Guild Starfire II

[PkFloydLvr]

Mustang Surly & Katthestar -

Thanks for the timely information. After about 3 -5 years of daily use my original 1969 EB-2D suffered neck and bridge stability issues - if memory is correct after ~ 45 years. The EB-2D had two pups + a baritone switch that gave some flexibility in tone, but nothing stellar compared to today's gear. (An aside: I loaned this bass to a buddy who claims he "bumped" the neck resulting in separation at the joint to the body. I've seen a number of neck repairs on EB2 and 2Ds.)

I want a semi-hollow body for a tone very different from my 1974 Ric 4001. From what I am hearing, hands-on with a Starfire is in order. I am leaning towards newer than vintage. Thanks again, folks!

 

[jmlee]

The bridge on jmlee's B-302 is yet a third type bridge used by Guild on some of the solid body basses in the past. I've heard it referred to as a "Muller" bridge. These seem to show up on the "B"-type solid bodies like jimlee's as well as sporadically on Jet Stars (the "SG-looking" ones).

It’s a terrible bridge.

 

[Mustang Surly]

It’s a terrible bridge.

I have heard that, but didn't want to disparage the design since I've never had to deal with it, personally. Is the main problem lack of adequate provision for string height adjustment? Or is it something else?

 

[dennis james]

Bought a Newark St. Starfire I less than two months ago. I've always been wary about Asian made guitars but this bass looks to be quality throughout. Love the way it looks and the sound is exactly what I was hoping for, fits in perfectly with the roots rock, rockabilly, and classic country stuff I love to play. The bi-sonic pickup is a gem. The only small complaint I would have is that as a semi hollow I was expecting it to be a little lighter than it is. It's not bad, but it's not a featherweight either. the neck is also thinner than I prefer but that's a personal thing. I forget about those things when I plug it in and hear that glorious woody tone. My three other basses are all Fender shaped objects that are probably going to be collecting dust for a while.

 

[Mustang Surly]

"The only small complaint I would have is that as a semi hollow I was expecting it to be a little lighter than it is."

A small price to pay for the center block that helps keep potential feedback from rearing its ugly head. And hey: it's no backbreaker Peavy T-40!

 

[dennis james]

"The only small complaint I would have is that as a semi hollow I was expecting it to be a little lighter than it is."

A small price to pay for the center block that helps keep potential feedback from rearing its ugly head. And hey: it's no backbreaker Peavy T-40!

"The only small complaint I would have is that as a semi hollow I was expecting it to be a little lighter than it is."

A small price to pay for the center block that helps keep potential feedback from rearing its ugly head. And hey: it's no backbreaker Peavy T-40!

10-4 0N THAT

 

[jmlee]

I have heard that, but didn't want to disparage the design since I've never had to deal with it, personally. Is the main problem lack of adequate provision for string height adjustment? Or is it something else?

There's that: you can't adjust the height of each saddle individually, so everybody has some materlal stuck under a saddle or two to get the necessary height. As well, the bridge has a 3-point support provided by two enormous screws on the sides which determine overall height and one *tiny* screw at the front which determines the tilt of the bridge. The latter screw doesn't have nearly enough threads through the metal of the bridge and is easy to strip if you don't take all the string tension off before you try to adjust it.

 

[wagdog]

I put a set of Pyramid Golds on my Starfire II and it instantly took me back to the 60s. Not sure they are going to stay because those bi-sonics sound so good with rounds too.

 

[bobyoung53]

My luthier told me that the Gibson EB basses tend to have neck issues. I know that happens to older Guilds as well. Almost all of my basses are Guilds, so take my opinion with a grain of salt.

I have a 66 EB-2C and the neck is straight, frets are perfect and it is strong, I do wish I had an EB-2D however with the added bridge pickup, but the thing plays great, is a very solid bass. I also have a 65 EB-3 and the neck is the same, the early Gibson necks are very strong nice playing necks. I've owned other Gibsons and have never had a neck problem with one. The only problem they had and it is a big one is that the headstocks tended to snap off if they were dropped or fell over, my EB-3 had a snapped off headstock repaired many years ago before I bought it, no problems with it at all.

 

[Mustang Surly]

Too bad about the functional drawbacks of the Muller bride: I think they look kinda minimal and cool. I almost pulled the trigger on a JetStar II that had one on it but wound up being spooked by negative things some people said about the bridge.

Thanks for the EB insight, bobyoung53. I've seen a lot of head stock repairs on Gibson guitars and basses: they seem to have a reputation of being particularly vulnerable to that issue. I liked the volutes Gibson put on the necks for awhile during the '70s, but can't say with any certainty how much stronger that may or may not have made them.

Gibson neck volute:

 

[Mustang Surly]

Cross-section view of a Les Paul head stock/truss-rod pocket provides some pretty striking insight into the structural factors affecting this weakness: removing too much wood right where the head stock makes a 17˚ break angle being primary among them. When you think about the tension exerted by the strings, you have to wonder why they don't do something to beef up this area.

The volute, a scarf-joint (as opposed to 1-piece) and/or a 3-5-piece (laminated) neck might help mitigate the issue.

 

[Mustang Surly]

You guys who are "on the fence": please post your impressions of whatever semi-hollow you wind up getting.

 

[PkFloydLvr]

Mustang Surly - I will post my purchase once I decide. A few days ago I drove 140 miles round trip to play a Starfire II; there is much to like, but the bottom end on this particular bass was not as clear as I had hoped. Unfortunately this was the only one available, no others to compare.

My local SA and GC stores say there is little traffic/interest in SHB basses, and seldom sell any other than special order. That makes hands on comparison difficult, and I hesitate buying an instrument without playing first. Sooo ... I will continue watching and hopefully found others to try ... willing to wait for the right one(s).

 

[Mustang Surly]

FWIW: others may differ, but I much prefer flat-wound strings on these. I use ECB-81-M D'Addario Chromes (45-65-80-100). They are higher tension than some others and I think this really helps mitigate the "floppy E-string" complaint that some people level against short-scale basses. Round wound strings will generally feel more "squirmy" on these basses than flats.

 

[red7flag]

I notice that there is a new natural Starfire II that is flamed maple. I would be curious if any of you Starfire fans have any idea how the maple sounds compared to the mahogany natural (or the other other colored mahoganies) that has been available for sometime. I notice that the price for the maple it $200.00 more. I am more interested in the tonal differences, however.

 

[Mustang Surly]

Haven't had an opportunity to play one of those, red7flag, so can't comment on any potential sound differences. I've played a vintage, MIA maple-bodied re-issue (1990s) but that's apples-and-oranges, since the tops on those were thicker, the over-all body depth thinner and the pups were Guild-Buckers, not Bi-Sonics. Pretty sure all those MIK maples will have the slightly wider nut, though (see my first post in this thread). "Blem" specimens of them show up from time to time on eBay & Reverb for under $1K.

 

[Stugilliam]

"I have an opportunity for a 1970 Gibson EB-2D (8.5/10 condition) for $1200 more than a new Starfire II. I love vintage instruments (once bought a 1969 EB-2D new - my youth is calling me!), yet your comments of potential future issues and higher prices are the same as mine."

PkFloydLvr,

I haven't a lot of experience with Gibson EBs but here's my impression/2¢, in contrast to the Starfire:

•the neck may not be as slim

•the pups will not offer as articulate tones, especially if the Guild in question is loaded with Bi-Sonic pups. Gibson bass humbuckers are often referred to as "mud-buckers" and not without reason. Whether you like that sound or not is a personal preference. In my opinion, the EB/Rivoli is more of a "one-trick pony" tone-wise, especially the single-pup ones.

•Gibson 2-point and 3-point bass bridges can have issues (mounting studs coming loose, intonation difficulties, action-setting limitations). There are replacement options (Hipshot, Babicz, to name a couple) but altering a vintage instrument can reduce its resale value, sometimes drastically.

•the Gibson EB and Epiphone Rivoli body outline is slightly different from that of the Guild Starfire (except for the very limited edition ones designated "GSR" Starfires): mostly blunter "horns/ears" on the Gibson/Epi. I prefer the look of the Guild. Your tastes may differ.

Hi, Just a old guy here with JUST MY OPINION in the sixties I was playing a Starfire I, which fell down a flight of granite steps which broke it's neck. I searched for another to no avail but I did finally run across a perfect Gibson EB-2D in sunburst with the two pickups, it was gorgeous, and did I mention that it had two pickups? In short time I realized that the neck did not feel as good as the Guild, although it looked nicer. I then noticed that I couldn't find the sound that the Guild gave me, but it had two pickups, they were less dynamic, less articulate, and just plain muddy! I continued to search for another Guild to no avail, that led me to my first of many precisions and the rest is history. Last year my wife bought me a reissue Guild Starfire II and it is as nice, maybe even a little better built and finished than my 67. It loved the few sets of strings that I tried on it but my all time, and forever string, is the LaBella Beatles Bass string. And that's that, now for my other 23 basses today is not the day!

 

[shadven]

I just ordered a new Starfire II (Cherry, it just looks right) from Sweetwater. I am a P-bass guy through and through. My number 1 is 1952 P and my b/u is a 1963 P. I love the look and sound of the Guild and I am looking for a new sound and feel. I’ll send a report after my first gig.

 

[PJ Muzikmansky]

I just ordered a new Starfire II (Cherry, it just looks right) from Sweetwater. I am a P-bass guy through and through. My number 1 is 1952 P and my b/u is a 1963 P. I love the look and sound of the Guild and I am looking for a new sound and feel. I’ll send a report after my first gig.

Shadven: anything to report?

 

[shadven]

Shadven: anything to report?

Yes. Sweetwater canceled the order “out of stock”. I found a vintage 1967 for a couple hundred dollars more. Nice thumpy woody sound that is a lot of fun to play. I’ve taken it on several gigs and it sounds great with full band (outlaw country/rock). It is so light!