite a few feet away from your rig. So, if you're standing close to your rig and you turn up enough to clearly hear yourself in the onstage mix, you might melt the face of an audience member in the third row.
Hi,
Now I'm a little jealous. I thought the ire of Mr. modulusman was reserved for me and his disapproval of my PA systems, neither of which he has ever heard live. He will not be convinced that sometimes "good enough" is, indeed, good enough.
While I am sure he is a pretty good guy in real life and on stage, methinks I am not the only one who does not agree with Mr. modulusman's perception of his online persona as being funny and clever.
But look, I'll but a smiley face at the end so everything is OK, right?
Thank you for your indulgence,
BassCliff
modulusman said:Wow you tell him Jimmy.I'm sure soundmen nation wide are living in fear for their jobs. Actually they are probably hoping that your oldies act audience would hurry up and die off or move to nursing homes so they don't have to deal with you.
JimmyM said:
Now I'm a little jealous. I thought the ire of Mr. modulusman was reserved for me and his disapproval of my PA systems, neither of which he has ever heard live. He will not be convinced that sometimes "good enough" is, indeed, good enough.
While I am sure he is a pretty good guy in real life and on stage, methinks I am not the only one who does not agree with Mr. modulusman's perception of his online persona as being funny and clever.
But look, I'll but a smiley face at the end so everything is OK, right?
Thank you for your indulgence,
BassCliff
+1
So true. In my band no one complains, they just go straight for their volume knobs ...thats no good.
Hi,
Now I'm a little jealous. I thought the ire of Mr. modulusman was reserved for me and his disapproval of my PA systems, neither of which he has ever heard live. He will not be convinced that sometimes "good enough" is, indeed, good enough.
While I am sure he is a pretty good guy in real life and on stage, methinks I am not the only one who does not agree with Mr. modulusman's perception of his online persona as being funny and clever.
But look, I'll but a smiley face at the end so everything is OK, right?
Thank you for your indulgence,
BassCliff
Well I guess I don't think a $1000.00 PA is ever good enough. Maybe if more bands thought that way live music wouldn't be in such a rut and losing gigs to DJs.
None of you bigshots were at OP's gig. Nobody can say the sideways amps were the result of an out of control soundguy or a good compromise for the room and stage volume.
I wouldn't like young up and comers to get the idea they should be asking for the soundguys head on a stick whenever sideways amps gets suggested.
I wouldn't like young up and comers to get the idea they should be asking for the soundguys head on a stick whenever sideways amps gets suggested.
I didn't have a problem with it. It was just the first time I've experienced it in all my years of playing. And it was in a written directive to not move anything onstage. The sound guys were decent but not the best I've ever worked with. Took a LOT of tweaking during soundcheck. And for some reason, they had the treble on my bass signal in the monitors maxed! Yeesh! And they had the kick drum on overdrive! Thought Godzilla was in the house!
Me: "Uh guys.....can y'all back off on the treble......a LOT! And balance out the bass to kick drum mix! Thanks!"
No.
This effect can happen, but it's more due to room reflections of sound than the actual rig.
