I just got my GK Neo 112-II cabinet on Tom Bowlus' recommendation, and it kills with this head. It is my first 12" cabinet, and I definitely see the draw to a 12.
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GK mb200 ultra light head?
- Thread starter pigdog
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+1 to that. And it sounds killer, especially if you use something heavy-duty that can supply lots of instantaneous power. That bit of slowness or "sludginess" disappears, replaced by impact and tightness and authority, and it is not a subtle change.
It would be interesting if GK were to make an MB200-P -- a preamp-only version of the MB200 -- with the IcePower board replaced by a low-end +/-25V unregulated power supply. (In the MB200, the IcePower board supplies the low voltage for the rest of the amp.) The Speakon connector could be deleted and replaced with a metal plug. And if it could be done for less than $200 retail, it might be a winner. Heck, might even get a 2012 Sleeper Of The Year award. Only downside: MB200-P plus a third-party power amp might eat into the MB500's market segment, and probably would eat into the MB800's. I haven't run the numbers yet. But that's because I don't have any.
Weekend bump! Used it as always lately for rehearsal....Awsome!....as always.
Promoting "no Sig Sunday"
Promoting "no Sig Sunday"
Have any of you removed the feet from the bottom of your MB200? It would fit in my gig bag so much better is I took them off. I just want to make sure that it won't cause problems. I am assuming that it uses screws to hold the feet on rather than nuts and bolts that would come loose in the case.
I read in this thread that they come off easy. Maybe use velcro to secure it to your speaker cab if needed.
Promoting "no Sig Sunday"
It would be interesting if GK were to make an MB200-P -- a preamp-only version of the MB200 -- with the IcePower board replaced by a low-end +/-25V unregulated power supply. (In the MB200, the IcePower board supplies the low voltage for the rest of the amp.) The Speakon connector could be deleted and replaced with a metal plug. And if it could be done for less than $200 retail, it might be a winner. Heck, might even get a 2012 Sleeper Of The Year award. Only downside: MB200-P plus a third-party power amp might eat into the MB500's market segment, and probably would eat into the MB800's. I haven't run the numbers yet. But that's because I don't have any.
This, designed to directly feed their new MBP powered cabs.
Then maybe a trimpot or a two-position rotary switch to set output level could go where the Speakon is now. But then the preamp board would have to be modded to provide the extra gain, 'cause I hear the powered cabs are going to require more voltage than today's typical power amp.
//begin_OT_with_apologies
I've never quite understood the reasoning behind that decision and the logistics+costs it'll impose on the company as folks begin sending in their combos to get their outputs modded to provide enough oomph for those powered cabs. But it might be an intentional effort to limit powered-cab market penetration just to the combos; the physical part of interface wouldn't be proprietary, but the signal level would render proprietary the interface as a whole. Actually we don't even know whether GK's going to bump the preamp gain on those combos, or take an attenuated feed off the power amp's output. It would be far simpler to do the latter, but then that would disqualify an IcePower-less MB200-P from consideration for GK powered-cab duty. Boy, am I glad I don't have to make these marketing decisions.
//end_OT_with_apologies
//begin_OT_with_apologies
I've never quite understood the reasoning behind that decision and the logistics+costs it'll impose on the company as folks begin sending in their combos to get their outputs modded to provide enough oomph for those powered cabs. But it might be an intentional effort to limit powered-cab market penetration just to the combos; the physical part of interface wouldn't be proprietary, but the signal level would render proprietary the interface as a whole. Actually we don't even know whether GK's going to bump the preamp gain on those combos, or take an attenuated feed off the power amp's output. It would be far simpler to do the latter, but then that would disqualify an IcePower-less MB200-P from consideration for GK powered-cab duty. Boy, am I glad I don't have to make these marketing decisions.
//end_OT_with_apologies
I've previously said that comparing my 200W Kustom DE200 and my MB200, I seemed to get more clean power from the Kustom than with the MB200. The GK started distorting/clipping at pretty much lower volume than the kustom.
Now I think that the "issue" is with the MB200's PREAMP based on the following facts:
- If I connect the MB200's line out to the Kustom's effects return I get less volume than with the Kustom alone, and sound starts distorting as I turn the MB200's gain knob THE SAME POSITION that it started to distort playing the MB200 alone.
- If I connect the Kustom's effects send to the MB200's input (it doesn't have effects loop) I can play VERY loud (louder than with the Kustom alone) with NO distortion. Take in account that this way I'm using the Kustom's preamp + the GK's preamp, so signal may be pretty hot.
So, what I think is that with my bass (an SX jazz I'll upgrade soon for an active custom made) the MB200's preamp clips before than the power power section, wic is capable of producing more clean power than I'm using because the preamp is limiting my power. That's only an assumption based on the previosly mentioned facts.
So do you think an external preamp coul help? I think so, cause using the Kustom's pre I could get more clean power.
I don't wanna spend too much, because in a few months my new bass will be finished and I'll have to pay it, plus I think that having an active pre it will solve part of the problem.
I will appreciate help/advice,
Thanks
Mods: feel free to move this post to a new thread if it's innapropiated here,
Now I think that the "issue" is with the MB200's PREAMP based on the following facts:
- If I connect the MB200's line out to the Kustom's effects return I get less volume than with the Kustom alone, and sound starts distorting as I turn the MB200's gain knob THE SAME POSITION that it started to distort playing the MB200 alone.
- If I connect the Kustom's effects send to the MB200's input (it doesn't have effects loop) I can play VERY loud (louder than with the Kustom alone) with NO distortion. Take in account that this way I'm using the Kustom's preamp + the GK's preamp, so signal may be pretty hot.
So, what I think is that with my bass (an SX jazz I'll upgrade soon for an active custom made) the MB200's preamp clips before than the power power section, wic is capable of producing more clean power than I'm using because the preamp is limiting my power. That's only an assumption based on the previosly mentioned facts.
So do you think an external preamp coul help? I think so, cause using the Kustom's pre I could get more clean power.
I don't wanna spend too much, because in a few months my new bass will be finished and I'll have to pay it, plus I think that having an active pre it will solve part of the problem.
I will appreciate help/advice,
Thanks
Mods: feel free to move this post to a new thread if it's innapropiated here,
Have you tried using the 10dB pad while playing? If you're clipping, that could help. I use the pad, and have two very hot active basses, and had the thing turned all the way up yesterday and didn't hear any distortion or clipping.
On a side note, I used it yesterday with my new GK Neo 112-II at church. It absolutely killed. The other guys loved the tone, and the sound guy barely had me in the house, because the tone was absolutely filling the sanctuary.
That is a great mini-rig-of-doom.
That is a great mini-rig-of-doom.
- Apr 3, 2003
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- Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
Yes, but as my bass doesn't have very high output, even with gain cranked all the way up it is quiet (more than with the -10db pad off before it starts clipping)
weekend thread action bump.
I have been using the MB200's for most all of my rehearsals and one small gig. Love them. ( have 2)
Last rehearsa,l I took my Markbass MoMark 250 watt frame head(also have a 500w frame). It was plenty for rehearsal...BUT... the GK MB200 blows this particular amp(MoMark 250)out of the water!.
The Markbass MoMark 250w( I do like this amp though) master volume was at 3:00 and the pre gain was at 1:00
I usually run the GK MB200 volume at 12:00, maybe a tad more.
The GK MB200 ROCKs with plenty of power!
I want a third...
GAS is a terible thing to waste!
I have been using the MB200's for most all of my rehearsals and one small gig. Love them. ( have 2)
Last rehearsa,l I took my Markbass MoMark 250 watt frame head(also have a 500w frame). It was plenty for rehearsal...BUT... the GK MB200 blows this particular amp(MoMark 250)out of the water!.
The Markbass MoMark 250w( I do like this amp though) master volume was at 3:00 and the pre gain was at 1:00
I usually run the GK MB200 volume at 12:00, maybe a tad more.
The GK MB200 ROCKs with plenty of power!
I want a third...
GAS is a terible thing to waste!
Wing, does the same thing happen WITH a speaker connected?
The fan is something GK added. It's supposed to kick on before the IcePower module senses an overtemp condition. Could be something's wrong with the GK temp sensor on yours. Either not mounted properly on the choke where it belongs, or not enough thermal transfer paste between the sensor and the choke, or the wire slipped off, or...
Could also be a bad solder joint somewhere on the IcePower module that causes a connection to "go away" at higher temps. I have a similar problem on mine, and I applied a half-ass workaround until I get the time to pull the board and re-flow a couple of solder joints. Before the workaround, I could let the amp warm up all on its own (no speaker load, no instrument connected), then once it was warmed up it would go in and out of protect if I connected an instrument and played it after turning up the volume, again with no speaker load.
On mine, on a hot day, say 85-90, the fan will kick on with the amp just sitting there and doing nothing. It'll start on high and then gradually come down in speed, and then maybe even shut off until the amp gets warm enough again to need it again. At 70-80 at low volume into an inefficient 8 ohm cab, the fan will kick on after about 5 minutes. I find the top of the amp gets very warm before the fan finally kicks on.
Just thought of something else: Make sure you're not running settings (especially volume) on the amp that would be ridiculous if a speaker were connected. IOW, have your power amp gain knob(s) cranked for maximum sensitivity. This is on the slight chance you're overdriving the IcePower board with the GK preamp and the IcePower is going into protect to save itself from that excessive input.
Hope some of this is helpful.
The fan is something GK added. It's supposed to kick on before the IcePower module senses an overtemp condition. Could be something's wrong with the GK temp sensor on yours. Either not mounted properly on the choke where it belongs, or not enough thermal transfer paste between the sensor and the choke, or the wire slipped off, or...
Could also be a bad solder joint somewhere on the IcePower module that causes a connection to "go away" at higher temps. I have a similar problem on mine, and I applied a half-ass workaround until I get the time to pull the board and re-flow a couple of solder joints. Before the workaround, I could let the amp warm up all on its own (no speaker load, no instrument connected), then once it was warmed up it would go in and out of protect if I connected an instrument and played it after turning up the volume, again with no speaker load.
On mine, on a hot day, say 85-90, the fan will kick on with the amp just sitting there and doing nothing. It'll start on high and then gradually come down in speed, and then maybe even shut off until the amp gets warm enough again to need it again. At 70-80 at low volume into an inefficient 8 ohm cab, the fan will kick on after about 5 minutes. I find the top of the amp gets very warm before the fan finally kicks on.
Just thought of something else: Make sure you're not running settings (especially volume) on the amp that would be ridiculous if a speaker were connected. IOW, have your power amp gain knob(s) cranked for maximum sensitivity. This is on the slight chance you're overdriving the IcePower board with the GK preamp and the IcePower is going into protect to save itself from that excessive input.
Hope some of this is helpful.
It doesn't happen with the speaker connected as far as I know because I did band practice with it and it wasn't even that warm. I believe the reason for this is that particular class D design is not stable with no load and it is probably oscillating internally causing it to warm up. It doesn't make sense that the amp should go into protect with no load on due to it being overdriven. I think there is a built in limiter that keeps the amp from clipping. Instability is the likely explanation. I found a a Invalid Link Removed which supports this hypothesis.
There is an input clip detector on the IcePower. Also there's a spec for max input voltage. These facts are the reason for the last paragraph in my last post -- the one about power amp gain setting. I'm assuming you're okay here, but checking anyway just to be sure.
If you have an active bass or are running effects that can boost the signal to the GK's input beyond what a passive bass would send it, you might also want to try (along with the above) a high(-ish) gain setting on the GK and a correspondingly low-level signal into the GK's input. This would be especially important with an input with lots of high frequency content, such as slapping or use of a distortion box, because all that instantaneous voltage way up in the treble range might cause the GK preamp to hit the IcePower input with more voltage than its input clip detector would allow.
I'll be the first to admit that the above paragraph qualifies only as thinking out loud. But it is based on the 50asx2 datasheet, and it may give you another idea or two that you can try.
Finally, the IcePower's spec for max speaker load is infinity.
If you have an active bass or are running effects that can boost the signal to the GK's input beyond what a passive bass would send it, you might also want to try (along with the above) a high(-ish) gain setting on the GK and a correspondingly low-level signal into the GK's input. This would be especially important with an input with lots of high frequency content, such as slapping or use of a distortion box, because all that instantaneous voltage way up in the treble range might cause the GK preamp to hit the IcePower input with more voltage than its input clip detector would allow.
I'll be the first to admit that the above paragraph qualifies only as thinking out loud. But it is based on the 50asx2 datasheet, and it may give you another idea or two that you can try.
Finally, the IcePower's spec for max speaker load is infinity.
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