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Double Bass Gut Strings: Are They Worth It To Try? (part I)
- Thread starter Kevin Hsieh
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Had a lesson with Drew Gress the other day, he had this Hawkes strung with Mittels. Gorgeous sound. I'm having doubts about guts at the moment lol.
You realize that I am allowed to hate you a little bit because of this, right? Not that I'm jealous or anything. Noooo. Of course not.
So, how was it?
You should know when I had my bass set up with mittels, I sounded just like Drew Gress. (implied sarcasm)
it was wonderful. helped me out with a lot of conceptual questions i've been mulling over. his sound is wonderful. so rich and full.
i was having doubts before. intonation-wise and technically, steel truly is just easier to get around. however, there's nothing the feel and the sound of plain gut. however, i can picture myself having that kind of sound with the mittels, which gives me something to strive for if i do go back to steel... but man.. that bass could probably sound great with any string on it.
- May 6, 2003
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- Proprietor Fifth Avenue Fret Shop. Technical Editor Bass Gear Magazine
Yes. I've said before that playing guts helped me sound less like a Spirocore player when I play them if I want to.
I say the best way to choose what type of strings you use is ease of use for your style of playing. I don't think anyone I play with notices what type of strings I use. I think five feet in front of my bass Mittels and the Gamut's sound remarkable similiar. My hands definitely prefer the Gamuts though. Ironically, I think the most "old-school" type sound i got was with Starks with really (really) high action.
Don't forget that certain basses prefer certain strings too. One of my friends here in town has some late 1800's German (I think) bass. It sounds SUPER dark with Spiro Weichs on it. I'd bet you couldn't even decern the pitch with guts.
D
Hey, just a quick question. Who got any experience with the Kuerschner guts? I did a search, but found out there isn't a lot of talk about them.
I'm looking for a plain G (and maybe a D) to go with my garbo-set and was looking at the Gamuts, but them are kind expensive to ship, so now i'm looking at alternatives closer to home
cheers HCF
I'm looking for a plain G (and maybe a D) to go with my garbo-set and was looking at the Gamuts, but them are kind expensive to ship, so now i'm looking at alternatives closer to home
cheers HCF
- May 6, 2003
- 5,272
- 160
- 64
- Disclosures
- Proprietor Fifth Avenue Fret Shop. Technical Editor Bass Gear Magazine
Phil,
I have no idea about numbers, if that's your question. I do know that when we've run into each other over the past couple years (we know each other from our days in and around Baltimore), and I've asked him about his set-up, he's joked several times about "the usual, Thomastiks cranked up beyond belief."
I have no idea about numbers, if that's your question. I do know that when we've run into each other over the past couple years (we know each other from our days in and around Baltimore), and I've asked him about his set-up, he's joked several times about "the usual, Thomastiks cranked up beyond belief."
- May 6, 2003
- 5,272
- 160
- 64
- Disclosures
- Proprietor Fifth Avenue Fret Shop. Technical Editor Bass Gear Magazine
For that reason alone, I think that playing/trying guts is very important.
I've had guts on my AS for awhile now, long enough to go through the honeymoon phase. I love the sound and feel.... that tactile experience. It's changed my approach to playing my other steel strung uprights for sure.
Guts are just a pain in the butt in terms of tuning stability. That's a real big issue......
- May 6, 2003
- 5,272
- 160
- 64
- Disclosures
- Proprietor Fifth Avenue Fret Shop. Technical Editor Bass Gear Magazine
I like quite a bit more tension too. Even with guts I was getting progressively higher tension strings to get back higher overall tension.Guts are just a pain in the butt in terms of tuning stability. That's a real big issue......
The tension thing was one of the hardest aspects of switching to guts that I had to overcome. I really had to recalibrate my right hand. The touch is totally different and guts don't like to be overplayed. They bog down and it makes it hard to get around on the instrument or play in tune.
I have to say with Garbos on the A and E, my gut G and D stay in tune pretty well (nothing like Spiros though). Interestingly, the Garbos tend to drift more than the guts. On my other bass with all gut, the tuning drifts like crazy. I got used to it but it was a challenge.
The other week, I was starting to have doubts about guts. Kevin mentioned he was considering putting Mittels or Weichs on and I sometimes miss the midrange presence of Mittels when I'm soloing. Then someone posted the Steve LaSpina video where he was demonstrating a bass in a duet with a guitar player. He had Spiros on and there was so much buzzy midrange it sounded like he was playing some kind of industrial power tool. It reminded me very viscerally of why I don't want to ever go back to that kind of sound. All I hear is the metal grinding against the bass and now that I'm attuned to it, I hear it EVERYWHERE. Recordings I used to enjoy, I don't like as much because I hear that metal sound of steel strings clanking against the fingerboard.
The thing that cemented it was my gig last Saturday. I have the sound of gut (and/or Garbos) in my head now. Everything I played sounded the way I wanted it to sound. And I'm so used to physically playing guts I can pull off just about anything I want to technically without strain or effort. I'm so invested spiritually and emotionally in guts, I don't think I could ever go back to Spiros.
mark
I have to say with Garbos on the A and E, my gut G and D stay in tune pretty well (nothing like Spiros though). Interestingly, the Garbos tend to drift more than the guts. On my other bass with all gut, the tuning drifts like crazy. I got used to it but it was a challenge.
The other week, I was starting to have doubts about guts. Kevin mentioned he was considering putting Mittels or Weichs on and I sometimes miss the midrange presence of Mittels when I'm soloing. Then someone posted the Steve LaSpina video where he was demonstrating a bass in a duet with a guitar player. He had Spiros on and there was so much buzzy midrange it sounded like he was playing some kind of industrial power tool. It reminded me very viscerally of why I don't want to ever go back to that kind of sound. All I hear is the metal grinding against the bass and now that I'm attuned to it, I hear it EVERYWHERE. Recordings I used to enjoy, I don't like as much because I hear that metal sound of steel strings clanking against the fingerboard.
The thing that cemented it was my gig last Saturday. I have the sound of gut (and/or Garbos) in my head now. Everything I played sounded the way I wanted it to sound. And I'm so used to physically playing guts I can pull off just about anything I want to technically without strain or effort. I'm so invested spiritually and emotionally in guts, I don't think I could ever go back to Spiros.
mark
I'm in that same space now. In the case of Steve's vids, I had to separate the tone of the bass from his marvelous playing. It does nothing to detract from my enjoyment of the La Spina clips, or the many other steel players I admire. I'm just not hearing my own bass that way at the moment. As a matter of fact, I haven't heard my own sound that way in awhile, which probably explains my voyage through various "gutlike" strings to my ultimate resolution with the Gamuts.
I spent a lot of time on Spiros, and I could probably go back to them at any point and be very happy, if I had to for any reason.
Don't wanna, though....
I spent a lot of time on Spiros, and I could probably go back to them at any point and be very happy, if I had to for any reason.
Don't wanna, though....
Calivox,
I noticed the same thing. I end up tuning the E and A Garbos more often than the guts on the higher strings. In fact, the last three days I haven't had to tough the D and G but have had to tweak the Garbos each time before practice.
I noticed the same thing. I end up tuning the E and A Garbos more often than the guts on the higher strings. In fact, the last three days I haven't had to tough the D and G but have had to tweak the Garbos each time before practice.
Same here! The Evahs seem to drift at least as much as the Gamuts do. Not much in either case... very manageable.
The drift in the Gamuts is very predictable.... going from a warm Maui outdoors to an air conditioned recording studio, the pitch goes up a coupla cents on both strings. I have to keep an ear on it for the first couple of takes, then they settle in and remain very stable.
The drift in the Gamuts is very predictable.... going from a warm Maui outdoors to an air conditioned recording studio, the pitch goes up a coupla cents on both strings. I have to keep an ear on it for the first couple of takes, then they settle in and remain very stable.
I just re-read my rather scathing comments on Steve LaSpina's vid. Just for clarity, my comments were limited to the sound of the bass and not on Steve's playing. Steve is one of the greats.
As for tuning. I usually have to tune once I get to a place and the strings stay pretty stable after that. To be fair, it has been extremely mild here lately so there hasn't been very much of a temperature change outside to inside. We're moving into winter now and that will change dramatically shortly. The lows today were in the 30s and I don't think it went above 45. I actually drove through a snowstorm in western Maryland. It was raining and it turned to snow. It was laying on the side of the road. Mid-October is really early for snow around here. This doesn't bode well for this winter.
mark
As for tuning. I usually have to tune once I get to a place and the strings stay pretty stable after that. To be fair, it has been extremely mild here lately so there hasn't been very much of a temperature change outside to inside. We're moving into winter now and that will change dramatically shortly. The lows today were in the 30s and I don't think it went above 45. I actually drove through a snowstorm in western Maryland. It was raining and it turned to snow. It was laying on the side of the road. Mid-October is really early for snow around here. This doesn't bode well for this winter.
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