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GK 410MBE Mods

#21
gmarcus said:
... I'm going to pair it up with my Schroeder 1515L and GK1001RBII.
Click to expand...

Pairing up dissimilar cabs is a real crap shoot. You might expect to get a bit of the qualities of both. But what you often get is a lot of cancelling out, at certain freqs.

I recently tried a G-B 112T and a Flyte 1x15 w/ mid. The sound of both together was definitely less than the sum of the parts! Distinctly inferior, and not louder.

So imho, try it at home before you count on using both at a gig.

If you don't like what you hear (and it's softer than either single cab), you could always try flipping the polarity of one -- through an adapter at the speaker out or in, or rewire the speaker cable itself.
 
#25
There is plenty of debate as to what the exact mechanism is. When you put a speaker in a sealed box it raises the Q of the system as the box gets smaller. The way I think about it is the stuffing slows down the speed of sound so it makes the box look bigger acoustically. This lowers the Q. A high Q cabinet can sound boomy it is a bump in the low mids of the frequency response. Stuffing the cabinet reduces the bump. If you put in too much stuffing you start to reduce the bass output too. So you need to find a balance.

As far as how to stuff the cabinet, Acosta-stuff is like dacron pillow stuffing. You just fluff it up and stuff it into the cabinet through the speaker hole. I was kind of in a rush so I just pulled one speaker and reached inside to make sure the stuffing filled the whole cabinet. If you have more time you can pull all for drivers so that you can really see to it that the stuffing is evenly distributed.

I just finished up the out door gig. I got to listen to the other bands bass player playing through my rig, from the audience. The tone was superb! They played Eric Clapton's Badge and Let it Rain. That classic Jack Bruce / Carl Radle bass tone was there. Volume was no problem at all and the two cabinets complemented each other beautifully. I put rubber feet on the bottom of the 410MBE so it stacked nicely on top of the Schroeder 1515L
 
#26
gmarcus said:
... The tone was superb! ... Volume was no problem at all and the two cabinets complemented each other beautifully. I put rubber feet on the bottom of the 410MBE so it stacked nicely on top of the Schroeder 1515L
Click to expand...

Wow, you got yourself one toneful, tote-able powerhouse!
And I bet you could just squeeze 'em into a Fiat 500. :o)
 
#27
gmarcus said:
There is plenty of debate as to what the exact mechanism is. When you put a speaker in a sealed box it raises the Q of the system as the box gets smaller. The way I think about it is the stuffing slows down the speed of sound so it makes the box look bigger acoustically.
Click to expand...
The debate ended with the advent of modern testing gear. It lowers Q by offering a higher impedance load than just air. The box doesn't look bigger acoustically, as that would not only lower Q but also increase low frequency sensitivity. Stuffing gets the lower Q but does not increase LF sensitivity. You can measure cab Q yourself with this:
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
 
#28
@pbasswil. It all fits into the cab of a 2001 Toyota Tacoma double cab. Two speakers in the back seat, bass and head riding shot gun!

@bill again thanks for the clarification! That speaker tester looks pretty cool. Back when I was designing speakers all I had was a tube driven frequency generator and my ears. The speaker design cookbook also came in handy. Looks like it is a whole new game today. I'm really tempted to jump back in, but I no longer have room for a wood shop.
 
#29
So I found out about a killer deal on the MBE410. Music123 beat a $299.99 price that was advertised on Amazon. I got it for $284+ shipping which brought it up to $309. I just could not pass up this deal.

I also ordered 2 lbs of Acousta-stuff and just finished stuffing the cabinet. I can say that 2 lbs is the right amount. I listened before and after. The stuffed cab has slightly deeper and tighter bass and much smoother midrange. The best way I can describe the difference is it is more refined and less aggressive sounding. The bottom end is rounder. I recorded it before and after in my bedroom with a Sony PCM-M10 hand held recorder which has pretty decent mics. I can hear a difference, not sure if the midrange will make a big difference in the band mix, but the tighter bass will definitely help get rid of the boom.

As Bill predicted: Lower Q and less midrange reflections in the cab= tighter bass and smoother midrange.

If someone can tell me how to post clips I should be able to post these in the next couple of days.

I have an out door gig next Wednesday at the Harwichport Stroll on Cape Cod MA so I plan to bring my new modular 8X10 rig:bassist:
 
#30
I'm glad to hear that it's a worthy mod.

I can't seem to find a source for Acousta-Stuf in Canada, but maybe I'll just order it from the States somewhere. And I'd be interetsed in hearing those clips you got too, unfortunately I don't know how'd you go about posting them on here. I know there are websites that you can post audio files to and then you could link to them, but I don't know of any of these sites by name... Sorry.

EDIT: I looked at The Battle Of The Little Wings thread, and JimmyM uploaded his clip to "http://www.fileden.com". I just looked at it looks like you can sign up for a basic membership for free with up 100MB storage.
 
#32
Yes, pillow stuffing is much cheaper too. I believe the stuff you want is called Dacron Polyester. Honestly I think it is the same thing as the acousta-stuff (minus the marketing Hype). I'll check out that site when I get a chance so I can post the comparison.
 
#33
Just as a thought that crossed my mind: to work together nicely cabinets have to be in phase. This is simple to check for using a 9V battery. Placed across the tip and sleeve all the cones in the system should move in the same direction. Usually the battery positive to the tip will cause the cones to move out of the basket. With cabinets from the same manufacturer this is usually a given but not always. The JBLs that i've owned were the opposite for some strange reason known only to the folks at JBL.
 
#34
BassmanPaul said:
Just as a thought that crossed my mind: to work together nicely cabinats have to be in phase. This is simple to check for using a 9V battery. Placed across the tip and sleeve all the cones in the system should move in the same direction. Usually the battery positive to the tip will cause the cones to move out of the basket. With cabinets from the same manufacturer this is a given but not always. The JBLs that i've owned were the opposite for some strange reason known only to the folks at JBL.
Click to expand...
It's a pretty well publicized fact that with some drivers, but not all, JBL uses a black positive/red negative labeling of their driver input lugs. I've never seen an official explanation as to why. Eminence does the same with their HF drivers, but not their woofers, also with no explanation. But the driver data sheets have it there, this time in black and white.
 
#35
billfitzmaurice said:
Use pillow stuffing. Available everywhere. But make sure it's polyester, not goose down.
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gmarcus said:
Yes, pillow stuffing is much cheaper too. I believe the stuff you want is called Dacron Polyester. Honestly I think it is the same thing as the acousta-stuff (minus the marketing Hype). I'll check out that site when I get a chance so I can post the comparison.
Click to expand...

Aah, good ol' pillow stuffing. That's great guys, thank you! I have some gross yellow-stained pillows that I just replaced and were about the throw out... But I'll make sure the stuffing is polyester before I stuff the cabinets. Do any of you have an estimate for how much stuffing is in an average pillow?
 
#38
If it is a 410MBE than it is 800watts. The only choices are 4 and 8 ohms. I bought 2. The first was 449 from MF. The second was the 309 delivered deal from music123 (price matching Amazon). Amazon must have had a Typo. The 410MBE is a sealed cab. If it weighs under 50lbs and has no ports you should be all set.
 
#40
gmarcus said:
Here they are in all of their glory. I used a Fender P5 bass with TI Jazz Flats Through a Shuttle 6.0 amp with the low boost engaged (to lower the high Pass Filter cut off).

It is a very subtle difference now that I listen back. This was at medium volume.
Click to expand...
Find a boomy stage and the difference will be more obvious.
 

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